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questionseverything

(11,836 posts)
41. yes there was a change after they were outted
Sun Sep 6, 2015, 12:18 PM
Sep 2015

The move also follows a change in federal policy on Thursday in which the US department of justice said that agencies under its aegis would have to obtain a specific warrant to use Stingrays. But this change in policy does not affect local police forces or state-level agencies, where the use of cell-site simulators and other devices is still shrouded in secrecy, and requires only a low-level court order called a PEN register, or “trap-and-trace” order, to grant police permission for its use.

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Pen Register Act

The Electronic Communications Privacy Act (ECPA) was passed in 1986 (Pub. L. No. 99-508, 100 Stat. 1848). There were three main provisions or Titles to the ECPA. Title III created the Pen Register Act, which included restrictions on private and law enforcement uses of pen registers. Private parties were generally restricted from using them unless they met one of the exceptions, which included an exception for the business providing the communication if it needed to do so to ensure the proper functioning of its business.

For law enforcement agencies to get a pen register approved for surveillance, they must get a court order from a judge. According to 18 U.S.C. § 3123(a)(1), the "court shall enter an ex parte order authorizing the installation and use of a pen register or trap and trace device anywhere within the United States, if the court finds that the attorney for the Government has certified to the court that the information likely to be obtained by such installation and use is relevant to an ongoing criminal investigation".[6] Thus, a government attorney only needs to certify that information will "likely" be obtained in relation to an 'ongoing criminal investigation'. This is the lowest requirement for receiving a court order under any of the ECPA's three titles. This is because in Smith v. Maryland, the Supreme Court ruled that use of a pen register does not constitute a search. The ruling held that only the content of a conversation should receive full constitutional protection under the right to privacy; since pen registers do not intercept conversation, they do not pose as much threat to this right.

Some have argued that the government should be required to present "specific and articulable facts" showing that the information to be gathered is relevant and material to an ongoing investigation. This is the standard used by Title II of the ECPA with regard to the contents of stored communications. Others, such as Daniel J. Solove, Petricia Bellia, and Dierdre Mulligan, believe that probable cause and a warrant should be necessary.[7][8][9] Paul Ohm argues that standard of proof should be replaced/reworked for electronic communications altogether.[10]

The Pen Register Act did not include an exclusionary rule. While there were civil remedies for violations of the Act, evidence gained in violation of the Act can still be used against a defendant in court. There have also been calls for congress to add an exclusionary rule to the Pen Register Act, as this would make it more analogous to traditional Fourth Amendment protections. The penalty for violating the Pen Register Act is a misdemeanor, and it carries a prison sentence of not more than one year.[11]

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the article says content can be extracted with the new devices so smith vs maryland should not apply

much also hinges on wether a pen trace is part of an ON GOING investigation or a fishing trip

the fbi knows there are problems with the use , i am guessing that is why the secrecy

the defendant still has a right to know about all evidence the state has against then....the fbi conspiring with local police to deny the defendants right to challenge is the illegal part

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

bookmarked daleanime Sep 2015 #1
Talk about police state in the name of Democracy . orpupilofnature57 Sep 2015 #2
This story has gotten notice here over the past few days. MADem Sep 2015 #3
And it deservedly just got some more coverage. Live and Learn Sep 2015 #12
Because the assertion was that the story is getting ignored. MADem Sep 2015 #16
Appreciate the links. Thanks. Nt SouthernProgressive Sep 2015 #25
Yes many people post duplicates and then are shocked when the duplicates are ignored. Doctor_J Sep 2015 #22
I think this explains it underthematrix Sep 2015 #4
So you viewed "1984" as a vision devoutly to be wished? WinkyDink Sep 2015 #8
We're all guilty until proven innocent. MerryBlooms Sep 2015 #9
I read 1984. The technology you're so outraged about underthematrix Sep 2015 #14
sounds like to you the Constitution is "just a piece of paper" questionseverything Sep 2015 #20
My point was the cases should be reviewed. And whatever evidence the defense is legally entitled underthematrix Sep 2015 #29
The ones doing the spying are also "shitty self-absorbed ignorant people", not benevolent overlords. arcane1 Sep 2015 #26
" i believe we need surveillance because we as mericans are a shitty self-absorbed ignorant people." neverforget Sep 2015 #35
It's really not that silly. This is not the level of surveillance that is required. underthematrix Sep 2015 #36
jaysus. what are you even doing here? this is wholly indefensible. cali Sep 2015 #10
Absolutely not,.. PosterChild Sep 2015 #28
yes there was a change after they were outted questionseverything Sep 2015 #41
Thanks for the information (nt) PosterChild Sep 2015 #43
And you have no problem with the fact that it is unconstitutional? Live and Learn Sep 2015 #11
Those who would give up essential Liberty... discntnt_irny_srcsm Sep 2015 #17
I understand. Tell me how you define liberty? underthematrix Sep 2015 #31
Certainly not by people listening to my private correspondence. nt Live and Learn Sep 2015 #32
You're on the Internet, which means you are being watched right now. underthematrix Sep 2015 #33
On a message board, duh. Live and Learn Sep 2015 #34
the Constitution is the law of the land questionseverything Sep 2015 #21
uhhh...yeah Doctor_J Sep 2015 #23
That post certainly explains your screen name truebluegreen Sep 2015 #27
What the fuck is this shit right here. Brickbat Sep 2015 #39
.... A HERETIC I AM Sep 2015 #50
So, you're just going to lay this at the feet of atheists/agnostics/nones? AtheistCrusader Sep 2015 #47
What.the.fuck??? kdmorris Sep 2015 #48
Um, what the actual fuck? truebrit71 Sep 2015 #49
How about putting them on the oligarchs, ceos and boards, bankers, that's who the real criminals are Dont call me Shirley Sep 2015 #52
Jesus fucking Christ kath Sep 2015 #5
yes. It's appalling. cali Sep 2015 #6
There is no way in hell that is the only law enforcement agency using those things illegally. n/t jtuck004 Sep 2015 #7
It's not. As I said upthread, this isn't the first time MADem Sep 2015 #18
chicago pd has been caught using them mopinko Sep 2015 #19
Well, most of the time it's use can be hidden. dougolat Sep 2015 #13
K&R... spanone Sep 2015 #15
Cali, might I suggest you alter the title a bit davidpdx Sep 2015 #24
Yep, cops would set those up in parking lots at Phish shows, and if someone, say, texted their buddy Warren DeMontague Sep 2015 #30
K&R for visibility. nt Mnemosyne Sep 2015 #37
Verrrrry interesting. Octafish Sep 2015 #38
But stu-pid. (nt) PosterChild Sep 2015 #44
Amazing technology, though. Octafish Sep 2015 #45
evidently they can capture content too,from the article,, questionseverything Sep 2015 #46
The content would be . .. PosterChild Sep 2015 #54
Super secret spy technology? PosterChild Sep 2015 #53
k&R Mbrow Sep 2015 #40
k & r & thanks! n/t wildbilln864 Sep 2015 #42
I'm reading (OK, listening) to "Rise of the Warrior Cop" A HERETIC I AM Sep 2015 #51
The stingray. Cops would set those up in the parking lots of Phish shows Warren DeMontague Sep 2015 #55
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