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In reply to the discussion: Russia has started bombing ISIS/coordinating with Syrian gov. [View all]leveymg
(36,418 posts)64. Even before the first shot was fired in Daraa on 3/18/11, the opposition was armed
The first lethal confrontations that sparked the Syrian civil war were a series of armed clashes, in which eleven died. What is usually ignored is that of that number, seven Syrian policemen were killed. The first round of violence was hardly the massacre of peaceful democracy demonstrators that is usually portrayed.
The Wiki timeline shows the first fatalities of the Syrian civil war occurred on March 18, 2011 in Daraa, on the southern border with Jordan, which had long been a center of anti-regime activity.
Here are the events,, starting on March 11 that are missing from the official Wiki page:
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/03/11/us-syria-iraq-idUSTRE72A3MI20110311
World | Fri Mar 11, 2011 9:37am EST
Related: World
Syria says seizes weapons smuggled from Iraq
DAMASCUS
Syria said Friday security forces seized a large shipment of weapons and explosives and night-vision goggles this week in a truck coming from Iraq.
The official news agency SANA said the shipment, intercepted at the Tanaf border crossing Monday, was intended "for use in actions that affect Syria's internal security and spread unrest and chaos." (Tanaf is the southernmost border crossing with Iraq)
It did not say how many weapons were seized. But published pictures showing dozens of grenades and pistols as well as rifles and ammunition belts.
The agency quoted the driver of the truck as saying the weapons had been loaded in Baghdad, and that he had been told he would be paid $5,000 to deliver them in Syria.
The first news report that the demonstrators were armed in the first fatal clashes with police on March 18, and that seven police were killed on March 20 was in Israel National News:
http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/143026#.Vgw7925WKPE
Syria: Seven Police Killed, Buildings Torched in Protests
Continued protests in Syria claim lives of seven police and four protesters, and result in burning a courthouse and Baath Party HQ in Daraa.
By Gabe Kahn.
First Publish: 3/21/2011, 11:05 AM / Last Update: 3/21/2011, 11:17 AM
Seven police officers and at least four demonstrators in Syria have been killed in continuing violent clashes that erupted in the southern town of Daraa last Thursday.
The clashes came amidst growing political tension in the Muslim nation, whose Presidents and many senior officials have always come from Syria's influential Shia Alawite minority, when twenty students were arrested for spray-painting anti-government graffiti on a wall.
On Friday police opened fire on armed protesters killing four and injuring as many as 100 others. According to one witness, who spoke to the press on condition of anonymity, "They used live ammunition immediately -- no tear gas or anything else."
At the funerals of two of those killed opposition leaders handed authorities a list of demands, which included the release of political prisoners. In an uncharacteristic gesture intended to ease tensions the government offered to release the detained students, but seven police officers were killed, and the Baath Party Headquarters and courthouse were torched, in renewed violence on Sunday.
The latest clashes occurred after unconfirmed reports that two more protesters had been killed began to circulate. According to witnesses, Syrian security forces have encircled Daraa to impede more protesters from reaching the city. Anti-government protests are rare in Syria and have traditionally been brutally put down, but Daraa is not the only town where protests have occurred.
Syria: Seven Police Killed, Buildings Torched in Protests
Continued protests in Syria claim lives of seven police and four protesters, and result in burning a courthouse and Baath Party HQ in Daraa.
By Gabe Kahn.
First Publish: 3/21/2011, 11:05 AM / Last Update: 3/21/2011, 11:17 AM
Seven police officers and at least four demonstrators in Syria have been killed in continuing violent clashes that erupted in the southern town of Daraa last Thursday.
The clashes came amidst growing political tension in the Muslim nation, whose Presidents and many senior officials have always come from Syria's influential Shia Alawite minority, when twenty students were arrested for spray-painting anti-government graffiti on a wall.
On Friday police opened fire on armed protesters killing four and injuring as many as 100 others. According to one witness, who spoke to the press on condition of anonymity, "They used live ammunition immediately -- no tear gas or anything else."
At the funerals of two of those killed opposition leaders handed authorities a list of demands, which included the release of political prisoners. In an uncharacteristic gesture intended to ease tensions the government offered to release the detained students, but seven police officers were killed, and the Baath Party Headquarters and courthouse were torched, in renewed violence on Sunday.
The latest clashes occurred after unconfirmed reports that two more protesters had been killed began to circulate. According to witnesses, Syrian security forces have encircled Daraa to impede more protesters from reaching the city. Anti-government protests are rare in Syria and have traditionally been brutally put down, but Daraa is not the only town where protests have occurred.
The "official Wiki does not reveal the essential facts that the Dara'a protests were shootouts by armed groups of rampaging demonstrators and police:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_uprising_phase_of_the_Syrian_Civil_War
Minor protests calling for government reforms began in January, and continued into March. On 3 February, a "Day of Rage" was called for by activists in Syria via the websites Facebook and Twitter, to be held on Friday, 4 February.[19] This did not result in protests in Syria.
Civil uprising (JanuaryJuly 2011)
March 2011 unrest
Main article: Timeline of the Syrian civil war (JanuaryApril 2011)
Demonstration in Homs against Assad.
The unrest began on 15 March in Damascus and Aleppo, yet in the southern city of Daraa, sometimes called the "Cradle of the Revolution",[20] protests had been triggered on 6 March by the incarceration and torture of 15 young students, who were arrested for writing anti-government graffiti in the city,[21][22] "The people want the fall of the regime".[23] Demonstrators clashed with local police, and confrontations escalated on 18 March after Friday prayers. With thousands protesting, the clashes resulted in several civilian deaths. On 20 March, a mob burned down the Ba'ath Party headquarters and other public buildings. Security forces quickly responded, firing live ammunition at crowds, and attacking the focal points of the demonstrations. The two-day assault resulted in the deaths of fifteen protesters.[24]
Meanwhile, minor protests occurred elsewhere in the country. Protesters demanded the release of political prisoners, the abolition of Syria's 48-year emergency law, more freedoms, and an end to pervasive government corruption.[25] The events led to a "Friday of Dignity" on 18 March, when large-scale protests broke out in several cities, including Banias, Damascus, al-Hasakah, Daraa, Deir az-Zor, and Hama. Police responded to the protests with tear gas, water cannons, and beatings. At least 6 people were killed and many others injured.[26]
On 25 March, mass protests spread nationwide, as demonstrators emerged after Friday prayers.[24] Over 100,000 people reportedly marched in Daraa,[27] but at least 20 protesters were reportedly killed. Protests also spread to other Syrian cities, including Homs, Hama, Baniyas, Jasim, Aleppo, Damascus and Latakia. Over 70 protesters in total were reported dead.[28]
Demonstration in Douma, a Damascus suburb, against the Assad government on 8 April 2011
Crackdown
Main article: Syrian reactions to the Syrian civil war
Riot police in Damascus
Even before the uprising began, the Syrian government conducted numerous arrests of protesters, political activists and human rights campaigners, many of whom were labeled "terrorists" by the Assad government. In early February, authorities arrested several activists, including political leaders Ghassan al-Najar,[29] Abbas Abbas,[30] and Adnan Mustafa.[31]
The police often responded to the protests violently, not only using water cannons and tear gas, but also beating protesters and firing live ammunition.[32]
As the uprising began, the Syrian government waged a campaign of arrests that captured tens of thousands of people, according to lawyers and activists in Syria and human rights groups. In response to the uprising, Syrian law had been changed to allow the police and any of the nation's 18 security forces to detain a suspect for eight days without a warrant. Arrests focused on two groups: political activists, and men and boys from the towns that the Syrian Army would start to besiege in April.[33] Many of those detained experienced ill-treatment. Many detainees were cramped in tight rooms and were given limited resources, and some were beaten, electrically jolted, or debilitated. At least 27 torture centers run by Syrian intelligence agencies were revealed by Human Rights Watch on 3 July 2012.[34]
President Assad has characterized the opposition as armed terrorist groups with Islamist "takfiri" extremist motives, portraying himself as the last guarantee for a secular form of government.[35] Early in the month of April, a large deployment of security forces prevented tent encampments in Latakia. Blockades were set up in several cities to prevent the movement of protests. Despite the crackdown, widespread protests continued throughout the month in Daraa, Baniyas, Al-Qamishli, Homs, Douma and Harasta.[36]
Concessions
Main article: Timeline of the Syrian civil war (JanuaryApril 2011)
Opposition demonstration in Baniyas
During March and April, the Syrian government, hoping to alleviate the unrest, offered political reforms and policy changes. Authorities shortened mandatory army conscription,[37] and in an apparent attempt to reduce corruption, fired the governor of Daraa.[38] The government announced it would release political prisoners, cut taxes, raise the salaries of public sector workers, provide more press freedoms, and increase job opportunities.[39] Many of these announced reforms were never implemented.[40]
Civil uprising (JanuaryJuly 2011)
March 2011 unrest
Main article: Timeline of the Syrian civil war (JanuaryApril 2011)
Demonstration in Homs against Assad.
The unrest began on 15 March in Damascus and Aleppo, yet in the southern city of Daraa, sometimes called the "Cradle of the Revolution",[20] protests had been triggered on 6 March by the incarceration and torture of 15 young students, who were arrested for writing anti-government graffiti in the city,[21][22] "The people want the fall of the regime".[23] Demonstrators clashed with local police, and confrontations escalated on 18 March after Friday prayers. With thousands protesting, the clashes resulted in several civilian deaths. On 20 March, a mob burned down the Ba'ath Party headquarters and other public buildings. Security forces quickly responded, firing live ammunition at crowds, and attacking the focal points of the demonstrations. The two-day assault resulted in the deaths of fifteen protesters.[24]
Meanwhile, minor protests occurred elsewhere in the country. Protesters demanded the release of political prisoners, the abolition of Syria's 48-year emergency law, more freedoms, and an end to pervasive government corruption.[25] The events led to a "Friday of Dignity" on 18 March, when large-scale protests broke out in several cities, including Banias, Damascus, al-Hasakah, Daraa, Deir az-Zor, and Hama. Police responded to the protests with tear gas, water cannons, and beatings. At least 6 people were killed and many others injured.[26]
On 25 March, mass protests spread nationwide, as demonstrators emerged after Friday prayers.[24] Over 100,000 people reportedly marched in Daraa,[27] but at least 20 protesters were reportedly killed. Protests also spread to other Syrian cities, including Homs, Hama, Baniyas, Jasim, Aleppo, Damascus and Latakia. Over 70 protesters in total were reported dead.[28]
Demonstration in Douma, a Damascus suburb, against the Assad government on 8 April 2011
Crackdown
Main article: Syrian reactions to the Syrian civil war
Riot police in Damascus
Even before the uprising began, the Syrian government conducted numerous arrests of protesters, political activists and human rights campaigners, many of whom were labeled "terrorists" by the Assad government. In early February, authorities arrested several activists, including political leaders Ghassan al-Najar,[29] Abbas Abbas,[30] and Adnan Mustafa.[31]
The police often responded to the protests violently, not only using water cannons and tear gas, but also beating protesters and firing live ammunition.[32]
As the uprising began, the Syrian government waged a campaign of arrests that captured tens of thousands of people, according to lawyers and activists in Syria and human rights groups. In response to the uprising, Syrian law had been changed to allow the police and any of the nation's 18 security forces to detain a suspect for eight days without a warrant. Arrests focused on two groups: political activists, and men and boys from the towns that the Syrian Army would start to besiege in April.[33] Many of those detained experienced ill-treatment. Many detainees were cramped in tight rooms and were given limited resources, and some were beaten, electrically jolted, or debilitated. At least 27 torture centers run by Syrian intelligence agencies were revealed by Human Rights Watch on 3 July 2012.[34]
President Assad has characterized the opposition as armed terrorist groups with Islamist "takfiri" extremist motives, portraying himself as the last guarantee for a secular form of government.[35] Early in the month of April, a large deployment of security forces prevented tent encampments in Latakia. Blockades were set up in several cities to prevent the movement of protests. Despite the crackdown, widespread protests continued throughout the month in Daraa, Baniyas, Al-Qamishli, Homs, Douma and Harasta.[36]
Concessions
Main article: Timeline of the Syrian civil war (JanuaryApril 2011)
Opposition demonstration in Baniyas
During March and April, the Syrian government, hoping to alleviate the unrest, offered political reforms and policy changes. Authorities shortened mandatory army conscription,[37] and in an apparent attempt to reduce corruption, fired the governor of Daraa.[38] The government announced it would release political prisoners, cut taxes, raise the salaries of public sector workers, provide more press freedoms, and increase job opportunities.[39] Many of these announced reforms were never implemented.[40]
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I'm not sure I am unhappy about all of this. I think we should let the Russian's own it.
stevenleser
Sep 2015
#1
Your posts are a rapidly accelerating gish gallop of unfocused points and accusations.
stevenleser
Sep 2015
#22
As always, trying to mischaracterize other folks posts laughing at your lack of logic
stevenleser
Sep 2015
#32
you were an apologist for Gaddafi and now for Assad. And for the homophobic fascist Putin
uhnope
Sep 2015
#113
It's stunning how people refuse to admit Bush started this. It would be too hard to
bettyellen
Sep 2015
#37
For some folks, when the truth doesn't suit their agenda, it's OK to just make stuff up.
stevenleser
Sep 2015
#39
I'm not the one who can't get right the group that started the Iraq war. You've changed it several
stevenleser
Sep 2015
#47
You need to calm down. We've seen dozens of posts here laying this all at HRC and BO's feet with no
bettyellen
Sep 2015
#56
Happy? angry? You flatter yourself. And babble on about the east as if someone
bettyellen
Sep 2015
#69
And without a point. Reread that persons posts and see if you can detect an overall
stevenleser
Sep 2015
#82
The point is to derail towards some imaginary conversation they'd prefer to have.
bettyellen
Oct 2015
#125
"Russia is bombing the fuck out of opponents to the brutal dictator Assad"
Jesus Malverde
Sep 2015
#92
you think it's funny that moderate opponents are being slaughtered and you call them terrorists?
uhnope
Sep 2015
#97
We did a lot more than just train the rebels - we flew bombing missions just like Russia and
karynnj
Sep 2015
#5
Even before the first shot was fired in Daraa on 3/18/11, the opposition was armed
leveymg
Sep 2015
#64
Thank you for dissecting the convenient narrative of all this all began.
Comrade Grumpy
Sep 2015
#114
Yes, take it with our blessing. What will be interesting going forward is...
stevenleser
Sep 2015
#28
Russia is there to shore up Assad. There's little sign they're going after ISIS as opposed
geek tragedy
Sep 2015
#66
most governments will try to maintain power when faced with violent revolution.
killbotfactory
Oct 2015
#133
Not only Congress, but the American people as well. Some of us have "selective" memories, or....
Tarheel_Dem
Sep 2015
#80