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pnwmom

(110,176 posts)

139. An HUD apartment isn't like a bar that you can choose to go to.

Fri Nov 13, 2015, 06:46 AM

Nov 2015

People with means to get a private apartment or house can choose to live in one with clean air. People who are dependent on HUD housing should also be able to breathe clean air.

Anyone who smokes can do so outside. The right of children and other non-smokers to breathe clean air trumps the right of smokers to smoke indoors.

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So HUD is angling to ban smoking in public housing? What the Fuck?? [View all] Stinky The Clown Nov 2015 OP

As a former smoker... VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #1

No, smoking is already banned in most common spaces Fumesucker Nov 2015 #114

Problem: In 2 CA cities you can't smoke on public property, even outside. Eleanors38 Nov 2015 #193

Message auto-removed Name removed Nov 2015 #253

This not the first time the non Smoking Wellstone ruled Nov 2015 #2

This isnt why they hate liberals. They hate liberals because liberals dont hate Black people randys1 Nov 2015 #3

or Hillary Clinton!!! VanillaRhapsody Nov 2015 #118

Isn't Castro in charge of HUD? yeoman6987 Nov 2015 #128

I heard him being interviewed about it yesterday. Tanuki Nov 2015 #198

I don't know how people survived the 50-60 generations yeoman6987 Nov 2015 #209

a lot didn't and died from lung cancer and emphema KittyWampus Nov 2015 #232

You mean like: "How come you're following the recommendations of the CDC pnwmom Nov 2015 #203

I was just on a call about that this afternoon KamaAina Nov 2015 #4

Heh! madinmaryland Nov 2015 #40

Julian Castro and I have you on Ignore KamaAina Nov 2015 #90

Someone brought up on the call that many people with mental illness smoke to self-medicate. KamaAina Nov 2015 #181

I agree, this is ridiculous. cwydro Nov 2015 #5

Yeah it's so ridiculous that poor children whose parents are non-smokers pnwmom Nov 2015 #17

HVAC systems are not set up that way. former9thward Nov 2015 #62

The research shows that they are. Darn facts! pnwmom Nov 2015 #78

I guess you didn't read your link. former9thward Nov 2015 #123

It's better research than the nothing you posted. Please demonstrate pnwmom Nov 2015 #124

Oh so you want me to post drawings of HVAC systems in buildings former9thward Nov 2015 #125

No. Where's the research showing that seepage isn't a problem ? pnwmom Nov 2015 #126

Hell, "seepage" is a problem after eating Mexican food. Flammable, too. Eleanors38 Nov 2015 #195

The CDC and the American Cancer Society don't say people shouldn't be eating pnwmom Nov 2015 #196

And that's why you can never, EVER smell the cooking of your neighbors from your own apartment. MADem Nov 2015 #177

I can smell cooking from my neighbors and I don't live in an apartment. former9thward Nov 2015 #212

You wouldn't want to live next to a meth lab for that reason, either. MADem Nov 2015 #213

Just remember - every law is backed up by a gun. TampaAnimusVortex Nov 2015 #63

Second hand smoke also kills people. n/t pnwmom Nov 2015 #204

Says nothing related to my comment. TampaAnimusVortex Nov 2015 #224

Absurd. hifiguy Nov 2015 #6

Do you disagree with all non-smoking laws? Or do you just think pnwmom Nov 2015 #19

Public places are one thing. hifiguy Nov 2015 #30

You shouldn't be able to send your smoke into the apartment next door. pnwmom Nov 2015 #37

I have never smoked a cigarette in my life. hifiguy Nov 2015 #38

Are you against no-smoking laws in the workplace, too? pnwmom Nov 2015 #137

Don't you risk a dual standard with a rule like this? LittleBlue Nov 2015 #133

People with the means can rent apartments or houses where they can breathe clean air. pnwmom Nov 2015 #136

If you had it your way you would ban smoking except in the bottom of the Grand Canyon LOL snooper2 Nov 2015 #168

If you had your way you'd allow smoking in the maternity wing of a hospital. Especially pnwmom Nov 2015 #183

negative, I go for the common sense approach- snooper2 Nov 2015 #186

I go for the scientific approach. Both the Center for Disease Control pnwmom Nov 2015 #187

So when I smoked pot in my apartment for YEARS before buying a house snooper2 Nov 2015 #188

If my apartment were full of smoke, yes, I'd complain. I have asthma pnwmom Nov 2015 #190

and vapor right? snooper2 Nov 2015 #191

I don't know. As I understand it, different vapors differ in their composition. nt pnwmom Nov 2015 #194

I agree get the red out Nov 2015 #156

Economically disadvantaged non-smokers are in the worst position kcr Nov 2015 #225

I think the guy in the next apartment has a right to a smoke free residence Travis_0004 Nov 2015 #47

The list of legal activities... NCTraveler Nov 2015 #50

As a landlord I'm perfectly in my rights making no-smoking a condition of the lease onenote Nov 2015 #83

I'm a home owner who rents out our home... TipTok Nov 2015 #166

So is firearm ownership in many areas madville Nov 2015 #80

Better check Doe v. Wilmington Housing Authority.... Eleanors38 Nov 2015 #197

Not true loyalsister Nov 2015 #211

poor people suffer from asthma at extremely elevated levels compared geek tragedy Nov 2015 #7

I work with several HUD grants that provide housing upaloopa Nov 2015 #8

or walk outside to smoke maxsolomon Nov 2015 #39

They wouldn't need to deny housing to a smoker. But they could legally ban smoking indoors.n/t pnwmom Nov 2015 #138

Children, especially, are at risk. If people are sharing common air ducts, pnwmom Nov 2015 #9

+1 HuckleB Nov 2015 #61

I second that. As one who's lived in multi-unit housing and raccoon Nov 2015 #135

Yeah, friends who lived "communally" never allowed indoor smoking. HuckleB Nov 2015 #179

It's unenforceable. panader0 Nov 2015 #10

unfortunately, it is... getagrip_already Nov 2015 #13

The smoke DOES find its way into other units. That's the problem. nt pnwmom Nov 2015 #25

that's not the point maxsolomon Nov 2015 #42

Not allowing processed meats or trans fats would 'encourage healthy behavior', too. Sound good? X_Digger Nov 2015 #107

You're must have missed out on the trans fats. RichVRichV Nov 2015 #121

Wellness initiatives are very big in Public Housing. maxsolomon Nov 2015 #180

When you eat processed food you're not putting people in the next apartment at risk. pnwmom Nov 2015 #205

Actually it is enforceable loyalsister Nov 2015 #208

I am ok with this. Smoking drunks burn down home. The two family members i have who live in kelliekat44 Nov 2015 #11

It's all about controlling the choices of others The Straight Story Nov 2015 #12

It's all about allowing non-smokers, many of whom are children, to breathe clean air. pnwmom Nov 2015 #15

My body, my choice mentalsolstice Nov 2015 #73

Like, uh, I dunno The Straight Story Nov 2015 #76

An HUD apartment isn't like a bar that you can choose to go to. pnwmom Nov 2015 #139

Right you are. beevul Nov 2015 #82

Yep. People don't want others doing a 'sin' they don't approve of. It's like a religion to them The Straight Story Nov 2015 #85

Well said Sir. beevul Nov 2015 #87

Indoor air pollution and asthma affect poor people the most. pnwmom Nov 2015 #140

Are you opposed to vaping, then? Eleanors38 Nov 2015 #199

I don't know. It would depend on what the vapor contained and whether it pnwmom Nov 2015 #200

Classic social libertarian vs social authoritarian debate topic. NutmegYankee Nov 2015 #14

"Their" indoor air is being shared by non-smokers, including children. n/t pnwmom Nov 2015 #16

So you believe that it can be banned in any home with children? NutmegYankee Nov 2015 #18

If you OWN the home, smoke yourself sick maxsolomon Nov 2015 #21

No. Only in multi-unit buildings where the air pollution can affect other units. pnwmom Nov 2015 #22

You based your reply on "For the Children™" NutmegYankee Nov 2015 #60

I don't think anyone, parent or not, should be smoking inside a multi-unit building. nt pnwmom Nov 2015 #79

This isn't "their own home". It's owned by all of us and rented to poor people cheaply... lumberjack_jeff Nov 2015 #36

It's their own homes, just like all other renters. Gormy Cuss Nov 2015 #54

Owning a dog is also legal. lumberjack_jeff Nov 2015 #57

Tenants have rights too but that's beside the point. Gormy Cuss Nov 2015 #59

Smoking is always choice loyalsister Nov 2015 #210

Addiction: it's what's for dinner. n/t Gormy Cuss Nov 2015 #249

I've been there loyalsister Nov 2015 #251

Again, it's addiction not choice Gormy Cuss Nov 2015 #254

Think again! DawgHouse Nov 2015 #148

Landlords can opt to make the properties they lease smoke-free onenote Nov 2015 #86

Yes, but for very low income tenants it's not a simple choice of moving elsewhere. Gormy Cuss Nov 2015 #117

You can smoke (and spend money on smoking).. TipTok Nov 2015 #172

The same thing is true of low income tenants with asthma or with children. pnwmom Nov 2015 #206

I just love authoritarians on DU. Gormy Cuss Nov 2015 #248

I just love air-polluters on DU. n/t pnwmom Nov 2015 #255

Or they can step outside to smoke n/t kcr Nov 2015 #226

Sure, but HUD isn't in the business of increasing homelessness Gormy Cuss Nov 2015 #252

So what do libertarians do when they have a problem with smoke wafting in to their unit? Hassin Bin Sober Nov 2015 #53

I don't know, I'm not a libertarian. NutmegYankee Nov 2015 #64

This is standard for market-rate rental housing. maxsolomon Nov 2015 #20

And poor children need just as clean air to breathe as middle and upper income children. n/t pnwmom Nov 2015 #23

you and i agree on everything, pnwmom! maxsolomon Nov 2015 #26

Agree. nt lumberjack_jeff Nov 2015 #27

"Shared air intruding in other apartments" Stinky The Clown Nov 2015 #24

And most private apartment buildings have these rules already. pnwmom Nov 2015 #29

"Research has shown that smoke travels through air ducts and seeps through walls..." beevul Nov 2015 #130

Many private apartments have gone "non-smoking" too. MADem Nov 2015 #159

Here's a real-world implementation story: maxsolomon Nov 2015 #28

Thanks! Seattle has always been at the forefront of smoking regulation. pnwmom Nov 2015 #32

It would be better if they DID smoke outside but I'd never approve a law forbiding it. BlueJazz Nov 2015 #31

What about the children who live in the unit next door and have to breathe that dirty air? pnwmom Nov 2015 #34

Yes they do. Actually they deserve a lot more. I'm torn between both sides but I have to .. BlueJazz Nov 2015 #67

what makes them different than market rate renters? maxsolomon Nov 2015 #35

I don't approve of the No smoking rule for them either. BlueJazz Nov 2015 #70

Its not their place Travis_0004 Nov 2015 #48

Keep in mind, I'm just saying how I would rule. What others do is their own right. BlueJazz Nov 2015 #71

It isn't their place... TipTok Nov 2015 #174

Tobacco is slowly dying as an addiction tularetom Nov 2015 #33

They will write citations... Jesus Malverde Nov 2015 #149

"...a cancer on our society..." thucythucy Nov 2015 #171

If they catch you they evict you. Hatchling Nov 2015 #164

I am a little torn by this. I don't like the paternalism in telling people what they can or cannot smirkymonkey Nov 2015 #41

If you are renting an appartment I think the owner has the right to doc03 Nov 2015 #43

I own two rentals. Both are non smoking. But my tenants have a choice of where to live Stinky The Clown Nov 2015 #46

Public housing is built with taxpayers money. I don't want people smoking in an doc03 Nov 2015 #49

I don't want you driving on the roads I paid for, but it doesn't work that way. Gormy Cuss Nov 2015 #74

Well wasn't this thread about HUD discouraging smoking in doc03 Nov 2015 #162

1)you had the choice to rent a different car, shop at other stores, etc. Gormy Cuss Nov 2015 #250

If they would quit smoking maybe they would have doc03 Nov 2015 #256

Not your choice. X_Digger Nov 2015 #108

This. hifiguy Nov 2015 #51

So... the fact that the public subsidizes their rent means they should have *fewer* rules? n/t lumberjack_jeff Nov 2015 #58

When the landlord is the state, there are fewer restrictions that can be made. X_Digger Nov 2015 #109

The state is well within its rights to make regulations based on health. pnwmom Nov 2015 #189

Should the government ban processed meats in HUD housing? X_Digger Nov 2015 #216

If you can explain how eating processed meats in your own apartment pnwmom Nov 2015 #217

Who said this? "within its rights to make regulations based on health"? X_Digger Nov 2015 #218

Again, eating a hot dog puts no one at risk except for the eater. Smoking cigarettes pnwmom Nov 2015 #219

"within its rights to make regulations based on health" .. did someone ninja your kb? X_Digger Nov 2015 #220

That doesn't mean that EVERY possible regulation can be justified. But it is easy to justify, pnwmom Nov 2015 #221

Oh, so children in a smoker's home pale next to the non smokers in another apartment?!?! X_Digger Nov 2015 #222

Parents who smoke around their children are harming them -- you are right. pnwmom Nov 2015 #223

And not enough money for cigs. Nt Logical Nov 2015 #155

So people in public housing have no right to be free from second-hand smoke. alphafemale Nov 2015 #246

Good for them. It's past due. lumberjack_jeff Nov 2015 #44

Beyond the obvious health risks for non-smokers in public housing, how about taking a look madinmaryland Nov 2015 #45

Public health is important, but implementing this will be tough. Agnosticsherbet Nov 2015 #52

Neo-puritan bullshit MFrohike Nov 2015 #55

"Think of the children" hifiguy Nov 2015 #65

It still is the classic catch phrase of the American Family Association. NutmegYankee Nov 2015 #66

Nuff Said hifiguy Nov 2015 #68

+1 get the red out Nov 2015 #157

Both the Center for Disease Control and the American Cancer Society say that smoking pnwmom Nov 2015 #207

Children live in public housing. MADem Nov 2015 #56

Yes, yes, yes. pnwmom Nov 2015 #141

It's not just the nanny state HassleCat Nov 2015 #69

I'm not into the whole smoking debate romanic Nov 2015 #72

Bad news for Big Tobacco. Nye Bevan Nov 2015 #75

Will this affect the wealthy or just poor people? Why do so many approve of controlling the poor? The Straight Story Nov 2015 #77

The Four Seasons is one of DC's most expensive luxury hotels onenote Nov 2015 #89

Hotel VS where someone is living. Ok. (nt) The Straight Story Nov 2015 #95

I would bet that some of the most expensive rental properties in DC onenote Nov 2015 #97

Non-smokers who are wealthy are already protected from living in polluted air. pnwmom Nov 2015 #142

Reminds me of the drug testing for Texasgal Nov 2015 #81

Agreed. They think nothing of the same concept, when applied to their particular bugabear. X_Digger Nov 2015 #110

I'm surprised anyone would think it's okay to force HUD families comprised of non-smokers pnwmom Nov 2015 #143

I would find your stance far more righteous if you were consistent in standing up for poor children Bluenorthwest Nov 2015 #161

Does Pope Francis have a position on indoor smoking? stone space Nov 2015 #173

Yep. Poor-punching. Orsino Nov 2015 #258

This is nothing new. nruthie Nov 2015 #84

You're actually quite correct. onenote Nov 2015 #93

Hey, if they don't like it, they can rent elsewhere or just buy a house, amirite? REP Nov 2015 #88

So on that theory, there should be no restrictions on tenant in public housing? onenote Nov 2015 #91

Or HITLER!!!!11 REP Nov 2015 #94

We should piss test them too.. Texasgal Nov 2015 #100

Kind of a leap of logic eh? onenote Nov 2015 #102

Not a leap at all. Texasgal Nov 2015 #105

Because the landlord is the state, and this is housing of last resort for many. X_Digger Nov 2015 #111

I'll ask again: should there be any restrictions on what a renter can do onenote Nov 2015 #122

Yes, it is housing of last resort TexasMommaWithAHat Nov 2015 #229

If We (the state) don't maintain public housing, who's to blame? X_Digger Nov 2015 #233

No one smokes in my house...including the people I love. TexasMommaWithAHat Nov 2015 #235

OMG, the previous tenants cooked bacon, but I'm a vegan! X_Digger Nov 2015 #236

Go homeless. TexasMommaWithAHat Nov 2015 #237

You know what? Your priorities need a serious fucking adjustment. X_Digger Nov 2015 #238

Plenty of other people want and need that apartment TexasMommaWithAHat Nov 2015 #239

I'm disgusted. Homeless smoker? Fuck em, no housing for you and your filthy habit. X_Digger Nov 2015 #241

You don't read too well? TexasMommaWithAHat Nov 2015 #242

I read just fine. "Plenty of other people want and need that apartment" X_Digger Nov 2015 #243

It's their choice to smoke in a non-smoking apartment. TexasMommaWithAHat Nov 2015 #244

Oh don't back away from your words, now. Own em. X_Digger Nov 2015 #245

I do own them. TexasMommaWithAHat Nov 2015 #247

If they don't like it, they can smoke outside. The right of non-smokers in HUD housing pnwmom Nov 2015 #144

This could have repercussions for a Clinton-Castro ticket in tobacco states KamaAina Nov 2015 #92

You're not from Virginia are you? onenote Nov 2015 #96

In the worst-case scenario, all it might take is a bump in turnout on the Southside KamaAina Nov 2015 #119

Some new HUD housing in my town roody Nov 2015 #98

Good for you, HUD! kwassa Nov 2015 #99

I don't know if legislation is the right idea. Shoulders of Giants Nov 2015 #101

I've never smoked, but lived with people who have tzar paul Nov 2015 #103

Thank fucking Christ Yes! whatthehey Nov 2015 #104

Smoke away, who's gonna know? Reter Nov 2015 #106

LOOK, if my private apartment building can ban smoking, smirkymonkey Nov 2015 #112

Do you agree with drug testing Texasgal Nov 2015 #113

Neither of the things pollutes the air of other apartment renters, as cigarette smoke does. n/t pnwmom Nov 2015 #145

They did in my building loyalsister Nov 2015 #115

news flash dsc Nov 2015 #116

I have never been a smoker, but this is Tipperary Nov 2015 #120

Here's why it isn't ridiculous. People with enough money to rent private pnwmom Nov 2015 #127

Nanny State Stinky? You should be ashamed of using right wing terminology CreekDog Nov 2015 #129

This message was self-deleted by its author NutmegYankee Nov 2015 #134

Yeah, right there with "What shall we tell the children?" Stinky The Clown Nov 2015 #150

authoritarian spans right and left. Warren Stupidity Nov 2015 #214

Nanny state liberals never know when bbgrunt Nov 2015 #131

Ooh -- nanny state liberals! The horror! pnwmom Nov 2015 #146

I agree- being poor is not a crime Marrah_G Nov 2015 #132

You don't think poor children and other non-smokers deserve to breathe pnwmom Nov 2015 #147

Hey, I got an idea for you . . . . Stinky The Clown Nov 2015 #152

Nope. Children's health shouldn't be up for their smoking neighbor's vote. pnwmom Nov 2015 #154

I agree with you get the red out Nov 2015 #153

I agree with you Android3.14 Nov 2015 #151

I'm a Dem and I agree it's too much LynnTTT Nov 2015 #158

Don't poor children and other non-smokers have the same right to breath decent air pnwmom Nov 2015 #184

So what? I live in a senior facility roody Nov 2015 #160

I've seen this in non-HUD apartment complexes PersonNumber503602 Nov 2015 #163

Is it only those liberals that push for smoking bans? Where I live the doc03 Nov 2015 #165

Do they own the home? TipTok Nov 2015 #167

HUD actually owns the building and maintains it. Calista241 Nov 2015 #169

I agree. We should not be obligated to allow renters to deliberately damage public property. nt Zorra Nov 2015 #257

In the NPR story on this, they noted that it is already banned in 20% of public housing. FSogol Nov 2015 #170

Yup. Bashing Liberals is exactly my intent Stinky The Clown Nov 2015 #175

You didn't break the news story, you merely posted it on DU. FSogol Nov 2015 #176

Okay. You make a comment to me Stinky The Clown Nov 2015 #178

Both parties think being poor is a crime and that Warren Stupidity Nov 2015 #182

I thought Democrats believed that children in poverty pnwmom Nov 2015 #185

The government tells people with greater means Warren Stupidity Nov 2015 #201

No, but those adults of means can, if they want, protect their children pnwmom Nov 2015 #202

This Democrat does TexasBushwhacker Nov 2015 #230

As I predicted here in DU years ago... Eleanors38 Nov 2015 #192

I see the same possibility. And that's just one reason I think this is a terrible idea. Stinky The Clown Nov 2015 #215

When pressure groups close down discussion beyond the policy-at-hand... Eleanors38 Nov 2015 #228

Have you ever moved in to a house where people smoked inside? killbotfactory Nov 2015 #227

hah! I finally know why they call you Stinky! librechik Nov 2015 #231

In the building I lived in most of the residents were women jwirr Nov 2015 #234

I don't have a problem with this. Chan790 Nov 2015 #240