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haele

(15,416 posts)
91. The big winning lottery winners usually go bankrupt within year 3 to year 5 after a winning.
Wed Jan 13, 2016, 07:57 PM
Jan 2016

Those who win a million or under do a lot better than the big winners.

We did a study of the average experience of 12 lottery winners of around $25 - $30 million.
Year 1 - they get the big payoff of $8 - $15 million, pay their taxes and bills, take a couple trips, buy a couple houses and maybe invest in the hobby business - maybe a restaurant, arts and crafts consignment store, a nursery - that they really, really wanted to do instead of what they did for their 9-5 job. Put aside money for the kids. Upshot is, there's an average of $5 - $7 million left over after the spending spree. The leftover money goes into one, maybe two accounts.

Year 2 - More trips. Giving money to friends and family who need it to make it a bit easier for them, and so that they will leave you alone. The business does what businesses do. As personal and business problems arise, they dip into the leftover money to the tune of probably around $500K "no big deal, right?" and there's usually not enough business revenue to make up for the dipping into your lottery winnings. And then there's the taxes and costs to manage money like that - property taxes and business fees, and money management fees, and legal fees (your lawyer and accountant are very happy to have you, at around $10 - $20K a year each...) and, of course, the capital gains/income tax on the interest for money that is sitting in that account -
So that $5 - $7 million ends up being around $4 million, after all is said and done, and you and your spouse are looking at each other trying to figure out where that money went. It's starting to get stressful, because the interest on the winnings just about covers the taxes and fees, and the business is sucking money, and your kids are starting to be whiny brats about wanting a Ford GT or BMW SUV to show off to their friends, because hey, now they've got money....

Year 3 - wash, rinse, repeat of the previous year. You figure you're getting between $80K and $100K in interest per annum on what's left of your lottery winnings, so you and your spouse decide "no more touching the principle, we'll live off the interest". You both decide to switch the accounts to annuities to lock the payments on a yearly basis for the next 30 years, but haven't realized that the fees to do so take about $200K away from you, so you'll actually be making $60 - $80K. Which would be okay, if your business does well...but...
Your business's landlord raised his rent, and there's been an issue with some equipment there. Your business is still struggling to get off the ground. Or your house needs repair work, or a car, or some other major issue. Your accountant may or may not be cheating you. By at the end of year 3, you're down to $2 million, and your spouse is not loving life.

Year 4 is usually when the divorce happens. The business gets sold or closes its doors, the good house goes to the more dependent spouse, and property gets split up between the two of you. You sell the kid's fancy $100K cars at a significant loss because no one would be able to afford the insurance anymore.
You have maybe $800K in the bank to live off, no business, no job, and you're starting over - maybe with child support payments hanging over your head.
So, you can spend that money on a modest new home and go back to school to find a better job than the one you had - draining through the rest of that money for the next 3 - 4 years as you get your degree, or you could "retire" and live off that $800K as sort of a trust-annuity ($30,000 a year for 2% over 30 years) if you're old enough to get Social Security and Medicare to supplement it.

The problem is the windfall most lottery winners have is that the winnings are both too large and too small. People have a habit of living to the financial level that they have at the time, even if they know that level is not sustainable. Most people do not have enough control over their emotions that "well, just a little" or "I always wanted" will usually sneak in because they want so hard. It's worse for people who think they're better than that...and the people you think would be better at handling money - bankers, money managers - actually do worse when they win the lottery.

But, the conclusion from our study is that it's far better for an individual to win between $50K and $500K - just enough to pay off the bills, do some needed repairs, and have a little windfall fun - than it is to win over $2 million.

So that's how most big lottery winners go bankrupt.

Haele

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It might not be one winner so this article is a mute point bigdarryl Jan 2016 #1
I think you meant "moot" point? brooklynite Jan 2016 #3
Although I won't win. I bought 10 dollars worth. yeoman6987 Jan 2016 #82
Even if you share the jackpot it's still a good idea. n/t pnwmom Jan 2016 #89
The chances of me living another 30 years are not good. hobbit709 Jan 2016 #2
An annuity of this kind is transferrable alcibiades_mystery Jan 2016 #5
If you took the lump some and invested most of it Goblinmonger Jan 2016 #33
Yes, but when you die 1939 Jan 2016 #35
I've seen the opposite said Blue_Adept Jan 2016 #36
Not true alcibiades_mystery Jan 2016 #54
Exactly. It depends on how old you are if you win brush Jan 2016 #56
Not to mention there's a good chance taxes will go up TexasBushwhacker Jan 2016 #95
The best advice I've heard is: do nothing brooklynite Jan 2016 #4
That May Be Good Advice. . . ProfessorGAC Jan 2016 #7
might want to invest in a few bodyguards too... Takket Jan 2016 #8
THIRD: Tell no one that you won. nt TeamPooka Jan 2016 #59
Some states allow for trusts to be setup so the winner is not known CorkySt.Clair Jan 2016 #81
Is there a reason why wheniwasincongress Jan 2016 #87
Here in Washington it's disclosed, and I believe it's tied to our Sunshine Laws n/t Kennah Jan 2016 #105
So that we know there was really a winner ! JonLeibowitz Jan 2016 #107
I'm not sure about that. I'm getting the hell out of Dodge ASAP. ohnoyoudidnt Jan 2016 #92
The winner better be ready to go into hiding right after they claim the prize. Drahthaardogs Jan 2016 #97
Boy, Do I Disagree ProfessorGAC Jan 2016 #6
Having just been laid off from the annuity industry justiceischeap Jan 2016 #9
The present value of the annuity is less than the lump sum, IIRC (I don't play the MillennialDem Jan 2016 #10
i think its mostly predators looking for investments that bleed them dry Takket Jan 2016 #12
I guess when people play the lottery, they largely can't understand the numbers they MillennialDem Jan 2016 #14
my very dear friend/travel buddy who I have known many years is an investment counselor CTyankee Jan 2016 #46
Exhibit A: Dave Edwards. HughBeaumont Jan 2016 #17
Oh my! Granted that's $27 million, an order of magnitude less than the current powerball jackpot for MillennialDem Jan 2016 #22
Everything I would possibly want wouldn't cost more than $1 mill. hobbit709 Jan 2016 #32
Jack Whittaker, who won over 300 million, is another cautionary tale Tanuki Jan 2016 #52
I bet that guy's life would make an awesome movie. HughBeaumont Jan 2016 #61
I grew up in West Virginia, not far from where all of this took place,and as you can imagine Tanuki Jan 2016 #62
Step1: TELL NO ONE! Step2: Sign back of ticket. Step3: Take photos Pathwalker Jan 2016 #55
My husband's sister and her husband won like 3 or 4 million. Mariana Jan 2016 #63
They go broke because they don't prepare and then they get stupid jmowreader Jan 2016 #69
Oh I'd definitely have some of my money invested and automatically tapped and/or MillennialDem Jan 2016 #71
The big winning lottery winners usually go bankrupt within year 3 to year 5 after a winning. haele Jan 2016 #91
i thought i would take the annuity but.... Takket Jan 2016 #11
Doesn't even need be half. Could be 1/10th :p MillennialDem Jan 2016 #15
If you're going to indulge in conspiracy theories... brooklynite Jan 2016 #21
the old "hide it in your mattress" feeling...I hear ya... CTyankee Jan 2016 #48
I'd build a wall. tazkcmo Jan 2016 #13
i like the way you think. please consider a run for office. Takket Jan 2016 #16
lol tazkcmo Jan 2016 #19
Let freedom ring!!! ;) Takket Jan 2016 #29
I would always chose the annuity MrScorpio Jan 2016 #18
I'm 70 years old left-of-center2012 Jan 2016 #20
yep 840high Jan 2016 #104
I'll take the lump sum and set up a family office. nt Lucky Luciano Jan 2016 #23
I would take the lump sum and hire you to run my accounts! n/t A HERETIC I AM Jan 2016 #75
I assume there is no job offer today then? Lucky Luciano Jan 2016 #110
Lightning struck in my state but it missed me by quite a bit A HERETIC I AM Jan 2016 #111
lean toward over time so if i screwed up i could reset every year dembotoz Jan 2016 #24
Can the lottery authority guarantee that the money will be paid? Renew Deal Jan 2016 #25
Illinois stopped payment on wins over $600 last year got sued too Person 2713 Jan 2016 #49
Take better advice and don't play rjsquirrel Jan 2016 #26
Decisions, decisions BeyondGeography Jan 2016 #27
While I plan to live forever, statistics tell me I may not last that long. ladyVet Jan 2016 #28
Read the article... brooklynite Jan 2016 #31
Nope, I'd take the cash. eom MohRokTah Jan 2016 #30
What happens if the lottery goes belly up next year? B2G Jan 2016 #34
Yes. brooklynite Jan 2016 #40
I will be laughing atop my pile of gold B2G Jan 2016 #44
Like Scrooge McDuck? hifiguy Jan 2016 #77
EXACTLY! B2G Jan 2016 #79
I will take the lump sum, thank you very much. bigwillq Jan 2016 #37
Never play the lotto..... odd_duck Jan 2016 #38
Screw that!! Separation Jan 2016 #39
I'm neither a math whiz nor a lottery player, but something about this author's math just KingCharlemagne Jan 2016 #41
I think there's a lump sum payout at the end. brooklynite Jan 2016 #45
Ah, I'm demonstrating Pope's observation that "a little KingCharlemagne Jan 2016 #47
The payments step up by 4% a year A HERETIC I AM Jan 2016 #50
Hey NYT... I win the Powerball Lottery? Hows about you take my advice and fuck off? cherokeeprogressive Jan 2016 #42
Managing this much money, regardless of how many Lodestar Jan 2016 #43
Sorry everyone, a psychic told me I would win the big prize! Uben Jan 2016 #51
Nope. Net worth before income. KamaAina Jan 2016 #53
I'll let you know how it goes. Tab Jan 2016 #57
I just love the way everyone assumes they'd do a better SheilaT Jan 2016 #58
The #1 rule of investing is "Leave it to the pros." Get a GOOD TEAM of portfolio managers. Xithras Jan 2016 #66
Leave it to the pros SheilaT Jan 2016 #68
This. In every particular. hifiguy Jan 2016 #76
I absolutely would not leave it to the pros exboyfil Jan 2016 #103
No it isn't A HERETIC I AM Jan 2016 #78
I understand the guaranteed thirty year payoff is to increase SheilaT Jan 2016 #101
The payment steps up but the securities they buy are current yield treasuries A HERETIC I AM Jan 2016 #106
I would not do the investing myself, but I would not take the annuity Goblinmonger Jan 2016 #80
We did a case study on this laundry_queen Jan 2016 #100
Bookmarking for reference after the drawing. DawgHouse Jan 2016 #60
At my age I'd take the lump sum. hifiguy Jan 2016 #64
I'd take the lump sum because I have plans for that money, and keeping most of it isn't part of... Humanist_Activist Jan 2016 #65
I'd go with the annunity as well, especially given the large size for this drawing. Lancero Jan 2016 #67
What if you don't expect to live 30 more years? Can the remainder be willed B Calm Jan 2016 #70
Yes - it becomes part of your Estate brooklynite Jan 2016 #72
Why do most lottery winners go bankrupt? Oneironaut Jan 2016 #73
Because they piss away their money on stupid shit. hifiguy Jan 2016 #74
There was a show about this underpants Jan 2016 #84
Yep. And send the lawyer -- hifiguy Jan 2016 #85
It still has to be a public record. underpants Jan 2016 #86
Have an exit plan. Xolodno Jan 2016 #88
Great advice underpants Jan 2016 #90
Annuity total take home = $678M. Lump=$421M underpants Jan 2016 #83
I'd take the annuity Kaleva Jan 2016 #93
I must be a very conservative investor but... steve2470 Jan 2016 #94
we would create 50 millonaires, 10000 units of co-op housing for homeless, a small socialist army... JanMichael Jan 2016 #96
Take lump sum and after taxes: 1939 Jan 2016 #98
My advice for all of the lotteries across the US: adopt the Canadian method. kentauros Jan 2016 #99
that's less money for CPA's and tax lawyers :p steve2470 Jan 2016 #102
They probably already get less money kentauros Jan 2016 #109
Back before The Learning Channel became The Reality TV Network ... Kennah Jan 2016 #108
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