General Discussion

Lizzie Poppet

(10,164 posts)

132. It's editorial.

Sat Jan 16, 2016, 01:48 PM

Jan 2016

A critique of your "contributions" on this subject, if you will. Specifically your tendency to reply with tangential deflections and/or outright non sequiturs... So I made one of my own, a bit of satire which incorporated criticism of those tendencies. I've been reading your gun-related posts for long enough to realize that an actual substantive conversation on that topic just isn't going to happen, ever. Usually, I simply "walk on by." This time I didn't. So sad!

As it happens, I do logic for a living, too...and I'm pretty good at it. Next time I think you've committed a demonstrable fallacy (almost certainly an informal fallacy of argument, not a violation of symbolic logic, the latter seldom being applicable to internet argument), perhaps I'll point it out and we'll see if you can back up your claim. Though neither of us would benefit from holding our breath on that, I imagine.

In any case, feel free to return to your usual MO in gun threads. I'm done for now, I suspect.

Ta!

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Gun-Toting Subway Customer Gets Into Open-Carry Dispute With Police (CT) [View all] davidpdx Jan 2016 OP

Whenever I see someone with a gun in a situation like that... onehandle Jan 2016 #1

Why was the gun TeddyR Jan 2016 #13

Hand guns have one purpose: killing human beings TransitJohn Jan 2016 #27

Their legal even in Connecticut yeoman6987 Jan 2016 #107

I didn't really say anything about legality? TransitJohn Jan 2016 #124

Ok sorry. yeoman6987 Jan 2016 #167

Well TeddyR Jan 2016 #111

Open carry is an behavioral aberration, unless you are heading into a gun range or the woods, etc. onehandle Jan 2016 #56

that is the problem Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #64

Why is that a problem? We're talking about a resturaunt, for God's sake! (nt) stone space Jan 2016 #84

so you would be fine if he Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #87

No, I would not. Where did you ever get such a stupid idea? (nt) stone space Jan 2016 #90

because this is what I was responding to Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #102

You aren't making any sense here. (nt) stone space Jan 2016 #108

yes I am Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #126

Imagine the distress of the workers SoCalDem Jan 2016 #172

Seems like he was in the process Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #180

Can never be too sure sarisataka Jan 2016 #15

Good to know there are 'responsible citizens' out there concerned over the safety of others. Rex Jan 2016 #136

This incident shows that open carry is often (usually?) a form of protest, not security. Lizzie Poppet Jan 2016 #2

+1 daleanime Jan 2016 #5

+1 katsy Jan 2016 #29

Agree. mountain grammy Jan 2016 #33

+1 BuddhaGirl Jan 2016 #93

A form of protest, and an example of gross public intimidation. Paladin Jan 2016 #95

It's exhibitionism. Nothing more. Nothing less. Iggo Jan 2016 #173

firearms owners should follow the law Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #3

Just like any other license you have to able to produce it underpants Jan 2016 #7

Ct law says you can open carry if you have a permit and there is no breach wordpix Jan 2016 #44

of course this is a properly holstered pistol Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #51

Whatever, pistol, rifle, military assault weapon...personally, i don't want them near me wordpix Jan 2016 #71

shows your true colors Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #76

I did say "personally "and i don't appreciate being bullied wordpix Jan 2016 #81

ok, my apologies Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #83

It was probably because his open carry was a form of political protest, branford Jan 2016 #80

quite possible Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #85

He did follow the law... ChisolmTrailDem Jan 2016 #16

it sounds like he Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #17

True, even the cop should not have gotten into it treestar Jan 2016 #22

Uh, i got stopped in CT bc the cop put my tag no. in wordpix Jan 2016 #48

no registration stickers? Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #53

It was 6,mos out of date and i was back in CT all that time wordpix Jan 2016 #75

in your other post Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #82

Yes one is responsible for it treestar Jan 2016 #94

wel we all make mistakes Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #99

I was out of state, no notice. I came back to state, no notice wordpix Jan 2016 #98

which one of your posts is correct? Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #104

How about f you and stop the bullying. Does that answer your q, counslor? wordpix Jan 2016 #110

NY is so much easier Reter Jan 2016 #158

Same here in OK Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #168

Doesn't that show on the plate? treestar Jan 2016 #92

He randomly put my plate no. in his device wordpix Jan 2016 #105

appears not, stupid if you ask me Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #115

Connecticut did away with the license plate stickers. NutmegYankee Jan 2016 #164

Texas had both Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #170

Other states are moving to simlar systems. NutmegYankee Jan 2016 #171

yep sad in my opinion Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #181

Oh i see treestar Jan 2016 #174

I'm sure less people get caught NutmegYankee Jan 2016 #182

My guess Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #183

When I'm in a situation with police where I feel I'm being mistreated or having my rights... ChisolmTrailDem Jan 2016 #23

It's one thing to get snippy with cops. stone space Jan 2016 #88

The crime is not having a permit. B Calm Jan 2016 #19

Such a scenario would be circular logic and by any legal definition - unreasonable. NutmegYankee Jan 2016 #30

so you are saying Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #40

No, I'm talking someone not being a responsible gun owner. If someone drove his car inside the B Calm Jan 2016 #46

from what the story said Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #50

Breach of peace is the important phrase in the law wordpix Jan 2016 #57

yep badly written Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #63

Breach of Peace has a pretty clear defintion. NutmegYankee Jan 2016 #72

In these days and times of mass public massacres, every week wordpix Jan 2016 #96

Exactly! A RESPONSIBLE Gun owner would have understand that and showed his permit! B Calm Jan 2016 #97

That doesn't matter one bit under the law. NutmegYankee Jan 2016 #100

If I see a person with a weapon in a fast food joint randr Jan 2016 #35

The wording does not include anything about suspecting that a crime is "about to be" committed. nt ChisolmTrailDem Jan 2016 #37

Why not? Since they love to beat us over the head about this being a free country. Rex Jan 2016 #133

Confused law, for sure. Cannot oc if there's breach of peace wordpix Jan 2016 #38

It appears from reading the story he was following the law but not the cops. If they ask for the Waldorf Jan 2016 #103

The article said police can only ask for it if there's suspicion the person is committing a crime Reter Jan 2016 #154

Seems so Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #155

Reads like the cops need proper training. ileus Jan 2016 #4

And is well aware of what they're doing to the businesses they visit... daleanime Jan 2016 #6

And probably know exactly what to say to police if they pull a Zimmerman and shoot Hoyt Jan 2016 #8

Stop being an asshole and just show the cop your permit. He was being a gun nut at that point. nt Logical Jan 2016 #9

If the cop had no right to ask for the permit SickOfTheOnePct Jan 2016 #10

Just don't be an asshole is one reason. It would take 5 seconds. No drama. nt Logical Jan 2016 #26

Yes, it's assholish not to show it SickOfTheOnePct Jan 2016 #28

Maybe he was being asked daily Reter Jan 2016 #161

Cops have the right to ask and oc asshats need to show the permit. Twisting what the law clearly sta wordpix Jan 2016 #32

Where do police have a "Right" to ask? NutmegYankee Jan 2016 #52

Oc requires a permit and police have the right to ask for it. wordpix Jan 2016 #59

They can only ask if they have a reasonable suspicion of a crime being committed. NutmegYankee Jan 2016 #62

Only when a reasonable suspicion of a crime is present NickB79 Jan 2016 #65

not if he was doing nothing wrong Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #67

Per the article, the cops did NOT have a right to ask NickB79 Jan 2016 #60

If I'm a business owner and ask someone to leave wordpix Jan 2016 #66

did you even read it Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #68

Did the Subway owner call the police? NickB79 Jan 2016 #79

Reasonable suspicion is easy to justify... Blue_Tires Jan 2016 #73

And knows they can wave their dick in public and intimidate others ProudToBeBlueInRhody Jan 2016 #159

the daily heartwarming responsible ammosexual story.... KG Jan 2016 #11

"ammosexual" Stinky The Clown Jan 2016 #14

that us all some have Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #20

So better training for the cops? TeddyR Jan 2016 #12

I would have just shown my permit as well SickOfTheOnePct Jan 2016 #18

It depends how the law is written sarisataka Jan 2016 #21

Next time I'm asked by a game warden for my fishing license, I'll tell him I don't B Calm Jan 2016 #24

Normally the law states that you have to show your fishing license on request to a game warden. NutmegYankee Jan 2016 #36

and a responsible gun owner would have shown his permit. B Calm Jan 2016 #39

Police had no right to ask. They had no reasonable suspicion except racism. nt NutmegYankee Jan 2016 #42

With the mass shootings today, you really think customers are not suspicious of some nut B Calm Jan 2016 #47

Police are held to the standard of "reasonable suspicion". NutmegYankee Jan 2016 #49

I strongly suggest sarisataka Jan 2016 #179

good advice Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #184

I see an open carry i call the cops. I dont know their intent. Katashi_itto Jan 2016 #25

CT, where the Sandy Hook massacre occurred, can't get its f-ing act together wordpix Jan 2016 #31

That's because Connecticut still has a lot of rural areas. NutmegYankee Jan 2016 #54

True but those rurl reas are now mostly suburbanized except in the parks and state forests. wordpix Jan 2016 #69

WTF is wrong with Connecticut allowing open carry? Of course, the cops valerief Jan 2016 #34

When people open carry in a place like Connecticut it's usually to challenge police overreach. NutmegYankee Jan 2016 #41

That's a real possibility. Of course, you don't have to be white to be an ammosexual either. nt valerief Jan 2016 #55

Agree. NutmegYankee Jan 2016 #61

But if you're black, you can get yourself killed pretty quickly doing that. valerief Jan 2016 #70

Step one is to act. NutmegYankee Jan 2016 #78

same as the other 40+ Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #43

So you have to show your permit for carrying a fishing pole, but not a gun? tabasco Jan 2016 #45

I had no idea ordering a meat sandwich was so frightening. Vinca Jan 2016 #58

Gimme my guns! I even take a bath with my guns! Kingofalldems Jan 2016 #74

Bathtime can be dangerous. You can't be too prepared. stone space Jan 2016 #162

If I see some Open Carry Ammosxexual in a resturaunt, I'm running for my life! stone space Jan 2016 #77

Call 911 and report him for what? Shrek Jan 2016 #89

Carrying a gun in a resturaunt. It's called Domestic Terrorism. (nt) stone space Jan 2016 #91

Can you cite the actual law? nt hack89 Jan 2016 #101

lets see the law that covers this Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #106

Look, I'm not going to expose my family to some Ammosexual's Matallic Dildo. stone space Jan 2016 #112

yep, that is all you have Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #127

Are you accusing me of not doing my job? stone space Jan 2016 #128

Do please use that term to the 911 dispatcher. Lizzie Poppet Jan 2016 #114

Why should we expose our families to terrorists? stone space Jan 2016 #116

It's sure obvious you don't teach philosophy. Lizzie Poppet Jan 2016 #118

What is this personal remark all about? I don't understand. stone space Jan 2016 #120

you did to me the other day Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #130

Are you attempting to hijack this thread to justify personal insults here? (nt) stone space Jan 2016 #131

I am trying to point out that Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #139

Your stalking from thread to thread does not justify the unprovoked personal insults here. (nt) stone space Jan 2016 #142

It's editorial. Lizzie Poppet Jan 2016 #132

Why are you injecting my personal real world employment into this thread? stone space Jan 2016 #135

you bring it up all the time Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #141

What does my personal real world employment have to do with this thread. stone space Jan 2016 #143

"stalker" Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #145

See above; repeat as needed. Lizzie Poppet Jan 2016 #152

yep, over the laughter when they Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #129

Your irrational TeddyR Jan 2016 #122

There is no need for personal insults here. stone space Jan 2016 #125

you do to us all the time Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #134

Please stop stalking me. Your stalking somebody from thread to thread... stone space Jan 2016 #138

If you look at the time stamps, You followed me here and Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #144

Nobody followed you anywhere. stone space Jan 2016 #146

your first post in this thread Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #149

This is the post that you linked to. stone space Jan 2016 #150

reading the content subthead is Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #153

Where have I insulted you over your real world employment? (nt) stone space Jan 2016 #157

You have not as I do not inject my employment Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #160

Neither did I. A stalker injected my real world employment into this thread, not me. stone space Jan 2016 #163

you have on many occasions Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #165

We are talking about this thread. Stalking is no exccuse. (nt) stone space Jan 2016 #169

so why do you start new posts attacking me in GD Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #176

Why are you changing the subject? (nt) stone space Jan 2016 #177

That is what I figured Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #185

Nothing wrong with being a 'responsible citizen' worried about the safety of others. Rex Jan 2016 #137

Some Black Lives Matter protesters have started open-carrying in protest of police brutality NickB79 Jan 2016 #86

Was the person here African American? The one holding the phone, the one open carrying? Jackie Wilson Said Jan 2016 #109

Kudos to the police PumpkinAle Jan 2016 #113

Kudos to the police PumpkinAle Jan 2016 #117

Conundrum LynnTTT Jan 2016 #119

That sounds pretty damn irresponsible to me. stone space Jan 2016 #123

why, he did the responsible thing Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #147

Reading is fundamental. stone space Jan 2016 #148

yes it is Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #151

My post was a response to the passage I quoted, not passages that you quote after the fact. stone space Jan 2016 #156

OK Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #166

As I commute on the train, Fairgo Jan 2016 #121

If someone walks into my business establishment holding a gun, I will call the police. To hell with AlinPA Jan 2016 #140

Question, if several of the businesses in the area were filing complaints, do they have the right... Humanist_Activist Jan 2016 #175

My guess would be they can Duckhunter935 Jan 2016 #178

Sorry, we're locking this. Chemisse Jan 2016 #186