Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

haele

(15,379 posts)
36. No, ethical qualms not acted on other than by the person who has them are morals.
Sun Jan 31, 2016, 10:16 PM
Jan 2016

I have personal ethical qualms about a lot of actions, also. And I have a right to make choices based on my personal ethics. They are my moral compass, and if I do something against my personal ethics, or force my personal ethics onto someone else, that is a moral hazard. The latter, forcing my personal ethics onto someone else, is an ethical situation, because I am impacting someone else's situation.

Morals do not equal ethics - they are a subjective condition within ethics, and they do not have binding legal status, according to the four ethics classes I've taken over the past couple years.

But if I were to use my personal moral compass, used my personal ethical qualms to legislate the standard and access to a procedure rather than using (in this case) science and secular law, then I am actually being anti-ethical in a legal sense.

There are two issues here: Fighting the legality of having a choice to have an abortion, and fighting the procedure of abortion to limit the ability for someone to have one if they want or need one.

In the case of Abortion, by supporting social opinion based legal (but medically un-necessary) restrictions either to the procedure or to how/when a woman can access an abortion, I've limited someone else's legal choices to access a legal medical procedure due to my personal judgments or opinion of their lifestyle without understanding the basis or the reasons of their choice.
By putting up specious roadblocks to force them into actions that I approve of, I've suborned their experiences and legal status to my own.
Abortion is a tool to deal with the symptom of an untenable pregnancy. Note that the pregnancy is untenable, not non-viable. The woman is not ready or capable of continuing with the pregnancy, whether it is due to an environmental situation (finances, emotional, or otherwise), or a medical situation. Just because 2- 5% of women in that situation casually choose abortion because they were not careful and just want to get rid of the situation rather than dealing with their personal morals doesn't give society a right to limit access to the final tool to all other women because "it's too easy to have one". Yeah, right - birth control and abstinence are much cheaper than abortion.
Ethically, can one argue against abortion without putting one's personal religion or opinions above the religion, opinion, or situational condition of the person who desires both the choice and the access?
It is of the best interest of society for a parent or parents to bear and raise children when they are ready, not just because a pregnancy occurs.

In three different social ethics models I've run, the actual ethical consideration for children only comes into effect in that model once that child is born and able to function or affect the world around him or her.
Prior to that, no matter how we want to feel about the situation, an unborn "child" is basically an ethical remora, with no standing of its own, living off the host mother until s/he is able to become viable leave the uterus.
If one puts a value on the fetus above that of the host, then one basically is indicating that all women who find themselves pregnant automatically loses all rights.
If one says "okay, - Safe, Legal, and Rare, it is...we'll let the procedure be legally available in certain limited circumstances, but you have to prove you really need it, that you really thought about it, and that you can afford it...", is it because one believes the procedure is not really ever a medical necessity, or that the woman's personal choice is negligible?

It's not a "F-you" to people who have personal ethical qualms. Y'know, if you don't like abortion, don't have one.
But growing up, I had a neighbor who died due to pregnancy complications, leaving a husband and two young children because even if she had the choice, she was denied access to one. I also know a woman who had three abortions before she had her first child, and two more in between that one and her second.
Do I have the right to judge in which situation, abortion should have been allowed? Do I agree to limitations to access to abortion that are based on my feelings over medical necessity?
Are either of these positions I am making that affect others ethically based, or based on my personal morals?

People who claim ethical qualms need to think beyond their personal feelings for their qualms to actually be ethical.

Haele

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

Death by a thousand cuts. The "right to life" movement makes all kinds of noise bullwinkle428 Jan 2016 #1
they have no interest in overturning Roe. they're achieving their goal w/o it. nashville_brook Jan 2016 #23
+++ "Rare" framing led us directly into these TRAPS. DirkGently Jan 2016 #2
gee nothing is ever the GOP's fault it is always the Clenis dsc Jan 2016 #3
TRAP laws and sellout "rare" framing are at fault. DirkGently Jan 2016 #4
yes it would be much better if we had a billion unplanned pregnancies a year dsc Jan 2016 #5
Would barriers to heart surgery reduce the need for them? DirkGently Jan 2016 #6
No but as someone whose dad had his first bypass at age 46 dsc Jan 2016 #10
So show me the vast numbers of abortions in Oregon. jeff47 Jan 2016 #13
I didn't say we needed regulation dsc Jan 2016 #17
actually, HRC has done more than most to ensure that regulations/restrictions happened nashville_brook Jan 2016 #21
that is utter bullshit dsc Jan 2016 #22
it' not a "hater's club" -- it's the truth, and you can ignore it if you like. nashville_brook Jan 2016 #24
sorry dsc Jan 2016 #26
there's no quotes from those sources. but, feel free to cast aspersions. nashville_brook Jan 2016 #27
that was my reference to du being the Hillary hating club dsc Jan 2016 #28
take responsibility or not. it won't change the truth of the matter. nashville_brook Jan 2016 #29
"Rare" is how you line up votes for chipping away at abortion rights. jeff47 Jan 2016 #32
You are obtuse. nt awoke_in_2003 Jan 2016 #8
Great post awoke_in_2003 Jan 2016 #7
Exactly. We're not dealing with DirkGently Jan 2016 #9
compromise, in this arena, has led to the destruction of women's lives. nashville_brook Jan 2016 #25
Agreed. nt awoke_in_2003 Jan 2016 #30
+++ a million. In this context, this type of compromise = appeasement = death. DirkGently Jan 2016 #34
"Safe, legal and rare" is not just a "Clinton-era mantra". Obama has said it too. Nye Bevan Jan 2016 #11
And it was just as wrong when he said it. (nt) jeff47 Jan 2016 #12
Plenty of us support "safe, legal, and rare". Odin2005 Jan 2016 #20
Because "safe and legal" is terrible? jeff47 Jan 2016 #31
It started in the Clinton era of triangulation. DirkGently Jan 2016 #14
I like "safe, legal, accessible and rare". Nye Bevan Jan 2016 #15
The need is never going to go away. DirkGently Jan 2016 #16
Why put "rare" in when it's a natural outcome? jeff47 Feb 2016 #37
K&R smirkymonkey Jan 2016 #18
I think one issue is that we Millennials have no memory of the world before Roe v. Wade. Odin2005 Jan 2016 #19
The problem is that "rare" was the wrong word. haele Jan 2016 #33
Yes, how dare some people have ethical qualms with abortion! Odin2005 Jan 2016 #35
No, ethical qualms not acted on other than by the person who has them are morals. haele Jan 2016 #36
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»The real threat to aborti...»Reply #36