Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News Editorials & Other Articles General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search
 

Mairead

(9,557 posts)
102. "A single person or small group of people in a workshop ...
Sun Jun 3, 2012, 09:22 AM
Jun 2012

can't build a computer chip. Or a locomotive. Or a movie camera."

You must be kidding. All those things were first built by individuals or small groups of people in workshops.

There's a lovely little comedy film made by the Ealing Studios in the early '50s. It's called "The Titfield Thunderbolt", and concerns the efforts of a fictional village in England to save their branch railway. The real star of the film is "Lion", a locomotive built in 1838 and re-named "Thunderbolt" for the film. It's the actual antique locomotive, not a fake (tho they did use a fake for one scene) or a copy, and it's truly charming to watch it huffing through the picturesque countryside in its race to satisfy the Ministry of Transport's requirements.

The Lion was made by "a small group of people in a workshop". The first modern loco, the "Rocket", was designed and built just ten years earlier by only 3 people: George Stephenson, his son, Robert, and Henry Booth.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

Capitalism - Good or bad ? [View all] kentuck Jun 2012 OP
Good slackmaster Jun 2012 #1
As currently practiced in America -- BAD bupkus Jun 2012 #2
Capitalism freed us from Monarchies orpupilofnature57 Jun 2012 #3
Good or bad is not really the point. Capitalism is well suited to human nature. Skinner Jun 2012 #4
That argument is made many times. It turns on what human nature is. rug Jun 2012 #8
Capitalism exists nearly everywhere. randome Jun 2012 #13
So does bacteria. rug Jun 2012 #17
Bacteria are selfish. (nt) Skinner Jun 2012 #31
They'd need a concept of self first. rug Jun 2012 #34
Bacteria lack the desire to accumulate finer things. randome Jun 2012 #38
I'm tempted to bring up the oldest successful collection of living things but that would get silly. rug Jun 2012 #40
That kind of 'success' is according to their nature, too. randome Jun 2012 #44
Capitalism has been ascendant for historical reasons. rug Jun 2012 #46
Empires are still ascendant now, in a different form. Zalatix Jun 2012 #84
Not at all. Skinner Jun 2012 #41
They don't have a choice. People do. Ergo, politics. rug Jun 2012 #43
Some would argue that humans have much less choice than they think. Skinner Jun 2012 #48
bacteria are not sentient!!! BOG PERSON Jun 2012 #37
Neither are republican voters. rug Jun 2012 #42
I think you meant sapient. UnrepentantLiberal Jun 2012 #73
ok? BOG PERSON Jun 2012 #74
OK what? UnrepentantLiberal Jun 2012 #75
Bacteria are NOT shellfish. cherokeeprogressive Jun 2012 #85
Greed can be relied upon; Altruism cannot FarCenter Jun 2012 #14
For one thing, that's based on a false assumption. rug Jun 2012 #26
The society could be any of an extended family, a clan, a state, a nation, a hemisphere. FarCenter Jun 2012 #52
LIARS & OUTLIERS - Enabling the Trust That Society Needs to Thrive by Bruce Schneier FarCenter Jun 2012 #55
Under no circumstances... kentuck Jun 2012 #18
At the risk of pissing off the head honcho of DU, your post is ahistorical, coalition_unwilling Jun 2012 #19
Kinda depends on how you define... TreasonousBastard Jun 2012 #45
Those damned Injuns needed them some civilizing, gawl-durnnit! - n/t coalition_unwilling Jun 2012 #50
Because the pre-Columbian societies were slave cultures....... socialist_n_TN Jun 2012 #83
OK, I'm not an expert here and I don't want to propound as coalition_unwilling Jun 2012 #135
So how well did non-capitalism work out for these indigenous peoples? (nt) Nye Bevan Jun 2012 #118
Does it really matter to this discussion how well 'non-capitalism' worked out? Not trying to coalition_unwilling Jun 2012 #129
I love it. First the capitalist apologists claim capitalism is human nature and exists everywhere. Puregonzo1188 Jun 2012 #138
Post structuralists would argue that the very concept of such a thing as coalition_unwilling Jun 2012 #140
"capitalist apologist hate and despise debate and must shut it down at all costs." Skinner Jun 2012 #141
Social Darwinism? We can't help ourselves from being predators of other humans? Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2012 #54
No, it's not Social Darwinism. (nt) Skinner Jun 2012 #56
Are you talking about "nature" or "inclinations"? Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2012 #62
Bad. rug Jun 2012 #5
prescient as heck BOG PERSON Jun 2012 #86
bad bluedave Jun 2012 #6
Gray - black or white? JHB Jun 2012 #7
Bad. Starry Messenger Jun 2012 #9
Bad. DLevine Jun 2012 #10
Good and bad meow2u3 Jun 2012 #11
Inherently oppressive by definition - TBF Jun 2012 #12
You know sometimes I wonder just how worse feudalism really was than capitalism? white_wolf Jun 2012 #66
Guarantees of protection? Zalatix Jun 2012 #67
Is that really that much different today? white_wolf Jun 2012 #69
Point taken! Zalatix Jun 2012 #70
Agree TBF Jun 2012 #87
Yes, definitely. H2O Man Jun 2012 #15
Historically useful, now outmoded and soon to coalition_unwilling Jun 2012 #16
I agree! SoutherDem Jun 2012 #25
Good 1-Old-Man Jun 2012 #20
Greed is not good... kentuck Jun 2012 #27
Competition is not greed, neither is capital formation 1-Old-Man Jun 2012 #29
Filled up your gas tank lately? kentuck Jun 2012 #36
Inherently evil. Vidar Jun 2012 #21
Depends on who you ask SoutherDem Jun 2012 #22
With or without corporate socialism? nt valerief Jun 2012 #23
When properly regulated, good. boxman15 Jun 2012 #24
Regulations are the problem SoutherDem Jun 2012 #28
That's why the Democratic Party needs to hit back hard. boxman15 Jun 2012 #30
IMO, vigorously regulated small business capitalism, with a large government sector for ProgressiveEconomist Jun 2012 #92
chaotic neutral BOG PERSON Jun 2012 #32
Good. lumberjack_jeff Jun 2012 #33
This message was self-deleted by its author 99Forever Jun 2012 #35
Bad question... TreasonousBastard Jun 2012 #39
To each, according to his needs.... kentuck Jun 2012 #47
"The comfort of the rich depends upon an abundant supply of the poor." Voltaire Tierra_y_Libertad Jun 2012 #49
"The Pleasures of the Rich are bought with the Tears of the Poor" --Rev. Thos. Fuller Mairead Jun 2012 #60
VERY Bad. Mairead Jun 2012 #51
I don't expect you -or any of us- to have all the answers but... randome Jun 2012 #53
Imagine, if you will, what the knock-on effects would be of four relatively minor changes Mairead Jun 2012 #59
That sounds nice. But how would anything get made that is technologically advanced? Skinner Jun 2012 #77
You make a very good point Skinner... kentuck Jun 2012 #89
One of the answers to your question is market socialism. white_wolf Jun 2012 #91
Think of Mondragón. Of open-source software. Of inventors. Of university research centers. Mairead Jun 2012 #95
Well said. randome Jun 2012 #96
I still don't see who would build your computer... Skinner Jun 2012 #98
Capitalism is war by other means. randome Jun 2012 #99
You really don't? Mairead Jun 2012 #100
A very, well-thought out post. kentuck Jun 2012 #101
So, why didn't Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak form a cooperative corporation? Skinner Jun 2012 #103
I think I've already answered that Mairead Jun 2012 #105
EXACTLY. Skinner Jun 2012 #106
You're arguing a fallacious version of the Anthropic Principle Mairead Jun 2012 #110
We would not have the scientific principle if it wasn't for religion. randome Jun 2012 #108
Very few human advancements have been "organic" in the way I think you're using the term. Mairead Jun 2012 #112
Indoor plumbing. Sanitation disposal. Central heating and air conditioning. randome Jun 2012 #115
Okay, we're talking about two different levels Mairead Jun 2012 #122
'Psychological brownian motion". Excellent way to phrase it. randome Jun 2012 #125
Smart people don't always do the right thing. Zalatix Jun 2012 #132
And just to hook on to your great posts here- Starry Messenger Jun 2012 #109
Well caught! Thank you. Mairead Jun 2012 #117
"A single person or small group of people in a workshop ... Mairead Jun 2012 #102
Why can't I ride a Lion today? Skinner Jun 2012 #104
Because they're no longer being made, and the surviving Lion went back to the museum Mairead Jun 2012 #107
Capitalism without corporations? Is that what you're advocating? randome Jun 2012 #111
No, small-c capitalism without *private-profit* corporations Mairead Jun 2012 #113
I am not arguing that for-profit corporations innovate. Skinner Jun 2012 #114
Let's presume the advantages are as you say Mairead Jun 2012 #116
The evidence that capitalism works is everywhere. Skinner Jun 2012 #120
I'd urge you to read about Mondragón. Mairead Jun 2012 #123
Necessity, not Capitalism or profit, is the first mother of invention. Zalatix Jun 2012 #124
Very true. randome Jun 2012 #126
One of the greatest signs of human evolution in the modern era is the Open Source movement. Zalatix Jun 2012 #128
Unregulated capitalism is devastating Marrah_G Jun 2012 #57
As I said before - when one companies' annual profit is greater than the combined GDP of 50 countries... Initech Jun 2012 #58
Capitalism is fine.. and-justice-for-all Jun 2012 #61
Bad. It is predicated on exploitation, wide spread poverty, and endless resources. TheKentuckian Jun 2012 #63
Their wet dream was always to have the Chinese "market"... kentuck Jun 2012 #64
++++ Starry Messenger Jun 2012 #78
Good with governments that provide safety nets, regulations... shcrane71 Jun 2012 #65
Good JonLP24 Jun 2012 #68
Whatever system they have in Denmark or Sweden probably works the best. AJTheMan Jun 2012 #71
Which is free market capitalism. nt hack89 Jun 2012 #76
So yes, free market capitalism is good. I'm not sure why but it is good. Better than communism. AJTheMan Jun 2012 #88
I think it's funny that people are talking about "human nature" being the proof of capitalism's HiPointDem Jun 2012 #72
Exactly. I find it funny (fsvo "funny") Mairead Jun 2012 #97
Nothing is being "imposed" on anyone. Nye Bevan Jun 2012 #130
History says it was. Violently. HiPointDem Jun 2012 #142
Here is just one example of capitalism being imposed violently. white_wolf Jun 2012 #145
Good...or at least better FreeJoe Jun 2012 #79
Properly reigned in? Good. MrSlayer Jun 2012 #80
Bad GeorgeGist Jun 2012 #81
What kind of Capitalism? 99Forever Jun 2012 #82
Bad, but better than state socialism. joshcryer Jun 2012 #90
Good or bad is not possible to say. But so far the human condition has not yet created a sustainable Douglas Carpenter Jun 2012 #93
a horrible.... unkachuck Jun 2012 #94
Neither. It's amoral rucky Jun 2012 #119
Good. As history proves. This is the only way for the masses to improve their lot. Honeycombe8 Jun 2012 #121
Because socialism is better. craigmatic Jun 2012 #127
Good if well regulated taught_me_patience Jun 2012 #131
I would look to basic human needs as the answer. randome Jun 2012 #133
It's definitely bad if it's allowed to run without limits. n/t cynatnite Jun 2012 #134
Capitalism is wonderful for anyone who has a comfortable and steady income, Jamaal510 Jun 2012 #136
Non-existent. daaron Jun 2012 #137
Capitalism is a system of production for exchange on a market, as opposed to production for use. Puregonzo1188 Jun 2012 #139
Mostly good but there are unhappy side effects aikoaiko Jun 2012 #143
Thanks to Skinner, mairead, randome, Starry Messenger, et al.... kentuck Jun 2012 #144
Very well said Mairead Jun 2012 #146
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Capitalism - Good or bad ...»Reply #102