General Discussion

Zalatix

(8,994 posts)

115. Yes indeedy it does. And sometimes armed revolutions do make things worse.

Fri Jun 8, 2012, 10:00 PM

Jun 2012

The Western world is plagued by 3 major job killers: offshoring, automation and productivity increases.

We need to stop that cycle. If we do not, we could face a rebellion by the poor and unemployed like they rebelled in the Middle East. Offshoring will stop. Automation will stop. Productivity will grind to a halt. The economy will do more than just collapse.

Offshoring, automation and productivity increases, are not gods we should be afraid to offend. Everyone says "if we put the brakes on any of those factors, it's the end of the world". No, less automation, less offshoring and a slowing of productivity growth are not going to bring an economy to a halt. An angry populace of unemployed, desperate people, however, can bring a nation to a halt. Economy and all. This JUST happened in the Middle East; we're just fooling ourselves if we think it can't happen here.

Globalization, technology and endless productivity growth aren't as important as jobs, jobs, jobs.

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Italian Grocer Deploys �Scan and Bag�-Style Technology [View all] Sherman A1 Jun 2012 OP

One of our local Giant supermarkets does this LiberalEsto Jun 2012 #1

Spam deleted by Violet_Crumble (MIR Team) Vincent89 Jun 2012 #2

Not a good thing at all. This technology means someone loses a job. GoneOffShore Jun 2012 #3

Just like when the mechanized loom was invented (nt) Nye Bevan Jun 2012 #5

Agreed Sherman A1 Jun 2012 #10

So you want unnecessary busy work for people, so long as they get a paycheck? alcibiades_mystery Jun 2012 #11

Really? Where? Have you seen the unemployment rate lately? Zalatix Jun 2012 #15

If accountancy firms would get rid of computers, and hire an army of people with quill pens, Nye Bevan Jun 2012 #18

And if every job you could hope to have was automated Zalatix Jun 2012 #19

I don't believe you've thought this through carefully enough Mairead Jun 2012 #59

The customer also labors to select the items alcibiades_mystery Jun 2012 #64

Completely different issue. The customer benefits from selecting. Mairead Jun 2012 #80

At a point in time Sherman A1 Jun 2012 #84

Vincent89 is just trying to build up a post count siligut Jun 2012 #12

It would appear Sherman A1 Jun 2012 #85

It would also appear that he's disappeared. GoneOffShore Jun 2012 #91

Precisely! LiberalEsto Jun 2012 #13

Do you refuse to ride in elevators without elevator operators? Freddie Stubbs Jun 2012 #14

Perhaps you should read this. Zalatix Jun 2012 #17

I don't use the scanners at all and try not to use self-checkouts for CTyankee Jun 2012 #74

No, it means a higher paying job has more work.. snooper2 Jun 2012 #20

There aren't very many jobs of that type. Certainly not as many as the jobs it eliminates. Zalatix Jun 2012 #96

in china. HiPointDem Jun 2012 #127

To this day I hold a grudge against Ford 4th law of robotics Jun 2012 #47

It would be fine if our advancing civilization was advancing towards jp11 Jun 2012 #109

It isn't? 4th law of robotics Jun 2012 #135

here here... what we should do is emulate the Amish belcffub Jun 2012 #48

Or we could just wait until technology makes most of humanity redundant and unnecessary. Zalatix Jun 2012 #89

They are just "throwaway people" SoCalDem Jun 2012 #114

Yup, and that's what causes rebellions. Zalatix Jun 2012 #116

Hasn't that been happening all along then, though? treestar Jun 2012 #120

In the past. Now we have hit the tipping point. Zalatix Jun 2012 #125

I've been shopping like this for years at my local Stop & Shop. Nye Bevan Jun 2012 #4

Same here SickOfTheOnePct Jun 2012 #21

How odd. I always get a smile and a cheery word from the cashier Mairead Jun 2012 #61

As do I SickOfTheOnePct Jun 2012 #78

Yet you still trade there? I wouldn't. Mairead Jun 2012 #81

Agreed Sherman A1 Jun 2012 #83

It's the closest store to my house SickOfTheOnePct Jun 2012 #86

Ahold uses those in their Giant stores. Silly devices. I've watched people shoplift. HopeHoops Jun 2012 #6

Here in Oregon, all fuel is pumped by an attendant, always. 'Self service' is not allowed. Bluenorthwest Jun 2012 #8

That's good. I've seen people smoking while they pump gas. That frightens me. HopeHoops Jun 2012 #9

LOL, was smoking at the pump a while back at QuickTrip snooper2 Jun 2012 #30

That is correct - the open flame is the issue. Still, I've seen that. HopeHoops Jun 2012 #31

The guy in the video is an idiot. Hassin Bin Sober Jun 2012 #32

You didn't do well in chemistry did you :) snooper2 Jun 2012 #34

Not sure what this video has to do with anything? Hassin Bin Sober Jun 2012 #36

"Given the appropriate conditions" is the hang-up, here. Robb Jun 2012 #39

How can you say the conditions do not exist? Hassin Bin Sober Jun 2012 #45

Simple. Robb Jun 2012 #46

The vapors are not in an enclosed space. But the vapors are concentrated at the fill point. Hassin Bin Sober Jun 2012 #56

Sure. But insufficiently. Robb Jun 2012 #60

Before you start accusing people of not doing well in chemistry class Blecht Jun 2012 #42

Robb is all over it snooper2 Jun 2012 #49

I am a smoker, but I am not crazy enough to smoke while pumping gas. n/t RebelOne Jun 2012 #44

Question??........ mrmpa Jun 2012 #35

If you don't have a so-called "loyalty" card, they have to scan a store card. HopeHoops Jun 2012 #40

Good to know. Thank you. eom mrmpa Jun 2012 #82

Local product making international splash.... Bluenorthwest Jun 2012 #7

local K mart have a few of the scanners ... littlewolf Jun 2012 #16

I. Can't. Believe. Capt. Obvious Jun 2012 #22

Not a new thing. Nye Bevan Jun 2012 #23

You will never make a credible case for more automation when we have so many people unemployed. Zalatix Jun 2012 #25

Despite your hysteria Capt. Obvious Jun 2012 #27

Your ostrich reasoning cannot answer one basic question Zalatix Jun 2012 #51

Maybe they can dig ditches Capt. Obvious Jun 2012 #57

Obviously you don't realize how serious the unemployment problem is. Zalatix Jun 2012 #62

What is the self-described DEMOCRAT Nancy Pelosi doing about these bag boy/clerk jobs? Capt. Obvious Jun 2012 #68

Oh that bullshit "Nancy Pelosi is a Plutocrat" crap again? Zalatix Jun 2012 #70

I told you - give one of them your job Capt. Obvious Jun 2012 #72

Perhaps your tune will change when your job is automated away Zalatix Jun 2012 #75

And maybe you'll walk your talk Capt. Obvious Jun 2012 #77

Your challenge is bullshit. Zalatix Jun 2012 #87

BTW I notice you have nothing to offer all the people who are losing their jobs because of this. Zalatix Jun 2012 #90

The dirty little secret is that no one knows what to do with the unemployed. former9thward Jun 2012 #102

Thanks for an honest answer. That's a rarity in society now. Zalatix Jun 2012 #105

You mention the Middle East. former9thward Jun 2012 #110

Yes indeedy it does. And sometimes armed revolutions do make things worse. Zalatix Jun 2012 #115

We used to have techs manually configure switches and equipment for provisioning of telecom services snooper2 Jun 2012 #138

Yes I can do this for hours. Years, in fact. Show us the job boom. Where is it? Zalatix Jun 2012 #151

And outsourcing continues too... LanternWaste Jun 2012 #52

The system will collapse in on itself as unemployment continues to grow. Zalatix Jun 2012 #53

We all prognosticate, and pretend we know what will happen. LanternWaste Jun 2012 #79

I am very confident about EXACTLY what will happen. Zalatix Jun 2012 #88

Does that go for all automation then? NYC Liberal Jun 2012 #33

These are not self checkouts as we are accustomed to seeing Sherman A1 Jun 2012 #38

That exists now Capt. Obvious Jun 2012 #41

We're either going to address the accelerating loss of jobs Zalatix Jun 2012 #95

This is good. Let's not pretend corporate stores haven't been cutting staff RadiationTherapy Jun 2012 #24

Made in China, not the USA. Zalatix Jun 2012 #26

I am not going to fall for any nonsense such as freezing technology and innovation RadiationTherapy Jun 2012 #28

And I ain't baggin my own feckin groceries either. 10% off or the line waits! RadiationTherapy Jun 2012 #29

Then you will fall for increasing unemployment. Enjoy! Zalatix Jun 2012 #50

You have a few areas of confusion. The devices the OP speaks of are hand held pods, not self Bluenorthwest Jun 2012 #139

Growth and loss, but over time things will balance out. Zalatix Jun 2012 #152

Stores do need to be restocked, however Sherman A1 Jun 2012 #37

It will be just like The Jetsons Capt. Obvious Jun 2012 #43

Keep dreaming. Zalatix Jun 2012 #54

What the Jetsons never showed you was why "everyone" drove around in flying cars and lived haele Jun 2012 #55

Your mind can come with even better scenarios Capt. Obvious Jun 2012 #58

Haele has a real point. All you've got is snark. Zalatix Jun 2012 #63

All you have is laughable hysteria Capt. Obvious Jun 2012 #67

All you have is an ignorant ostrich approach. Zalatix Jun 2012 #69

And you don't care about the unemployed switchboard operators Capt. Obvious Jun 2012 #71

And you don't care about unemployed people at all. Zalatix Jun 2012 #73

Now that is shockingly insightful. Come to think of it you never did see the Earth's surface Zalatix Jun 2012 #65

Thanks for playing... Sen. Walter Sobchak Jun 2012 #100

Oh now you've done it. mythology Jun 2012 #111

Indeed... Sen. Walter Sobchak Jun 2012 #117

Thanks for bringing those up - haele Jun 2012 #154

As usual, the employment issue comes to bear. haele Jun 2012 #66

Ever notice how you bring up the unemployment issue and everyone avoids it? Zalatix Jun 2012 #92

No one is ignoring SickOfTheOnePct Jun 2012 #93

So you're on board to see unemployment increase unabated. Gotcha. Zalatix Jun 2012 #94

Why are you on a computer? SickOfTheOnePct Jun 2012 #97

What are you going to do when your job gets automated Zalatix Jun 2012 #98

Should it ever happen, I'll be sure to let you know SickOfTheOnePct Jun 2012 #101

LOL that's your problem. You think you're immune. Zalatix Jun 2012 #103

Nope, no belief that I'm immune SickOfTheOnePct Jun 2012 #104

And what will you do if it does happen, and you can't find another job? Zalatix Jun 2012 #106

No, I won't SickOfTheOnePct Jun 2012 #108

You'll deal with it by being unemployed. How much can you buy on $0 an hour? Zalatix Jun 2012 #112

Well at least you answered SickOfTheOnePct Jun 2012 #113

Not a dishonest answer, just not one you want to hear. Zalatix Jun 2012 #123

Unless you are in NJ or Oregon, you probably pump all of your own gas and refuse assistance Bluenorthwest Jun 2012 #145

Actually that's one of several things I wrote my state assemblyman about. So, next try please? Zalatix Jun 2012 #149

Why didn't that happen before? treestar Jun 2012 #121

It didn't happen before because we had new industries creating lots of jobs. Zalatix Jun 2012 #124

OF course there are new industries treestar Jun 2012 #126

Please re-read carefully. I said, no new industries that are creating LOTS of jobs. Zalatix Jun 2012 #131

I don't see the statistics on this anywhere treestar Jun 2012 #132

Of course you don't see the new job boom being created Zalatix Jun 2012 #136

Neither of us knows treestar Jun 2012 #146

As I said, show me the job boom, otherwise you really don't have a good argument here. Zalatix Jun 2012 #150

Straw man. I don't have to show a "job boom." treestar Jun 2012 #153

Yes you do have to show it. The jobs overall and relative to the population have NOT increased. Zalatix Jun 2012 #155

The only supermarket I've seen use hand-held scanners in the UK is a cooperative muriel_volestrangler Jun 2012 #129

That's because when workers control the work place, they say 'being a checker sucks and is Bluenorthwest Jun 2012 #141

Not only is it physically strenuous it is mentally draining SickOfTheOnePct Jun 2012 #142

This turned into an amazing thread Capt. Obvious Jun 2012 #76

I worked for a retailer that mucked around with all this... Sen. Walter Sobchak Jun 2012 #99

Indeed Sherman A1 Jun 2012 #118

There wasn't even a reduction in staff Sen. Walter Sobchak Jun 2012 #128

There may not have been a staff reduction at your store Sherman A1 Jun 2012 #130

I don't dispute that, Sen. Walter Sobchak Jun 2012 #133

I hate those scanners. Blue_In_AK Jun 2012 #107

But then they create jobs for scanner makers treestar Jun 2012 #122

The person can see how much they are spending as they go along treestar Jun 2012 #119

Good point Sherman A1 Jun 2012 #140

This is news? I just did it an hour ago dont hassle the hoff Jun 2012 #134

Wow Sherman A1 Jun 2012 #137

Where did you use a hand held pod device to shop in the US? Bluenorthwest Jun 2012 #143

Giant has had them here in NOVA for two or three years now SickOfTheOnePct Jun 2012 #144

So just as in Italy, the system you use is a customer choice option.... Bluenorthwest Jun 2012 #147

Absolutely SickOfTheOnePct Jun 2012 #148