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SeattleVet

(5,869 posts)

82. Basing allowed sales on a greatly flawed list isn't a great idea.

Sat Jun 18, 2016, 08:06 PM

Jun 2016

I share a name with over 200 other people in the country. One of them may have done something at some time to raise suspicions, so for the past 15 years every time I try to fly I get a boarding pass with a series of 'S's' across the bottom, and have to undergo 'enhanced screening'. "Step behind the screen. Please unbuckle your belt and open the front of your pants. Stand here with your arms out and legs spread. I'm going to touch you *here* now..."

I have a metal plate in my leg, and that usually gets a reaction, too. One guy grabbed my leg, felt nothing but flesh (the plate was installed in the mid-70's after I broke my femur) and realized that he should NOT have grabbed me that way...apologized to hell and back, but I think he was worried about what it was going to look like I complained and they reviewed the video of the screening area.

How are they going to verify that the 'name on the list' is actually the person that is *supposed* to be on their list? I can see several major lawsuits in the future if they try to do it this way.

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I don't think it's a good idea to restrict Constitutional rights based on a government watch list [View all] davidn3600 Jun 2016 OP

I'm a big fan of due process and I agree with you (nt) Nye Bevan Jun 2016 #1

Would an appeals process allow for due process? Nt moriah Jun 2016 #4

There is no apeals process. oneshooter Jun 2016 #17

If you were denied only for that reason, and told, you'd learn.... moriah Jun 2016 #18

Or possably learn by a visit from a Federal Agent..............or two. n/t oneshooter Jun 2016 #19

Yeah. And sometimes that may be needed, if they are actually *trained* properly. moriah Jun 2016 #20

Actually that's why the head of the FBI opposed using the Terror Watch List in such a way. PoliticAverse Jun 2016 #31

Maybe I just don't get that logic. But I'm weird. moriah Jun 2016 #34

I believe he is saying Lonusca Jun 2016 #93

So take the right away without due process, but give you due process to get it back? X_Digger Jun 2016 #42

If they don't own the gun yet, it's not their property, and "due process".... moriah Jun 2016 #44

It's called prior restraint. X_Digger Jun 2016 #48

The government cannot stop you from keeping your guns, or bearing them (even if there are SCOTUS ... moriah Jun 2016 #54

Too cute by half reasoning doesn't cut it. X_Digger Jun 2016 #55

But not immediate purchase or unregulated purchase. moriah Jun 2016 #59

Quick quiz: Who said, "A right delayed is a right denied." No googling. X_Digger Jun 2016 #60

If you equate the right to vote with the "right" to purchase a Sig Sauer MCX immediately... moriah Jun 2016 #65

I don't pick and choose which rights I protect. I'll leave that to republicans. X_Digger Jun 2016 #66

It was quiet enough, with loud music, that many people thought the gunshots were sound effects. moriah Jun 2016 #74

At a club pumping out 120db+ music, yes. Fucking duh. X_Digger Jun 2016 #76

I support life. moriah Jun 2016 #78

"I support life." is a platitude. We can see exactly what you support. X_Digger Jun 2016 #81

I support the right to go to a club I would have felt safe in and not get shot. Aka, life. moriah Jun 2016 #88

Oh, anyone who reads can see what you mean. Just scroll through your replies in this subthread. n/t X_Digger Jun 2016 #92

I noticed you didn't respond to my post regarding my reaction to the tragedy. moriah Jun 2016 #94

By the way, here's what I finally wrote when I could find words for Orlando. moriah Jun 2016 #89

The military version comes with a 3 position ssfety oneshooter Jun 2016 #73

I'm honestly, as I said, less familiar with modern rifles. moriah Jun 2016 #75

For many military operations oneshooter Jun 2016 #85

---> Petrushka Jun 2016 #83

Then if we aren't limited to rights guaranteed by the Constitution for this discussion.... moriah Jun 2016 #87

There is no right to due process when it comes to a privilege... scscholar Jun 2016 #79

It's a right, not a privilege whether you like it or not friendly_iconoclast Jun 2016 #91

On a theoretical level, I see your point. But on a real-life level, I don't know anyone MH1 Jun 2016 #2

I have been on the FAA No Fly list at least since 12/2001. Dustlawyer Jun 2016 #3

A few days ago in Orlado safeinOhio Jun 2016 #5

They would be just as dead if Mateen had used a straw buyer a la the San Bernadino... friendly_iconoclast Jun 2016 #7

Mateen wouldn't have been prevented from buying a gun EL34x4 Jun 2016 #29

Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness . . . leanforward Jun 2016 #6

Al FREAKING Gore was on a no fly list! tblue37 Jun 2016 #8

Well said. Just reading posts Jun 2016 #9

It's already a slide, my issue is the government is always trying to privatize stuff HereSince1628 Jun 2016 #10

I ain't taking your bait. trumad Jun 2016 #11

I guess that's one way to evade debate wen you can't justify your stance. Lee-Lee Jun 2016 #12

No I just evade debating gun humpers. trumad Jun 2016 #13

A wise move, if one has no logical response friendly_iconoclast Jun 2016 #22

A wise move since one hates to debate morans. trumad Jun 2016 #24

You should learn to be more tolerant, I debate the half-clever who use eye speech... friendly_iconoclast Jun 2016 #26

Tolerant of gun humpers... trumad Jun 2016 #35

Why not? I tolerate knee-jerk bigots, and even engage in conversation with them... friendly_iconoclast Jun 2016 #67

Don't tolerate them either trumad Jun 2016 #70

That must make it difficult to look in a mirror, as I have seen nothing *but*... friendly_iconoclast Jun 2016 #71

Hillarious sarisataka Jun 2016 #27

There is a reason guns control is a smoking wreck in America hack89 Jun 2016 #32

If you're going to define all "pro-gunners" as "morans", then you've just said "one hates to debate" Donald Ian Rankin Jun 2016 #49

Jury results: Auggie Jun 2016 #56

No, same reason we ignore idiotic GOP voters, not worth the effort. nt Logical Jun 2016 #43

You are not an objective poster. nt Logical Jun 2016 #72

Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2016 #40

Imagine if a southern state or Trunp admin formed a "vote fraud watch list" Lee-Lee Jun 2016 #14

Why stretch? Igel Jun 2016 #15

Vote fraud is small potatos sarisataka Jun 2016 #25

That's true- wait till someone on assistance commits some terrorist act Lee-Lee Jun 2016 #28

I agree. geomon666 Jun 2016 #16

Then let the courts decide brentspeak Jun 2016 #21

you know that the "slippery slope" is a FALLACY, right? maxsolomon Jun 2016 #23

Well then... I guess it's OK for the GOP to limit the voting rights of minorities then? davidn3600 Jun 2016 #38

yes. that's exactly what i meant. maxsolomon Jun 2016 #39

Yelling fire in a crowded theatre is not illegal. NutmegYankee Jun 2016 #45

ok, then. libel. maxsolomon Jun 2016 #95

Libel is a civil tort - and at its core requires a false statement. NutmegYankee Jun 2016 #96

yes,anyone with a desire for an assault weapon should be denied and watched, absolutely swhisper1 Jun 2016 #30

I'm a white middle-aged man. I do business around the world. tonyt53 Jun 2016 #33

Some may not like the reference felix_numinous Jun 2016 #36

It won't get struck down, you just get a hearing Drahthaardogs Jun 2016 #37

We have folks still alive who remember Nixon, McCarthy, and J Edgar Hoover X_Digger Jun 2016 #41

Yeah. librarylu Jun 2016 #86

You need to have a hearing, some sort of due process. uppityperson Jun 2016 #46

im only in my 30's beergood Jun 2016 #47

Well buying a military grade weapon shouldn't be a constitutional right so it all evens out... n/t leeroysphitz Jun 2016 #50

It depends on who is in power....if we're in control we can ensure the right people get on the list. ileus Jun 2016 #51

the Constitution started being shredded by Nixon's DEA and it was set afire by the Enabling Act of hobbit709 Jun 2016 #52

It would e better to stem the flow of arms to mass murderers at the start by baldguy Jun 2016 #53

No, guns need to be licensed and insured like cars. alarimer Jun 2016 #57

While I like the idea of insurance on gun owners Wayburn Jun 2016 #84

Then the solution is to repeal the 2nd Amendment Orrex Jun 2016 #58

What other parts of the Bill of Rights do you want to abolish "to keep us safe"? Odin2005 Jun 2016 #63

Which other amendment's used to justify the purchase of semi-automatic murder weapons? Orrex Jun 2016 #64

That's not an answer to the question asked- but you knew that already... friendly_iconoclast Jun 2016 #68

"secret Lists" are never a good thing. Why not simply ban sales of military grade weaponry? -nt- NorthCarolina Jun 2016 #61

The number of DUers who are now OK with the terror watch list is frightening. Odin2005 Jun 2016 #62

I remember when it was virginia mountainman Jun 2016 #69

All I really want is for the people on the list to have a delay while due process straightens out... moriah Jun 2016 #77

This message was self-deleted by its author rjsquirrel Jun 2016 #80

Basing allowed sales on a greatly flawed list isn't a great idea. SeattleVet Jun 2016 #82

The keepers of thee watch lists probably aren't too eager to share either. JVS Jun 2016 #90

I don't think so, either. Iggo Jun 2016 #97