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AntiBank

(1,339 posts)

92. Brussels was never going to reform, that's pie in the sky wishful thinking

Fri Jun 24, 2016, 07:03 AM

Jun 2016

Maybe Germany will make last ditch attempts after more nations leave, but that a day late and a pound short. Make NO mistake, the internal inertia and stated drive of the EU project was always going to be pressurisation towards a "more complete union2, and that IS by its very nature, a sovereignty-robbing process.

As for you over the top, dodgy appeals to some imaginary "coming war", I would like to remind you that NO fully democratic, capitalist nation has every in history went to war with another. Finland fought against the Allies in WWII, but that was almost complete against the USSR, due to the secret codicils of the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact and after the Moscow armistice, they turned on the Nazis in the Lapland war.

As for this statement you made

"Nationalism is always a bad thing, and it is a particularly bad thing in Europe." it is ludicrous. The post-Westphalian nation state, when run via full democratic means, is the pinnacle of human political development so far in our 2 million plus years of human or hominid existence.

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England should feel the consequences for voting to leave the EU. [View all] Meldread Jun 2016 OP

Nope, don't think so Kilgore Jun 2016 #1

you are correct swhisper1 Jun 2016 #6

Give this poster a medal Corporate666 Jun 2016 #19

Pretty much. romanic Jun 2016 #54

Pour encouragez les autres, the EU MUST give harsh terms to the UK, otherwise OnDoutside Jun 2016 #82

So, you are saying that the UK needs those imports from the EU. DetlefK Jun 2016 #94

Yeah, let's start a cold war with one of our oldest and closest allies. brentspeak Jun 2016 #2

They aren't our allies any more treestar Jun 2016 #102

O.o Hydra Jun 2016 #108

I'm just pissed treestar Jun 2016 #113

EU does need to be reformed swhisper1 Jun 2016 #3

All of Europe will be hurt because of this, but especially the UK still_one Jun 2016 #4

The Germans aren't stupid. roamer65 Jun 2016 #5

probably swhisper1 Jun 2016 #7

The politics of this trumps the economics. Meldread Jun 2016 #9

"the people in the EU countries are more likely to blame the UK for leaving than those in Brussels." sibelian Jun 2016 #42

Yeah, I just got off the phone with her. We had a pleasant conversation. Meldread Jun 2016 #48

Unfortunately what you propose would just strengthen that nationalism Scootaloo Jun 2016 #93

I think this is the best argument against what I have written. Meldread Jun 2016 #110

Well, Britain leaving the EU removes it from the benefits of EU membership Scootaloo Jun 2016 #114

Huge opportunity for UK banking industry Kilgore Jun 2016 #8

LOL. The City will lose its #2 to #5 position in just 10 years Albertoo Jun 2016 #10

Correct. Already... Meldread Jun 2016 #12

France has zero chance in hell Albertoo Jun 2016 #28

Bravo! Kilgore Jun 2016 #41

It will be Frankfurt - bet the farm on it. nt pkdu Jun 2016 #52

I doubt it, Frankfurt is not anglophone friendly. Sen. Walter Sobchak Jun 2016 #89

Sounds like socialism treestar Jun 2016 #104

Paris will be the Martin O'Malley of the fight between Frankfurt and Amsterdam (nt) Recursion Jun 2016 #76

Brilliant! JustAnotherGen Jun 2016 #105

See you in ten Kilgore Jun 2016 #14

If it doesn't, brace for the worst in Europe Albertoo Jun 2016 #30

I completely agree Kilgore Jun 2016 #32

Agree. 840high Jun 2016 #63

Look up what "passporting" is and then reconsider your position Sen. Walter Sobchak Jun 2016 #15

Think about the tendency of bankers Kilgore Jun 2016 #23

You might have noticed the bankers were the most strident opponets of Brexit Sen. Walter Sobchak Jun 2016 #36

just like the USA mega banksters were the amongst most AntiBank Jun 2016 #60

The United Kingdom becoming the Hermit Kingdom is of no benefit to the "banksters" Sen. Walter Sobchak Jun 2016 #73

you really need to ask the Swiss and my Norse neighbours AntiBank Jun 2016 #74

Switzerland and Norway are both part of the Single Market Sen. Walter Sobchak Jun 2016 #84

The irony of people who support Brexit here is that... Meldread Jun 2016 #86

It's why I reject the "trendy left" Sen. Walter Sobchak Jun 2016 #88

Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2016 #78

What about the savings from not giving their money to the EU yeoman6987 Jun 2016 #87

Netherlands leaving? Mandos the Judge Jun 2016 #100

Nope. Are_grits_groceries Jun 2016 #106

^^^ Hear, hear: London's status as the economic capital of Europe ended today ^^^ Albertoo Jun 2016 #33

I'm going to miss Canary Wharf and LCY Sen. Walter Sobchak Jun 2016 #40

France is regretfully dead Albertoo Jun 2016 #43

Why in the hell would that happen? Without the same access to mainland Europe, where will they grow? Zynx Jun 2016 #35

Exactly. sibelian Jun 2016 #37

Deregulating banks was such a good idea Agnosticsherbet Jun 2016 #57

London actually voted BlueMTexpat Jun 2016 #90

UK banking shares are down about 20% muriel_volestrangler Jun 2016 #97

Europe and the EU will go on their merry way without the UK Sen. Walter Sobchak Jun 2016 #11

I agree, but... Meldread Jun 2016 #18

The problems faced by the EU are little differant than our's Sen. Walter Sobchak Jun 2016 #26

You nailed it with this post! Native Jun 2016 #98

Fuck Europe Boudica the Lyoness Jun 2016 #13

Wheeee!!! sibelian Jun 2016 #38

Get in line behind Zeus. DetlefK Jun 2016 #95

Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2016 #16

I would argue the EU has NOT been keeping the stability...at least not as of late davidn3600 Jun 2016 #17

WTF? They have a right to choose their own path just like everybody else. Quackers Jun 2016 #20

They do have the right to choose their own path. However, that does not mean... Meldread Jun 2016 #31

Well said Meldread. The question is whether those running the EU have the cojones to do so. OnDoutside Jun 2016 #83

Flat out SICK, if you ask me. sibelian Jun 2016 #39

The Swiss have done just fine outside of the EU. roamer65 Jun 2016 #21

The Swiss never joined. BlueMTexpat Jun 2016 #91

You are proposing a trade war that would likely trigger a global recession. tritsofme Jun 2016 #22

ease into the TPP?????? AntiBank Jun 2016 #75

Of course they are, that's why a lot of the outrage here over this Hydra Jun 2016 #109

Close your eyes. Now open them again. cherokeeprogressive Jun 2016 #24

More likely other EU countries will have to learn from the UK Democat Jun 2016 #25

+1 840high Jun 2016 #65

The EU has destroyed Greece TexasMommaWithAHat Jun 2016 #27

don't forget Goldman Sachs foundational role in crushing Greece. AntiBank Jun 2016 #77

Exactly. TexasMommaWithAHat Jun 2016 #96

Have you re-read your post in retrospect? Corporate666 Jun 2016 #29

Where did I say that the UK shouldn't exercise their freedom to leave? Meldread Jun 2016 #44

Well, that was an.... interesting? post Corporate666 Jun 2016 #50

By that line of reasoning, any state could leave the United States. Meldread Jun 2016 #53

The EU is nothing like the USA Corporate666 Jun 2016 #56

But here's the rub.... Mandos the Judge Jun 2016 #111

Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2016 #51

Exactly Corporate666 Jun 2016 #62

It's a divorce The2ndWheel Jun 2016 #58

Some seem to think that Corporate666 Jun 2016 #71

Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2016 #70

If it has a bad effect on us (which could be exaggerated) treestar Jun 2016 #107

Oh, don't worry, we will. auntpurl Jun 2016 #34

This is EXACTLY what I am afraid of--this is why I feel so strongly. Meldread Jun 2016 #46

Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2016 #49

ridiculous over the top hyperbole AntiBank Jun 2016 #79

You want German justice for England Renew Deal Jun 2016 #45

Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2016 #47

You get it. 840high Jun 2016 #66

Yes, The EU must crush the UK for daring to dissent. "Join or die," it what you are saying! Binkie The Clown Jun 2016 #55

Um, no. Meldread Jun 2016 #64

that's a main point. Many of us want the EU to collapse. AntiBank Jun 2016 #80

No one "stole" their sovereignty. Every single nation joined the EU willingly. Meldread Jun 2016 #85

Brussels was never going to reform, that's pie in the sky wishful thinking AntiBank Jun 2016 #92

It's not that the EU should do this. joshcryer Jun 2016 #59

England is its own country - if they want to leave they should be allowed to. Silver_Witch Jun 2016 #61

Britain will be fine. 840high Jun 2016 #67

Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2016 #68

Over time, best solution I believe. Sovereignty crucial. May prevent future global elite. George Eliot Jun 2016 #69

No, don't do anything. We made our own bed as a nation and now we'll lie in it. Dalziel3979 Jun 2016 #72

Bless you, Meldread, for this cogent and well-informed OP. Surya Gayatri Jun 2016 #81

Punish punish punish n2doc Jun 2016 #99

The Democratic Party establishment could learn a thing or two from this Seeking Serenity Jun 2016 #112

EU is going to fall apart. deaniac21 Jun 2016 #101

The new Germany treestar Jun 2016 #103