General Discussion

Albertoo

(2,016 posts)

21. I agree with some of your points, but you still do not solve the BLM conundrum

Sun Jul 10, 2016, 10:18 PM

Jul 2016

while your individual sentences make sense, there is a leap in quantification

We agree on different points
- excessive use of force by police can happen
- (it probably happens more to people of lower income groups)
- historically, blacks have been oppressed

Now, between a black victim of such violence and Dylan Nobles, what applies? When was the police officer out of bounds? Intentionally or not? Was he a sadist? Had he a conscious racial animus?

The problem with BLM is that it appears to automatically, systematically sacribe police use of force to an excessive use of force (before it's proven or dismissed) due to racism (before it's proven or dismissed)

It is in that automaticity that I find a counter animus, a claim that all blacks would be systematically targeted and oppressed. That broad brush claim can only feed on itself.

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The problem with saying "All Lives Matter" [View all] gollygee Jul 2016 OP

K&R nt Xipe Totec Jul 2016 #1

I disagree. The BLM slogan can become exclusive. Albertoo Jul 2016 #2

Post removed Post removed Jul 2016 #5

+1 bravenak Jul 2016 #8

I agree with you. Nt metroins Jul 2016 #9

I don't recall white people being lynched.. HipChick Jul 2016 #10

Thanks for helping me make my point: BLM exists because of the past Albertoo Jul 2016 #12

Tell that to the generations that have been dehumanized.. HipChick Jul 2016 #15

And? Generalising grudges over the past makes a worse world, not a better one. Albertoo Jul 2016 #17

grudges over the past? KMOD Jul 2016 #19

Aristotle wrote "who loves in excess can hate in excess" Albertoo Jul 2016 #22

You honestly find it excessive? KMOD Jul 2016 #31

That is not what I wrote Albertoo Jul 2016 #51

So you deny that racial injustice continues to be an issue? KMOD Jul 2016 #63

No, I did not say that either Albertoo Jul 2016 #67

"The statement that Black lives are systematically willfully dehumanized is excessive" kwassa Jul 2016 #38

OK I'll take your challenge: educate me on the statement I made Albertoo Jul 2016 #43

Institutional racism is willful, and systematic. kwassa Jul 2016 #80

Oh really? ismnotwasm Jul 2016 #44

Slavery is now a Generalized grudge? HipChick Jul 2016 #33

A useful solution to solving the problems affecting black lives, KMOD Jul 2016 #16

I agree with some of your points, but you still do not solve the BLM conundrum Albertoo Jul 2016 #21

When black men are killed by police KMOD Jul 2016 #26

Or holding a puppy! (14-year-old choked but thankfully not killed) gollygee Jul 2016 #32

To talk about systemic racism, nothing can be more clear than NYC's "broken window" policy. rusty quoin Jul 2016 #36

Progress will be made when people on both sides can Igel Jul 2016 #76

Couldn't Agree More RobinA Jul 2016 #120

The past? You mean all of a few years ago? Rex Jul 2016 #18

BLM is not the best advocate for racial equality IMHO Albertoo Jul 2016 #25

No they don't. KMOD Jul 2016 #28

Excessive claims were made about Trayvon Martin or Michael Brown Albertoo Jul 2016 #35

What? rusty quoin Jul 2016 #42

Whoo said 'nothing'? Albertoo Jul 2016 #64

Yeah. Brown charged a police car? rusty quoin Jul 2016 #86

Misrepresenting what I say isn't proper discussion. Where do I support Zimmerman? Albertoo Jul 2016 #89

You sound like a bigoted right wing troll. Tread lightly. Liberal_Stalwart71 Jul 2016 #113

I suppose anyone who doesn't absolutely share your views sounds like a RW troll? Albertoo Jul 2016 #115

Here.... Liberal_Stalwart71 Jul 2016 #132

Excessive claims? KMOD Jul 2016 #48

In neither case was a racial animus the most likely cause of the death Albertoo Jul 2016 #58

Once again, KMOD Jul 2016 #62

I Would Disagree RobinA Jul 2016 #121

The police are ill-equipped in dealing with KMOD Jul 2016 #130

If you think Treyvon Martin's execution had nothing to do with race giftedgirl77 Jul 2016 #56

+100 nt gollygee Jul 2016 #57

So you think Latinos hate Blacks, is that it? Albertoo Jul 2016 #61

Do you think Latinos can't have prejudice? KMOD Jul 2016 #66

But was it the key motivation of Zimmerman? I do not think so. Albertoo Jul 2016 #70

Zimmerman shot an unarmed kid walking home from the store. Rex Jul 2016 #75

Yes. Now show me racism was central to the case. Albertoo Jul 2016 #78

Here ya go, now what? Rex Jul 2016 #83

He stalked Trayvon KMOD Jul 2016 #79

I detailed the case as I see it in post #70 Albertoo Jul 2016 #82

Martin made gang signs? You just keep making that stuff up. Rex Jul 2016 #85

Yes, we have evidence T Martin sometimes did gang signs Albertoo Jul 2016 #91

Yeah that is what I thought. Rex Jul 2016 #92

I stick to facts Albertoo Jul 2016 #94

Facts? I haven't seen you bring up one fact yet. Just letting everyone know you got caught. Rex Jul 2016 #95

Caught? You're dreaming :) Albertoo Jul 2016 #99

Nice strawman you built there, nobody ever said what you are claiming. Rex Jul 2016 #101

So does my 6-year-old daughter gollygee Jul 2016 #93

And? All I said was that we do not **know** how Zimmerman picked his 'suspects' Albertoo Jul 2016 #96

LOL gollygee Jul 2016 #98

Look, for argument sake, let's say Zimmerman was a racist Albertoo Jul 2016 #102

Zimmerman isn't the only person involved gollygee Jul 2016 #125

I think Zimmerman was a mild loon and that his case did not reflect on anything much Albertoo Jul 2016 #127

He found a black teen, suspective. KMOD Jul 2016 #97

We can agree on the fact was a weirdo, but YOU might have been a suspect Albertoo Jul 2016 #103

OK, this is just silly at this point. KMOD Jul 2016 #105

I know what is obvious. rusty quoin Jul 2016 #107

It was horrible. KMOD Jul 2016 #111

Felix qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas Albertoo Jul 2016 #109

His history is history enough. Someone said you are obtuse. I agree. rusty quoin Jul 2016 #112

I'm like Forrest Gump, "Obtuse is as obtuse does" Albertoo Jul 2016 #116

As a Latina I am well aware that some Latinos despise blacks. giftedgirl77 Jul 2016 #119

Wow. Just wow. Albertoo Jul 2016 #126

You are flat out wrong. Rex Jul 2016 #72

We differ on two issues. I'm not sure who's wrong. Albertoo Jul 2016 #74

This is also false on it face, you been listening to faux new too long... they've been saying simila uponit7771 Jul 2016 #124

I never listen to Fox News Albertoo Jul 2016 #128

No. It isn't just the past. Lynching is a problem today, too. Did you read about the racist Kansas tblue37 Jul 2016 #24

While this is true, it was not my point Albertoo Jul 2016 #30

"Some racism rampant against some in the population?" gollygee Jul 2016 #37

It's the result of the World Attitudes Survey Albertoo Jul 2016 #40

That is a very superficial way to look at racism gollygee Jul 2016 #41

You make two interesting points Albertoo Jul 2016 #47

You should probably do some googling on this issue gollygee Jul 2016 #50

I know these facts, but they do not prove the sentence Albertoo Jul 2016 #52

You need to read about the history of our criminal justice system gollygee Jul 2016 #55

OK, I understand. We differ on just words. Albertoo Jul 2016 #59

I think you need to take a look in the mirror, but I don't expect it. rusty quoin Jul 2016 #108

+1000 Starry Messenger Jul 2016 #114

I suppose we all do have difficulties leaving our comfort zones :) Albertoo Jul 2016 #118

BLM exists because of the present, not the past. kwassa Jul 2016 #39

I understand that Albertoo Jul 2016 #73

so, police are brutal just because they are brutal? kwassa Jul 2016 #81

so, police are brutal just because they are racist? Albertoo Jul 2016 #87

That one can find examples of white victims of police brutality is unsurprising, and does nothing to fishwax Jul 2016 #110

I agree with your sentence Albertoo Jul 2016 #117

This is false on its face uponit7771 Jul 2016 #123

I think not, but I'm tired of trying to defend a moderate view on this issue Albertoo Jul 2016 #129

Lots of white people were lynched Nevernose Jul 2016 #13

They were a minority of those lynched in the south. Igel Jul 2016 #69

I don't recall hearing BLM activists saying anything Cracklin Charlie Jul 2016 #104

Agreed jack_krass Jul 2016 #20

Seriously? Raastan Jul 2016 #88

Rest assured ... 1StrongBlackMan Jul 2016 #3

You just barely missed him bravenak Jul 2016 #4

Damned cap-lock! 1StrongBlackMan Jul 2016 #6

1SBM yuiyoshida Jul 2016 #14

Well, my point was a bit more general, but OK Albertoo Jul 2016 #11

Sorry--there is no way to post fast enough to get there before someone arrives tblue37 Jul 2016 #27

There's a huge problem with it ismnotwasm Jul 2016 #7

the problem, from my point of view, with "all lives matter" is unblock Jul 2016 #23

The worst part is, they don't even believe it themselves. GoCubsGo Jul 2016 #54

A recent meme by conservatives is "Blue Lives Matter" but when shown keithbvadu2 Jul 2016 #29

"Blue" lives do not exist? RussBLib Jul 2016 #46

"Blue lives" do exist, even if keithbvadu2 Jul 2016 #53

well, it wasn't me making the claim, but RussBLib Jul 2016 #65

What is the BLM position? kentuck Jul 2016 #34

I guess ALMETPSBLMITC was too long. rusty quoin Jul 2016 #49

I would agree with you on that... kentuck Jul 2016 #60

Perhaps black people should not be targeted for traffic stops because they are black. rusty quoin Jul 2016 #77

At this point, I've come to the conclusion that TDale313 Jul 2016 #45

Does society have to approve what we think or feel? kentuck Jul 2016 #68

When I say our society is not behaving as if Black Lives Matter TDale313 Jul 2016 #90

I agree that some are indeed doing that. KMOD Jul 2016 #71

The day after the Dallas shootings Igel Jul 2016 #84

Here's my problem... Cracklin Charlie Jul 2016 #100

True, but BLM is all out there to yell at people that BLM. rusty quoin Jul 2016 #106

BLM RobinA Jul 2016 #122

Good Point Masked Dissident Jul 2016 #131