General Discussion

Shandris

(3,447 posts)

147. "Good healthy jobs" do not EXIST.

Sat Aug 20, 2016, 09:20 PM

Aug 2016

Not in number, and not in this society. But to put this in perspective...

Why don't you come live with me for a year? I won't describe my house to you, or the number of bedrooms, the locality of nearby services, or literally anything other than (for now) it's address. Don't worry, I promise I'll buy you the things I think you need for a while. You'll adapt, it's a society like any other, right? Besides, there's ALL KINDS of opportunities here that you don't have.

Of course, there are the risks. If I lie...you have no recourse. If I want to abuse you...you have no recourse while you wait for your court case to come around, and I'll use every legal trick in the book to make certain I bury you in minor trivial detail bullpoo until it's impossible for you to pay enough to win. If I don't actually buy you anything or give you money...you have no recourse. In fact, the only recourse you have about literally anything is to shut the hell up about it, because no one around here thinks the way your area does either. You're an OUTSIDER. You don't see it, but we do (just as you see me when I come to visit your area, but I don't see how I stand out).

And why should you come live with me for a year? Well, see, because I think your way of life isn't good for you. You should be GRATEFUL that I care enough about you to make you come live with me for a year. Besides, your way of life needs to be put in the past.

Now...do you have any idea why they might be reluctant to change their lives?

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Why do coal miners want to continue working such a horrible, dirty job? [View all] Fast Walker 52 Aug 2016 OP

An income is a significant motivator True Dough Aug 2016 #1

Yes, and they should be compensated for their hardship Fast Walker 52 Aug 2016 #5

But there's no guarantee that those people eased out of their jobs will have another job. Lars39 Aug 2016 #37

There is no land for new jobs to be created on. n/t X_Digger Aug 2016 #81

you mean the lung diseases associated with it lame54 Aug 2016 #56

Yeah, lung disease has long been known to be a risk of a coal mining career True Dough Aug 2016 #75

When you start at 18 and at 54 the government shuts down the mine yeoman6987 Aug 2016 #104

But not with the frequency and severe see of coal miners cap Aug 2016 #117

I'm sure not but that's up to the miner to accept the risk and nobody else. yeoman6987 Aug 2016 #123

It's good to have choices. JustABozoOnThisBus Aug 2016 #128

And nobody's handing out money to move, either. X_Digger Aug 2016 #79

All good points True Dough Aug 2016 #83

It is related. Grew up in coal country, picketed for the UMWA. X_Digger Aug 2016 #86

I have no answers for you True Dough Aug 2016 #91

Our young kinds once did the same thing w/ Detroit & the midwest for factory jobs. X_Digger Aug 2016 #93

It is a sacrifice working far from home True Dough Aug 2016 #95

You say you "can understand their fear of losing their jobs." enough Aug 2016 #2

I'm sure it's a great fear, but there are alternatives to supporting Trump Fast Walker 52 Aug 2016 #4

I have friends and family that used to work... Blanks Aug 2016 #138

They should have good jobs selling phone cases and sunglasses at the beach FrodosPet Aug 2016 #3

there are better options, and Hillary has a fairly well thought out plan Fast Walker 52 Aug 2016 #6

"Google�s plans to build a data center on the site of a recently closed coal plant in Alabama..." EL34x4 Aug 2016 #144

They probably do realize coal mining is on way out, but they hold on. And it's a GOPer state. Hoyt Aug 2016 #7

It pays big money in areas where there's no jobs for common joe. ileus Aug 2016 #8

Thanks for the insight. You're not worried about climate change? Fast Walker 52 Aug 2016 #23

And what is it that you do? Brickbat Aug 2016 #9

Why is it relevant? Fast Walker 52 Aug 2016 #25

Oh, I was just going where many other posters took you before I could get back to this. Brickbat Aug 2016 #164

You have to be kidding - it's a dying industry womanofthehills Aug 2016 #178

Yeah and I'm sure.. cannabis_flower Aug 2016 #10

I think people underestimate how little flat land there is for 'new industry'. X_Digger Aug 2016 #84

At that time, there were other industries to go to yeoman6987 Aug 2016 #107

It's all that many of them have known. Buckeye_Democrat Aug 2016 #11

true... Fast Walker 52 Aug 2016 #26

Some people work hard, some people work smart. People aren't all the same; there are differing underahedgerow Aug 2016 #12

Smart people get the best-paying jobs they can XemaSab Aug 2016 #17

Sometimes. Buckeye_Democrat Aug 2016 #19

Well, I think we can safely say it's not the influencers and tech moguls who support trump underahedgerow Aug 2016 #20

I disagree. Buckeye_Democrat Aug 2016 #24

Trump doesn't have a job. He's a con man, and that's not a job. No one would hire him or underahedgerow Aug 2016 #33

+1 TexasMommaWithAHat Aug 2016 #44

Agree about Trump. Buckeye_Democrat Aug 2016 #45

Why did you feel repulsed? n/t MicaelS Aug 2016 #55

They repulsed me because I considered their extreme love affair... Buckeye_Democrat Aug 2016 #59

That is a better explanation. MicaelS Aug 2016 #63

I majored in math and physics. Let me put it this way... Buckeye_Democrat Aug 2016 #73

Sure I understand. n/t MicaelS Aug 2016 #74

This is why I really hate the BS neo-liberal "education and retraining" talking points. Odin2005 Aug 2016 #102

They chose that over becoming stock brokers, a more horrible, dirty job. rug Aug 2016 #13

LOL, true Fast Walker 52 Aug 2016 #27

We propose much we offer little dembotoz Aug 2016 #14

True, that is a huge problem... but still, Trump? Fast Walker 52 Aug 2016 #29

Would not be my choice but I understand it dembotoz Aug 2016 #50

I live in an old coal mining area in England T_i_B Aug 2016 #15

It started in Britain because they invented the Lathe FreakinDJ Aug 2016 #30

Can't make cannons without bronze or iron, and after you've cut down all your trees... hunter Aug 2016 #70

And if you invent the steam engine.... T_i_B Aug 2016 #76

Swing and a miss - Lathes meant you could make cannons from STEEL FreakinDJ Aug 2016 #100

Coal and Steel go hand in hand T_i_B Aug 2016 #101

Hate to say it but Nuclear Energy is the only way to clean up steel production FreakinDJ Aug 2016 #113

Can it make steel cheaper than China can recycle scrap metal? T_i_B Aug 2016 #121

You still have to smealt it and China does it with coal FreakinDJ Aug 2016 #134

"Mystery Metal" is what's depressing steel prices right now T_i_B Aug 2016 #159

You absolutely described get the red out Aug 2016 #60

In some areas its the only high paying job around Travis_0004 Aug 2016 #16

"why doesn't somebody on welfare just get a higher paying job". EL34x4 Aug 2016 #64

I think a thread like this is good now and then. Not everyone knows everything or has the underahedgerow Aug 2016 #71

its a job...can't fault any one for wanting to work even though its not a great job beachbum bob Aug 2016 #18

Yep. Coal not dole. SMC22307 Aug 2016 #118

Looks like an image from the 1984 Miners Strike T_i_B Aug 2016 #122

Yep. Was he pro-Thatcher or just anti-Scargill? (n/t) SMC22307 Aug 2016 #127

He was somewhere to the right of Ghengis Khan T_i_B Aug 2016 #131

LOL gotcha. (n/t) SMC22307 Aug 2016 #135

Please, get over yourself. AngryAmish Aug 2016 #21

Gee, thanks for the insight. The question is-- is money the only reason they want to keep doing Fast Walker 52 Aug 2016 #22

Yes. Coal mining sucks and children need to eat. AngryAmish Aug 2016 #39

"The pit and the people are one and the same." SMC22307 Aug 2016 #40

Money is why nearly everyone does any job. Codeine Aug 2016 #114

Because it's still better than working at Walmart FreakinDJ Aug 2016 #28

Thank you! get the red out Aug 2016 #61

It's all they know, generational. Avalux Aug 2016 #31

I like what you way mothra1orbit Aug 2016 #36

"...they feel betrayed by the country they helped build." SMC22307 Aug 2016 #49

Because there is no vision past coal liberal N proud Aug 2016 #32

and Hillary actually has a plan for them? Will they listen to it? Fast Walker 52 Aug 2016 #34

These guys have heard plan after plan none of which came to pass. bklyncowgirl Aug 2016 #42

Exactly dembotoz Aug 2016 #51

Yup, I keep in touch with relatives who still live in coal country. X_Digger Aug 2016 #97

They need proof that something is there and will work liberal N proud Aug 2016 #65

how many times can they be lied to..... dembotoz Aug 2016 #120

They are kept uninformed for a reason liberal N proud Aug 2016 #126

Coal is being fazed out Motley13 Aug 2016 #35

Coal is being fazed out - because gas is way cheaper womanofthehills Aug 2016 #154

That's kind of like asking why poor people in inner cities don't leave. TexasMommaWithAHat Aug 2016 #38

Good point. Or like asking poor AAs in Eastern North Carolina... SMC22307 Aug 2016 #53

Unfortunately, you can't create jobs all across the country TexasMommaWithAHat Aug 2016 #103

I live in coal country grubbs Aug 2016 #41

Dazzling naivete on your part. (nt) Paladin Aug 2016 #43

Thank you. cwydro Aug 2016 #47

That's for sure cali Aug 2016 #124

Because it's all they have. Adrahil Aug 2016 #46

We lived in a mining area of Indiana radical noodle Aug 2016 #48

Many coal jobs are union jobs which pay well. JonathanRackham Aug 2016 #52

Both my grandfathers were coal miners get the red out Aug 2016 #54

Post removed Post removed Aug 2016 #90

Sadly agree...nt jonno99 Aug 2016 #108

I've nothing against the men who do these jobs! It's about an industry that is dying and should die Fast Walker 52 Aug 2016 #163

I argue that we need new jobs get the red out Aug 2016 #165

I agree that new jobs are key. Fast Walker 52 Aug 2016 #167

Republicans block the message a lot get the red out Aug 2016 #170

What effing options?? Are you nuts? Yo_Mama Aug 2016 #57

Placing blame MadCrow Aug 2016 #96

<-- Great granddad was a UMWA organizer at War Eagle, Maetwan, and Yeager. :) n/t X_Digger Aug 2016 #98

The demand for coal has dropped by a third in the USA - the only option would be to export coal womanofthehills Aug 2016 #179

Fact: Coal is not "out of date". KittyWampus Aug 2016 #58

Can you expand on that? -nt Bradical79 Aug 2016 #171

It's out of date in the US, unless you want to pollute the world to export it womanofthehills Aug 2016 #180

This is without a doubt MicaelS Aug 2016 #62

Bingo. n/t QC Aug 2016 #66

The Democratic Party is rapidly becoming the party of educated white collar people on the coasts. Odin2005 Aug 2016 #105

It became that years ago. MicaelS Aug 2016 #110

I was scared to say that get the red out Aug 2016 #146

^^^ cwydro Aug 2016 #137

You have to be kidding - what about the flooding going on now in Louisianna womanofthehills Aug 2016 #181

Are you serious in asking? TransitJohn Aug 2016 #67

Check your (class) privilege. n/t QC Aug 2016 #68

to feed their families? DrDan Aug 2016 #69

Because they need the jobs Calculating Aug 2016 #72

I'm from Coal Country, and I picketed for the UMWA before I could walk. Have a seat. X_Digger Aug 2016 #77

Thanks for this. lumberjack_jeff Aug 2016 #85

Lumber used to be big there, too. X_Digger Aug 2016 #88

Flat land vs mountains cap Aug 2016 #119

There is flat land ... cap Aug 2016 #87

Mountain top removal is a nasty process, too. Both literally, ethically, and environmentally. X_Digger Aug 2016 #92

Trust me, I am not advocating mountain top removal cap Aug 2016 #115

I'm 45 minutes from Grungy as I type. ileus Aug 2016 #112

Health care is the other big one in my family. X_Digger Aug 2016 #145

In America, there are six jobs for every ten people lumberjack_jeff Aug 2016 #78

People need a way out of coal cap Aug 2016 #80

The part about transport is important T_i_B Aug 2016 #89

My grandfather was a Welsh coal miner. Boudica the Lyoness Aug 2016 #82

And this contempt for "dirty" jobs - it sucks, it's hurting the Dems badly. Yo_Mama Aug 2016 #94

It's a longstanding problem at DU. Codeine Aug 2016 #116

Yes. alarimer Aug 2016 #175

Because there will be no new well-paying jobs to replace the coal-mine jobs. Odin2005 Aug 2016 #99

Coal-fired power plants supplied 33% of the electricity demand stopbush Aug 2016 #106

However, demand for coal has dropped big time womanofthehills Aug 2016 #150

As I said, solar power was one half of one percent in the USA in 2015. stopbush Aug 2016 #156

It doe not have to be 1% - check out Germany womanofthehills Aug 2016 #182

Because there are no guarantees anyone will support them and their families while they look for work Agnosticsherbet Aug 2016 #109

Presumably because it's the only jobs they and their community have? LeftishBrit Aug 2016 #111

I don't think the Tories did think about solutions T_i_B Aug 2016 #130

Indeed LeftishBrit Aug 2016 #133

Some of the old pit villages have recovered well T_i_B Aug 2016 #136

What new options exist? HerrKarlMarx Aug 2016 #125

Talk About an Elitist Question OP lib87 Aug 2016 #129

I've known miners who were incredibly proud of what they did Warpy Aug 2016 #132

Hopefully there are new opportunities JonLP24 Aug 2016 #139

Where are those other Jobs ? they see their reality as coal jobs or no jobs JI7 Aug 2016 #140

What an insulting OP. former9thward Aug 2016 #141

It's what they have done their whole lives oberliner Aug 2016 #142

Ever consider that they might be proud of the hard work they do? Throd Aug 2016 #143

"Good healthy jobs" do not EXIST. Shandris Aug 2016 #147

My Dad was a Coal Miner in Bobtown Pa. (died of black lung) yortsed snacilbuper Aug 2016 #148

We are never going to reach these people standingtall Aug 2016 #149

Problem is - gas prices now are much lower than coal - womanofthehills Aug 2016 #153

Yeah natural gas is booming right now standingtall Aug 2016 #157

You use that word 'want' as if they have a choice. nt Rex Aug 2016 #151

They should all become college professors. ForgoTheConsequence Aug 2016 #152

LOL at "NPR tote bag"! Odin2005 Aug 2016 #173

In WV you can make way more as a miner than a college professor. hollowdweller Aug 2016 #177

Because they need to make a living and that's the only job skills they have davidn3600 Aug 2016 #155

I remember UnFettered Aug 2016 #158

I have nothing against the common man -- but the coal industry has to end Fast Walker 52 Aug 2016 #162

I honestly don't disagree with you. UnFettered Aug 2016 #168

We don't have to go cold turkey on coal Fast Walker 52 Aug 2016 #169

Maybe they could borrow money to start a business from their parents... That Guy 888 Aug 2016 #160

Real life responsibilities duncang Aug 2016 #161

Thinking like this is why Trump Rallies have overflow rooms. RagAss Aug 2016 #166

Not only that why do they continue to work for such horrible people? Initech Aug 2016 #172

If you have a HS education and can earn 100,000 a year in an area where the average wage is 15k hollowdweller Aug 2016 #176

Because it pays better than what has replaced it. alarimer Aug 2016 #174

Because they see it as honest work and nobody has offered an alternative Lee-Lee Aug 2016 #183