General Discussion

pampango

(24,692 posts)

90. If international trade harmed workers and the middle class, progressive countries would be worse off

Tue Aug 23, 2016, 08:00 AM

Aug 2016

than we are here. They are not.

The problem is not international trade - Sweden, Germany, Norway, etc. do 2 to 3 times as much trade as we do. The problem is that we do not have progressive domestic policies on labor rights, progressive taxes, corporate regulation, etc. Progressive countries have all of those; trade much more than we do; and have much stronger unions and middle classes than we have in the US.

That is also why Trump's plan to solve our problems with tariffs, walls and other anti-trade policies, while promoting 'right-to-work', tax cuts for the rich and more deregulation are doomed to failure. Of course, Trump (or at least his most powerful supporters) knows that his proposals will do nothing for our working class (other than harm them) but will benefit the wealthy and corporations greatly.

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The Rise of Donald Trump is a big flashing neon sign that something is very wrong in this country [View all] cali Aug 2016 OP

Dumbing down through television? world wide wally Aug 2016 #1

Dumbing down, period, but low-information media doesn't help matters. Buckeye_Democrat Aug 2016 #6

Yeah, trying to show "both sides" when there are really only 1.001 side: reality and 1/10 % lunacy. Bernardo de La Paz Aug 2016 #51

And the Internet. SleeplessinSoCal Aug 2016 #73

Teach-to-the-test means no teaching critical thinking. Also no societal respect for wisdom. Bernardo de La Paz Aug 2016 #50

Yes. A Great Big Yes... freebrew Aug 2016 #53

Dumbing down through 40 years of GOP anti education policies. Initech Aug 2016 #64

Then how come it's not Millennials, who are the problem? Warren DeMontague Aug 2016 #80

except people aren't actually dumber, and in fact it's older voters who are supporting Trump. Warren DeMontague Aug 2016 #79

Very good point... Whiskeytide Aug 2016 #98

spot on. Warren DeMontague Aug 2016 #100

I hope you're right... Whiskeytide Aug 2016 #103

Excellent Post WiffenPoof Aug 2016 #116

Really? Does this surprise anyone? Hugin Aug 2016 #2

I think there is some real truth to your statement. hamsterjill Aug 2016 #21

it goes beyond this DonCoquixote Aug 2016 #27

+1000000! SammyWinstonJack Aug 2016 #30

This should be its own post! wcast Aug 2016 #32

Wow. I'm honored that my lowly post indirectly led to such a cogent thesis. Hugin Aug 2016 #76

Exactly! KPN Aug 2016 #93

Oh noes you used the word 'elites'! Rex Aug 2016 #112

+1 -nt CrispyQ Aug 2016 #24

on the contrary, i think it's a sign things are improving. unblock Aug 2016 #3

that's a hopeful point of view but I don't think it's that simple. At all. cali Aug 2016 #4

i agree there's more to it than that. unblock Aug 2016 #11

I bet you're right- the 2022 census (why can't they do it every 5 years?) cali Aug 2016 #23

Exactly. KMOD Aug 2016 #5

If you ignore Palin, Romney and McCain, then Trump is a giant step backwards. randome Aug 2016 #19

This is also what I'd like to think. trotsky Aug 2016 #40

It's like the loud cry of a beast in fear SomeGuyInEagan Aug 2016 #68

from 1931-1995, democrats held the house all but 2 terms, and the senate all but 5. unblock Aug 2016 #71

Nixon and Ronald Reagan Loki Aug 2016 #7

No Trump's support is equal too the % of Americans who are mad that an African American is POTUS Botany Aug 2016 #8

The ignorant, hateful bigots have always been here, Cyrano Aug 2016 #9

You're absolutely right...nothing new about it, just the virulence levels have risen. Moostache Aug 2016 #102

24/7 trashing of the President for 8 years by one party and their coporate media liberal N proud Aug 2016 #10

The GOP's 50 year war on public education Zorro Aug 2016 #12

Watch this week's John Oliver if you haven't seen it yet. Initech Aug 2016 #65

It just seems to get worse Astraea Aug 2016 #13

I would say it's not just the rise of Donald Trump. Phlem Aug 2016 #14

Speaking strictly personally. WinstonSmith4740 Aug 2016 #15

Television bucolic_frolic Aug 2016 #16

The GOP and its media have been building this for years Saviolo Aug 2016 #17

International trade destroyed most of the low level jobs in the US. Kablooie Aug 2016 #18

Dissagree Egnever Aug 2016 #35

That's the monetary policy part of my argument. Kablooie Aug 2016 #39

I still dissagree Egnever Aug 2016 #42

You're right it's not black and white. Kablooie Aug 2016 #57

those economic aggregates don't mean anything Angel Martin Aug 2016 #54

Surely they mean something Egnever Aug 2016 #66

+1! KPN Aug 2016 #94

If international trade harmed workers and the middle class, progressive countries would be worse off pampango Aug 2016 #90

Some of the big money people up top want fascism. Mc Mike Aug 2016 #20

I think we all know what it is. Marr Aug 2016 #22

That is certainly part of it. Martin Eden Aug 2016 #25

knr, cali Hekate Aug 2016 #26

A big flashing neocon sign Blue Owl Aug 2016 #28

It's not only wealth worship loyalsister Aug 2016 #29

How the Hell did we get here in deed.... asiliveandbreathe Aug 2016 #31

Agreed, we have sumthang bad wrong,,,,,,, Cryptoad Aug 2016 #33

I think intelligence increases Zing Zing Zingbah Aug 2016 #89

This worries me a lot as well. rivegauche Aug 2016 #34

You have to ignore the rest of the republican field in my opinion to put this all on Trump Egnever Aug 2016 #36

Charlatans Bernardo de La Paz Aug 2016 #52

How did we get here? Johnny2X2X Aug 2016 #37

With information overload, we are able to choose our dosage bigbrother05 Aug 2016 #96

it is something I will never understand... berksdem Aug 2016 #38

Trump is the result of George W. Bush, IMO. Greybnk48 Aug 2016 #41

Oh well, this country allowed for him to happen. tenderfoot Aug 2016 #43

Dismissing it all as white working class racism and ignorance will eventually cost the Democrats Ex Lurker Aug 2016 #44

wait for it: Duck Dynasty 2020 0rganism Aug 2016 #45

Its the Media Stupid polynomial Aug 2016 #46

It's not only the media. that is merely part of the problem. cali Aug 2016 #47

The GOP has gone completely insane over the past 8 years WaltonH Aug 2016 #48

+1, I agree. He is repulsive, revolting, disgusting, abhorrent, objectionable, vile, foul and nasty uppityperson Aug 2016 #69

A large part of our country worships success and wealth Calculating Aug 2016 #49

Imo, it's right wing media & churches brainwashing the masses. -Steph- Aug 2016 #55

Trump supporters would vote for Adolph Hitler for president if they could es35 Aug 2016 #74

Trump was pushed on America by the media starting last summer. jalan48 Aug 2016 #56

I agree with this. alarimer Aug 2016 #58

How the hell did we get here? One word: MEDIA DFW Aug 2016 #59

There needs to be a consumer for said media. Phlem Aug 2016 #63

Our middle and secondary education does indeed suck DFW Aug 2016 #70

And you really think the people voting for Clinton former9thward Aug 2016 #77

In my circles, yes, I do DFW Aug 2016 #81

Um. Far more people at Trump rallies are riding rascals, than skateboards. Warren DeMontague Aug 2016 #82

There is more than one part to that equation DFW Aug 2016 #84

Statistically, though, Trump voters are older. That's a fact. Also, Millennials are the most Warren DeMontague Aug 2016 #85

But I think the distaste for politicians is media fed into all ages in a big way.... bettyellen Aug 2016 #92

well certainly when you have one party saying "government is ineffective" and then gridlocking Warren DeMontague Aug 2016 #101

You're most welcome! I think it you'll enjoy it too. bettyellen Aug 2016 #104

I'm an optimist, myself. Which is one reason why I thought the Convention messaging was so good. Warren DeMontague Aug 2016 #105

I am getting psyched about all the judicial appointments we could get out of her win... bettyellen Aug 2016 #106

If they don't move on Garland before then, she should find the most progressive 18 year old she can Warren DeMontague Aug 2016 #107

HA. bettyellen Aug 2016 #109

It's not education, it's fear, economics and religion adigal Aug 2016 #110

But fear hasnt been beating hope. Warren DeMontague Aug 2016 #111

point made, but then counterpoint made DonCoquixote Aug 2016 #113

Tell me about it. Warren DeMontague Aug 2016 #114

pleasant surprise DonCoquixote Aug 2016 #115

I know exactly how we got here Skittles Aug 2016 #60

ronnie &georgy boy getting into the oval office were much earlier signs. donnie is just the latest. niyad Aug 2016 #61

All this bullshit about "outsiders" being better because of the "corrupt system" and we bettyellen Aug 2016 #62

So a voter is "simple minded" unless they vote for the insider over the outsider? davidn3600 Aug 2016 #75

I do think it's simple minded to think strong working relationships are inherantly evil.... bettyellen Aug 2016 #91

Many Americans love bullies. radicalliberal Aug 2016 #67

Anger. Alkene Aug 2016 #72

we got here because the GOP has been yanking the chain of their base for decades Warren DeMontague Aug 2016 #78

TWITTER! CELL PHONES! THE EDUCATION SYSTEM! VIDEO GAMES! YOUTUBE! INTERNET MEMES! THESE KIDS TODAY! Warren DeMontague Aug 2016 #83

Have you ever heard of a thing called fluoridation? Fluoridation of water? Orrex Aug 2016 #86

The media has controlled this entire horse race. Never underestimate their power. Native Aug 2016 #87

Too negative and not constructive Cary Aug 2016 #88

hair alone bora13 Aug 2016 #95

As we see the rise of Trump leaves no doubt that we could also see INdemo Aug 2016 #97

A great deal of it has to do with identity politics. bklyncowgirl Aug 2016 #99

In all your OP's reasoning... I don't see RACISM even listed. KittyWampus Aug 2016 #108