General Discussion

Igel

(37,336 posts)

31. Back in the '90s California reduced classroom size for teachers.

Sun Sep 4, 2016, 08:01 AM

Sep 2016

People foolishly assumed that if they needed to increase the size of the teaching staff by 20% in one year they could.

They found that qualified teachers weren't available. The foolish politicians watched as their law was implemented, and most of those new teachers weren't qualified, even taking into account new graduates and immigrants from other states.

This trend spread across the US, and in 2001 resulted in the requirement that to receive a good rating schools' teachers be "highly qualified."

Same with a lot of skilled blue-collar workers. Nobody's trained them. They haven't trained themselves. They haven't sought training. So when you go to hire them, they're either not there or you lower your standards.

Employers have gone to the market and found the shelves bare.

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Needed now and next decade: Electricians, roofers, plumbers [View all] Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Sep 2016 OP

That was the big draw of union journeyman programs. procon Sep 2016 #1

Yep Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Sep 2016 #2

I Disagree erpowers Sep 2016 #4

Totally agree with you Ms. Yertle Sep 2016 #11

The contempt for blue collar workers... MicaelS Sep 2016 #13

And it only goes one way whatthehey Sep 2016 #17

Of course they were, and so was I, so what? MicaelS Sep 2016 #20

Our party has ceded this demographic to Trump. AngryAmish Sep 2016 #21

Yes they did, and it was dumb. MicaelS Sep 2016 #22

Cultural divide. Igel Sep 2016 #30

That'a a creative and imaginative allegation. LanternWaste Sep 2016 #71

I'd much rather have a 5 year apprenticeship program trained electrician work on my house Peregrine Took Sep 2016 #51

Thank you, sir...nt Callmecrazy Sep 2016 #52

My son is a union electrician. He graduated in 2007, right as the bottom fell Nay Sep 2016 #58

It's not rocket surgery. lumberjack_jeff Sep 2016 #64

No doubt, you base you premise on objective, peer-reviewed information LanternWaste Sep 2016 #72

How many years of education did it take you to "know" that I couldn't do it myself? lumberjack_jeff Sep 2016 #74

You'll notice that the real complaint is not finding "cheap & skilled" labor GOLGO 13 Sep 2016 #3

Haven't priced a plumber lately? whatthehey Sep 2016 #18

Didn't read the article, did ya? X_Digger Sep 2016 #23

BS argument same used in IT... They don't increase the wages enough starting out for people to jump uponit7771 Sep 2016 #38

Why yes, I'm sure $75/hr for unskilled labor would draw folks. X_Digger Sep 2016 #39

That's the point...make it with folks while... The market isn't dictating prices uponit7771 Sep 2016 #41

There's a lack of skilled tradesman. Period. You can't double the rate and plumbers magically appear X_Digger Sep 2016 #42

Why isn't the car industry screaming then...or maybe they are .... Just seems there's a gap uponit7771 Sep 2016 #43

They are! (At least here in Texas, and in Tennessee. I can't speak to Detroit.) X_Digger Sep 2016 #44

Whoa.... What interests folk these days.... I would think a car job would be some theyd give an efor uponit7771 Sep 2016 #47

That, and those plants pay crap for starting wages. Exilednight Sep 2016 #50

Right Lurker Deluxe Sep 2016 #57

That $100000 on college is worth, on average, about Exilednight Sep 2016 #61

Back in the '90s California reduced classroom size for teachers. Igel Sep 2016 #31

Instead of going to college and getting 100,000 dollars in debt yeoman6987 Sep 2016 #5

This is known and quantified. Igel Sep 2016 #32

Let's make sure unions are involved this decade and next Person 2713 Sep 2016 #6

Had to have my washing machine fixed a little while ago dhol82 Sep 2016 #7

Immigrants are very happy to work as roofers and learn skilled trades, given half a chance. . . nt Bernardo de La Paz Sep 2016 #8

This country is making a huge mistake PoindexterOglethorpe Sep 2016 #9

Yup. n/t Ms. Yertle Sep 2016 #12

Learning a trade in a $$$$$ diploma mill mitch96 Sep 2016 #10

A while back I worked in a hospital. On the information desk. PoindexterOglethorpe Sep 2016 #25

I think colleges ought to offer a liberal arts/trade and business track. MADem Sep 2016 #14

Actually that was (and in many cases still is) the role of Community Colleges. Stinky The Clown Sep 2016 #15

It ought to be given prominence. And not "either-or" -- there should be an opportunity MADem Sep 2016 #16

Community colleges have been repurposed over the years. Igel Sep 2016 #33

Get a couple of teachers, and a couple of businesses in a local area to take on interns MADem Sep 2016 #35

Received an Associates Degree in Electronics at a community college 39 years ago. Yo_Mama_Been_Loggin Sep 2016 #19

Many community colleges offer both. PoindexterOglethorpe Sep 2016 #26

I'd like to see more well rounded tradesmen--basically, they get a liberal arts degree, and "major" MADem Sep 2016 #28

Not everyone who will make a good plumber or electrician gives PoindexterOglethorpe Sep 2016 #29

Agreed. Igel Sep 2016 #34

I think, though, that there are a lot of people who WANT to do both. MADem Sep 2016 #36

You have your own personal electrician? (LOL) nolabels Sep 2016 #62

I do--I've had him for a quarter century or more. MADem Sep 2016 #63

In the early days of the automobile a mechanic rode along with the driver because of many breakdowns nolabels Sep 2016 #66

I live in an historic neighborhood where the houses are "wired together." MADem Sep 2016 #68

Sorry then about challenging your story, I thought you were trying to B.S. nolabels Sep 2016 #69

We've been here for generations, so we're fine with it. MADem Sep 2016 #70

In the Bay Area, I can't count the number of "now hiring" signs I've see every day...not fast food, demosincebirth Sep 2016 #24

I worked in the steel industry for nearly 40 years. Back in the 50s 60s and 70s doc03 Sep 2016 #27

I manage skilled laborers in a unionized firm GulfCoast66 Sep 2016 #37

Do you shower at the beginning of the work day, or the end? X_Digger Sep 2016 #40

When I was an hourly GulfCoast66 Sep 2016 #45

That's it. lumberjack_jeff Sep 2016 #65

Unions Johnny2X2X Sep 2016 #46

Those are hard, dirty jobs! Smart people don't want hard, dirty, dangerous jobs! FrodosPet Sep 2016 #48

^^^this^^^ Well said, indeed... eom Purveyor Sep 2016 #53

Too often these jobs don't come with benefits or vacation time, etc. alarimer Sep 2016 #49

Just out of curiosity Lurker Deluxe Sep 2016 #55

I'm merely pointing out the difficulty of such professions. alarimer Sep 2016 #73

If they can't keep people, it's probably a shitty place to work. Word travels Skeeter Barnes Sep 2016 #54

We haven't trained any for 40 years and all the Union Aprentice programs were starved to death Todays_Illusion Sep 2016 #56

"We are preparing the next generation of students for a world where drains never get stopped up, LongtimeAZDem Sep 2016 #59

Absolute BS Xolodno Sep 2016 #60

That's not all that's needed. Sissyk Sep 2016 #67