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TXCritter

(344 posts)
69. What election have you been watching?
Thu Oct 6, 2016, 11:26 AM
Oct 2016

Have you not noticed that there is a candidate - an entire party willing to throw whole genders, races and classes under the bus? In fact, if you're not white, male, christian, American and middle class or richer there are over 100M+ people in this country who don't want YOU to have some rights. In to that environment, how do you expect a population to reach out to extend rights to non-humans when they refuse to recognize fellow humans as human?

Once upon a time women were legally PROPERTY.
Once upon a time Africans (and others) were legally PROPERTY.
Once upon a time Native Americans legally 3/5 of a human being.

And while the legalities have changed, the culture has not. If the culture had changed Black Lives Matter would not be a movement or, at least, you would never hear the knee jerk defense that 'All Lives Matter'. If the culture had changed women would not be blamed for getting raped. If the culture had changed there would be no battle going on at Standing Rock right now.

The culture is not ready for Animal Rights as a presidential campaign issue. More than that, the Animal Rights movement is not ready to take on that level of action. It's too fractured.

The AR movement has become dominated by a vegan agenda. In some cases, seemingly, to the exclusion of all else. People who might believe in AR are denigrated as "Welfarists" if they refuse to be vegan. In one AR group I've been associated with I keep my non-vegan status quiet because some in that organization have openly declared that people like me should be expelled. You don't build a movement by expelling allies - you look for common ground.

On the far fringes of the AR movement you have people advocating for separating predatory species from prey species, exterminating predatory species, forcing predatory species onto vegan diets and, in the most extreme case I've encountered , advocating that predatory species be genetically re-engineered to be vegans. Unfortunately, these fringers sometimes get media attention they don't deserve. So the debate becomes about whether AR people even understand biology as opposed to debating whether or not living beings deserve respect.

Or culture doesn't just see animals as property, individuals see animals as food. No politician will ever seek to take food from the mouths of their voters. In the hierarchy of needs, food is #3 from the top. So, in all seriousness, if you want AR to be taken seriously at the top of the political agenda, you need to de-veganize the issue.

So, why isn't AR a presidential issue? For the same reason that Jill Stein is running 4th in the race. You don't start at the top with a new issue. You start in the legislatures of the states or in the city councils and build up from there. People have been fighting for Universal Health Care in this country for 70 YEARS and we still don't have it. Women have been fighting for respect for centuries. African Americans have been fighting for their humanity in America across 5 centuries. Workers have been fighting for workers rights decades.

Climate change? We've known about climate change for 120 years and one of our candidates STILL claims it's a HOAX.

Compared to these issues AR is an infant and it has a long way to go to claw it's way through other issues demanding attention. You need to settle in for a life-long fight.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

Because humanity comes first. MicaelS Oct 2016 #1
But ehat about my points in which Animal Rights affect humanity? nt retrowire Oct 2016 #8
Not interested. MicaelS Oct 2016 #62
That's such a callous attitude athena Oct 2016 #94
Because animals don't vote, is my guess. The Velveteen Ocelot Oct 2016 #2
+1000 Agnosticsherbet Oct 2016 #7
they don't financially support campaigns gopiscrap Oct 2016 #103
There's just not enough time Renew Deal Oct 2016 #3
Good idea, that would be a curveball retrowire Oct 2016 #9
Hillary: Detailed Answer. Trump: "Animals. We love animals. We love animals that have breasts." Renew Deal Oct 2016 #20
So, Donald loves mammals then. geardaddy Oct 2016 #79
I would consider it progress if women's rights were an issue in presidential politics Orrex Oct 2016 #4
They were bringing up womens right to choose in thr VP debate the other night. retrowire Oct 2016 #10
Yes, and it was big news that women's rights were mentioned at all Orrex Oct 2016 #15
Hey! neither issue is a waste. retrowire Oct 2016 #17
Sorry to break the news to you, then. Orrex Oct 2016 #22
its still not a waste and I resent that comment. retrowire Oct 2016 #24
Well, you seemed more reasonable about it downthread Orrex Oct 2016 #49
you made that point already i get it lol nt retrowire Oct 2016 #52
It's not until animals vote in large numbers...it's until people do ! Cakes488 Oct 2016 #45
It's not that simple Orrex Oct 2016 #53
When pressing this issue, much is accomplished at the local level. Cakes488 Oct 2016 #58
That was a euphemism Orrex Oct 2016 #68
Well here's a nice link you'll like then. ColemanMaskell Oct 2016 #14
Because most Americans eat them SHRED Oct 2016 #5
My vegan heart understands this as humor. retrowire Oct 2016 #16
Some we call "pets"... SHRED Oct 2016 #34
Have you ever lived in America? CBGLuthier Oct 2016 #6
Lived here all my life. retrowire Oct 2016 #12
One of America's greatest advocates for animals was Teddy Roosevelt... Eleanors38 Oct 2016 #80
i dunno. i could work with him. nt retrowire Oct 2016 #81
John Muir, who abhored hunting, did work with TR, even camping together... Eleanors38 Oct 2016 #85
au contraire buddy, Do your research. Not a MAJOR issue perhaps, but here's something for you ColemanMaskell Oct 2016 #11
Thank you! retrowire Oct 2016 #13
Debates have limited time and they have to hit on the issues voters value most ColemanMaskell Oct 2016 #21
The Humane Society has an anti-Trump ad video ! ColemanMaskell Oct 2016 #92
That's a great ad! athena Oct 2016 #96
What, exactly, do you want them to say? Orrex Oct 2016 #18
I see what youre saying. retrowire Oct 2016 #19
In a word, yes. Orrex Oct 2016 #23
by the way, if you're an animal rights activist and you want to be effective, ColemanMaskell Oct 2016 #25
I am an animal rights advocate retrowire Oct 2016 #27
Book about Vegan diet you might find helpful ColemanMaskell Oct 2016 #64
People are responsible for their own actions. athena Oct 2016 #97
So for you it's about responsibility, not about helping the animals? Fair enough. ColemanMaskell Oct 2016 #98
It is not possible to change someone else's views. athena Oct 2016 #100
Societal priorities. Not saying it's right but it is what it is. NCTraveler Oct 2016 #26
I'm happy with her platform as well. retrowire Oct 2016 #29
I really wish it was discussed more on the stump. NCTraveler Oct 2016 #33
Totally agree! retrowire Oct 2016 #40
We have argued a bit. We have also agreed more. NCTraveler Oct 2016 #47
Aww thats the first time I've felt any friendliness retrowire Oct 2016 #48
If you're talking about PETA... MicaelS Oct 2016 #88
OK. Seems you can only think of one group. NCTraveler Oct 2016 #89
It's called Human Decency. Iggo Oct 2016 #28
facepalm. nt retrowire Oct 2016 #31
rimshot. nt Iggo Oct 2016 #38
What, exactly, is "called Human Decency"? sammythecat Oct 2016 #111
The thing that's referred to in the OP as "Animal Rights." Iggo Oct 2016 #112
Ah! My apologies Iggo. sammythecat Oct 2016 #115
Well, that is a good question because they should be. Beginning with the using of animals in labs EV_Ares Oct 2016 #30
If you abuse animals you will abuse people. Cakes488 Oct 2016 #59
Because Household Pets Don't Vote! BKH70041 Oct 2016 #32
If they did, I suspect they would heavily support the no-forced-sterilization lobby Major Nikon Oct 2016 #57
Donald Trump hates dogs!!! blue cat Oct 2016 #35
Yes! And he wants to eliminate regulations on pet food ingredients. Sicko. femmocrat Oct 2016 #51
Well his kid(s) hunt big cats and such in Africa. There are photos online. ColemanMaskell Oct 2016 #99
It's a fringe issue at best....that falls way down the list beachbumbob Oct 2016 #36
Huh? Remember this... jberryhill Oct 2016 #37
Because not enough people care and not enough get involved Cakes488 Oct 2016 #39
Rally for NO KILL October 8th NYC Columbus Circle/Central Park 1-5 Cakes488 Oct 2016 #41
I may be vegan retrowire Oct 2016 #44
NO KILL is already happening at municipal shelters across the country. Cakes488 Oct 2016 #50
oh so NO KILL is more about animal shelters? nt retrowire Oct 2016 #54
Yes it's about our companion animals at shelters only...a Total NO KILL nation would be a Cakes488 Oct 2016 #55
Oh well that I can totally get behind! :) nt retrowire Oct 2016 #56
I don't think animals have rights. aikoaiko Oct 2016 #42
Agreed. Iggo Oct 2016 #43
youre right. but they should have a little more rights. nt retrowire Oct 2016 #46
Rights must be reciprocal Loki Liesmith Oct 2016 #63
I guess I'm using the terminology interchangeably. retrowire Oct 2016 #65
Fair enough Loki Liesmith Oct 2016 #73
I bet you are glad you weren't born an animal then..even though humans are animals. Cakes488 Oct 2016 #60
Yes I am. Although if I had been born a non-human animal, I wouldn't know... aikoaiko Oct 2016 #83
So that makes it OK because "they don't know". Well we do know and we should know better! Cakes488 Oct 2016 #87
Make what ok? aikoaiko Oct 2016 #90
Animals don't have legal standing Loki Liesmith Oct 2016 #61
Because it's not a point of contention between Republicans and Democrats. Nye Bevan Oct 2016 #66
Thats an interesting angle. true nt retrowire Oct 2016 #67
What election have you been watching? TXCritter Oct 2016 #69
Ive been watching this election and yes. nt retrowire Oct 2016 #70
There is more issues in this at the state level. michaz Oct 2016 #71
I recall that you work in the industry that processes chickens? cwydro Oct 2016 #72
I do not. retrowire Oct 2016 #78
This message was self-deleted by its author kestrel91316 Oct 2016 #74
What is a right? TXCritter Oct 2016 #77
Message auto-removed Name removed Oct 2016 #75
THIS ad won't cure the problem but it will help! napi21 Oct 2016 #76
Thank you for posting that ColemanMaskell Oct 2016 #91
we barely have Human Rights as an issue 0rganism Oct 2016 #82
I hope my comments will be seen as useful. The short answer: Eleanors38 Oct 2016 #84
Wouldn't it be local politics treestar Oct 2016 #86
Animal Rights, melm00se Oct 2016 #93
Because the vast majority of people still have major cognitive dissonance on this issue. athena Oct 2016 #95
It has little to do with Vegan choices. Egnever Oct 2016 #101
It is an observation, not a projection. athena Oct 2016 #104
And again with the projection Egnever Oct 2016 #106
The issue with vegan / vegetarianism MicaelS Oct 2016 #102
oh this vegan knows retrowire Oct 2016 #107
Right. All you have to say is, "Is this dish vegetarian?" athena Oct 2016 #108
oh my god i know the feeling. retrowire Oct 2016 #110
Last time someone made a stupid anti-vegetarian comment to me I threw my arms up... JanMichael Oct 2016 #114
Climate Change is barely an issue. milestogo Oct 2016 #105
Because it would be rude to point out that some poor animal died on Trump's head mythology Oct 2016 #109
Because the Bible says we have dominion over them. robertpaulsen Oct 2016 #113
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