General Discussion

colsohlibgal

(5,276 posts)

21. On The Other Hand

Sat Dec 10, 2016, 10:50 AM

Dec 2016

Hillary is closing in on a 3 million vote lead. So I would place blame more on the arcane Electoral College and the lack of any real push from the Democratic Party to do away with it after what ensued because of 2000.....trillions of additional debt, 100s of thousands dead or maimed, and the rise of ISIS.

I had issues with Hillary. I did not believe she could take all that cash from those Wall Street firms and then police them properly. I had issues with her Iraq vote. Overall my views are closer to Jill Stein.

But I understood the threat of Trump so I did vote for Hillary. I'm sure lots of others were like me.

Oh and I believe minus election hanky panky in key states Hillary would have won both ways.

Nobody is happy that dangerous loose cannon flake won.

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I sure hope the BoBs and Greens and the rest of the alt-left are happy! [View all] DanTex Dec 2016 OP

Well I can't really say - I didn't think much of Hillary Clinton but I'm sad she didn't win el_bryanto Dec 2016 #1

bout sums it up dembotoz Dec 2016 #10

She was a great candidate ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #41

Kinda like ejbr Dec 2016 #56

+1 tecelote Dec 2016 #64

Dude, Trump and Sanders and, like, a world apart ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #116

Not sure what that means, ejbr Dec 2016 #129

They are both "change" candidates sfwriter Dec 2016 #252

Trump didn't go to Moscow for his honeymoon, nor did he praise Castro as a great leader... George II Dec 2016 #138

What skeletons? ejbr Dec 2016 #144

Despite what lots of people would LIKE to think, the DNC wasn't "against" Sanders. George II Dec 2016 #156

Of course she wasn't fed debate questions ejbr Dec 2016 #159

+1 On good authority (like Not Fake News) we know the GOP had an oppo file a yard thick on Sanders Hekate Dec 2016 #201

Nor did Scum write about how women wanted to WhiteTara Dec 2016 #249

Think Castro would've helped Bernie win? Jean-Jacques Roussea Dec 2016 #253

Are you aware that that "Bernie honeymooned in Russia" tripe truebluegreen Dec 2016 #101

Thank you for clearing that up kacekwl Dec 2016 #132

My pleasure. truebluegreen Dec 2016 #285

What "official duties" does the mayor of a small (35,000 people) rural town have in Moscow? George II Dec 2016 #141

You might know if you bothered to read the link. truebluegreen Dec 2016 #170

Yaroslavl is a city of more than 600,000 whereas Burlington was only 35,000. George II Dec 2016 #215

WTH? Gorbachev was General Secretary of the party truebluegreen Dec 2016 #223

Why of course it was official business WhiteTara Dec 2016 #244

So you're going with the theory truebluegreen Dec 2016 #277

where did that come from? WhiteTara Dec 2016 #278

Right. You totally have no idea truebluegreen Dec 2016 #280

You know WhiteTara Dec 2016 #282

I don't care what you think or write truebluegreen Dec 2016 #283

Since he didn't get the nomination, we never got to see all the dirt that would have been.... George II Dec 2016 #72

Kurt Eichenwald of Newsweek saw the opposition research on Sanders. lapucelle Dec 2016 #119

She did. Texin Dec 2016 #87

I would never, you know, presume to answer for BoBs or Greens. lapucelle Dec 2016 #103

Yeah - I like how you made fun of one thing I said for an entire post el_bryanto Dec 2016 #158

Hillary's record for liberalism in the senate matches Sanders. lapucelle Dec 2016 #162

Ad feminum? What does that refer to? nt el_bryanto Dec 2016 #234

Argumentum ad feminum: lapucelle Dec 2016 #269

Ah. So if you said "I didn't think much of Bernie Sanders" el_bryanto Dec 2016 #271

Some people confuse snark with argumentation lapucelle Dec 2016 #272

That's a pretty normal response from someone who can't bear the thought that some people el_bryanto Dec 2016 #274

The trump voters who can be divided in to camps: the racist, misogynist xenophobes, and those who lunamagica Dec 2016 #210

You forgot the ones that hated Clinton so much that they would of rather voted for Satan himself. TrekLuver Dec 2016 #247

Actually, I did not. The mysoginist are part of the first group lunamagica Dec 2016 #262

They were not all misogynist. They just hated anything Clinton. TrekLuver Dec 2016 #266

And you think they would admit it to your face? lunamagica Dec 2016 #267

I personally knew many of them. Sorry that there were people who really just hated Clinton PERIOD TrekLuver Dec 2016 #268

So a fake scandal reinforced their original irrational hatred? lapucelle Dec 2016 #270

Yes...and there have been fake scandals going back 25 years now. I swear if these people were on TrekLuver Dec 2016 #273

Comey, Putin, Assange denied the real winner who got 2.7 million more votes brush Dec 2016 #130

She has 2.8 million more votes. There are two main reasons she wasn't pnwmom Dec 2016 #131

+1000 oasis Dec 2016 #165

She could have been a better candidate if only WhiteTara Dec 2016 #242

What an incredibly stupid thing to say. nt el_bryanto Dec 2016 #243

says the man. WhiteTara Dec 2016 #245

I didn't vote for Trump I voted for Hillary in the general election. el_bryanto Dec 2016 #246

Who knows? Who cares? WhiteTara Dec 2016 #248

Jeffrey Sachs has the nerve to tweet about the EPA being Tanuki Dec 2016 #2

When the Senate Democrats took the first stand for... yallerdawg Dec 2016 #3

Many would rather burn it all down completely ProgressIsLeft Dec 2016 #4

Yup. Those people are idiots. Selfish idiots. DanTex Dec 2016 #6

The entire Planet.. Cha Dec 2016 #7

Are they though? ProgressIsLeft Dec 2016 #186

A lot of them are. Some of them are just stupid. DanTex Dec 2016 #195

Now we've gone full on calling people names ProgressIsLeft Dec 2016 #203

Well, I'm calling Greens and BoBs names. I also call Republicans names. DanTex Dec 2016 #206

Why is it hillarious? All politics are local. ProgressIsLeft Dec 2016 #265

Yes they are. They are not the ones who get "scratched" lunamagica Dec 2016 #220

No shit! As far as I am concerned, they got what they wanted. leftofcool Dec 2016 #241

Yeah, because that worked so well for the Naderites who Tanuki Dec 2016 #8

Didn't that ultimately end up with a 2 term Obama presidency? GummyBearz Dec 2016 #145

Which lead to Obama for 8 years. ProgressIsLeft Dec 2016 #179

Yeah, tough shit about the Iraq war, and every other fucked up Tanuki Dec 2016 #196

Oh I agree with you ProgressIsLeft Dec 2016 #260

Yeah, usually those who think like that are the ones who ar not affected lunamagica Dec 2016 #216

And the loss of many lives, rights and freedoms. JTFrog Dec 2016 #239

Welcome to DU! Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #11

Thank you :) ProgressIsLeft Dec 2016 #182

What "went wrong" is that we relied on people who think like that. BobbyDrake Dec 2016 #22

No sorry ProgressIsLeft Dec 2016 #188

Except that's not how it works. We'll have New New Democrats. joshcryer Dec 2016 #34

DLC on steroids. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #52

And Tulsi Gabbard is our new progressive hero. joshcryer Dec 2016 #60

How so? Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #66

Actually it is how it works ProgressIsLeft Dec 2016 #190

What is just and moral about plunging most of the world into suffering? jumptheshadow Dec 2016 #54

Did I say that it was? ProgressIsLeft Dec 2016 #192

Just asking jumptheshadow Dec 2016 #233

We saw the result of that brilliant strategy after the 2000 election lapucelle Dec 2016 #133

Which lead to 8 years of Obama. ProgressIsLeft Dec 2016 #193

Which led to losing Congress. lapucelle Dec 2016 #197

I don't think President Obama would think it was worth it Bradical79 Dec 2016 #256

And usually those people are the ones who will not be affected by "the revolution" lunamagica Dec 2016 #213

Do they realize how hard it's going to be to undo Trump's first 100 days? jmowreader Dec 2016 #238

I don't especially want a Dem Party that is "truly progressive" MADem Dec 2016 #292

Hillary would have been a great President and she won Cha Dec 2016 #5

My feelings, also. demosincebirth Dec 2016 #39

Thank you, Cha! stopbush Dec 2016 #80

Thanks, Cha. Basic LA Dec 2016 #93

I get so damned sick and tired..... Rorey Dec 2016 #105

Mahalo, Rorey! I get tired of the same thing. Cha Dec 2016 #114

I hear you but who's going to be in the Whitehouse? denvine Dec 2016 #137

Illigimately Rorey Dec 2016 #155

+1 uponit7771 Dec 2016 #121

Oh, Cha, why bring facts to the disussion? lunamagica Dec 2016 #226

Well said, I don't see many of the issues placed in the DNC platform pushed in the Thinkingabout Dec 2016 #254

Thank you, Thinkingabout, Exactly!! Well said yourself! Cha Dec 2016 #284

If Stein considered the election of Drumpf a victory... Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #9

LOL. You actually think the recounts are about trying to change the election result? DanTex Dec 2016 #12

That's the same CT voiced by the few Drumpf supporters I know! Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #14

Oh, yeah, big conspiracy: politicians do stuff for political reasons. Mindblowing! DanTex Dec 2016 #18

A genuine straw man! Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #24

I guess you have no idea what a "straw man" is. DanTex Dec 2016 #25

Clearly YOU don't, Skippy. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #27

Ooh, name-calling! This is getting exciting! DanTex Dec 2016 #28

One of my best friends growing up was named Skip... Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #29

LOL. Yeah, I'm sure you meant it as a term of endearment... DanTex Dec 2016 #30

Post removed Post removed Dec 2016 #33

All evidence to the contrary... DanTex Dec 2016 #36

Lemme ask you, Skippy. Do you believe Secretary Clinton made mistakes during the campaign? Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #38

Not sure what that has to do with anything, but yes, all humans make mistakes. DanTex Dec 2016 #44

It has to do with my previous comment Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #49

So the alt-lefties decided to support Trump because they got their feelings hurt online? DanTex Dec 2016 #59

No, not a SINGLE Bernie supporter that I know voted for Drumpf. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #65

If one can be "driven" to vote for Trump ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #71

Like I said, NO one I know who supported Senator Sanders, voted for Drumpf. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #76

Voting Green is half as bad as voting GOP. DanTex Dec 2016 #82

I will wear the label "alt-leftie" proudly Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #94

I already know how a "REAL Democrat" thinks because I am one. DanTex Dec 2016 #98

Yet your fire is aimed at other Democrats... Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #104

Actually, no, that's your fire. Aimed at the DLC and centrist Dems. DanTex Dec 2016 #111

Not at all. If that were so, I would've voted for Stein Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #117

If you voted for Clinton, the OP isn't about you. DanTex Dec 2016 #154

It's about the shaming of true Progressives. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #157

"True Progressives" don't help Trump become president. DanTex Dec 2016 #160

You continue to blame those who are not to blame. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #161

I don't see why you're defending Jill Stein and the BoBs here. DanTex Dec 2016 #163

I truly believe that blaming the "alt-left" is a VERY dangerous tack to take. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #168

You keep saying "we". I'm not talking about you. DanTex Dec 2016 #171

I'm a Liberal. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #172

Me too. Both. DanTex Dec 2016 #173

I'm not a part of, nor have I ever defended either group. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #177

Well then what are we arguing about? DanTex Dec 2016 #181

BoB's and Greens are not the issues at hand. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #211

Yes, they are. BoBs and Greens are who I mentioned in the OP. Nothing about "hippies". DanTex Dec 2016 #214

What campaign didn't, including Sanders', the non-nominee? brush Dec 2016 #146

So you blame Sanders? Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #148

All the primary attacks from a fellow Dem on Clinton being corrupt didn't help but I blame . . . brush Dec 2016 #152

I think we should't blame anyone except Comey, Putin, Assange... Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #153

Thanks for posting this. It should be required viewing for all voters. jalan48 Dec 2016 #40

You're welcome. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #45

McGovern was the first candidate I was able to vote for. jalan48 Dec 2016 #50

Did you support Bernie Sanders in the primary? ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #43

Sure did! Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #46

He's got that whole cult of personality thing Down ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #48

No, because over 90% of Bernie supporters voted for Secretary Clinton. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #51

That pesky 10% ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #68

Fortunately, we had a candidate in 2008 who was popular enough to win. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #70

Indeed. ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #74

But her negatives were high and not entirely unfounded Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #79

You have better Dem cred than I do then. ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #86

Sure do. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #99

Damn I don't have a snappy come back for that one. ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #108

I'm here all night. Try the veal. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #110

Don't you know how veal is raised? ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #118

*rimshot* Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #124

S'alright ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #126

See? Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #135

I am a damn Hippy! ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #175

Let's do so then! Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #184

Ok then ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #187

I've never considered you, or any other DUer an asshole. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #218

Hahaha! ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #229

The whole 2004 name change thingy, of course... Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #230

This is true ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #240

I'm glad you had the patience to try to stand for the Bernie voters, rwsanders Dec 2016 #286

Activist groups objectively make more money... joshcryer Dec 2016 #35

Bingo! stopbush Dec 2016 #81

Throw in also that she doesn't want to be labeled as the new Nader who helped the repugs win brush Dec 2016 #140

The Green Party does have a record of fighting against BBV. That said, Jill Stein KittyWampus Dec 2016 #17

Stein's "recount" is about collecting names, email address, and phone numbers. That's it. BobbyDrake Dec 2016 #20

...and the Clinton legal team signed on to it. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #26

I think they kinda felt obligated ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #90

Of course she did. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #97

Why you are most welcome! ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #107

Don't really care what her motivation is , kacekwl Dec 2016 #136

To build both a war chest and a vast and easily monetized email list. lapucelle Dec 2016 #134

To cut off your nose... Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #139

Stein raised funds to cut off my nose and spite my face? lapucelle Dec 2016 #147

Enjoy your ignore list. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #149

To expand her mailing list names and addresses oberliner Dec 2016 #279

They had every right to do what they did. Unfortunately we all suffer. These leftwing deplorable KittyWampus Dec 2016 #13

I totally agree. A bunch of people got played. yardwork Dec 2016 #15

No it doesn't... Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #16

The Hillary camp has to blame Bernie because they are afraid to look at their candidate Dustlawyer Dec 2016 #78

We hoped Obama would reverse the drain of middle-class wealth started by Reagan... Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #84

+1 (nt) bekkilyn Dec 2016 #125

The alt-left is a bag of shitbags. End of story. BobbyDrake Dec 2016 #19

On The Other Hand colsohlibgal Dec 2016 #21

And all the folks who said we didn't need them. Hope they are happy, too. aikoaiko Dec 2016 #23

+100 Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #31

No No No ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #47

Um... aim elsewhere. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #58

Who am I "aiming" at? ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #77

I lulz'd KG Dec 2016 #32

The beatings will continue until morale improves. theaocp Dec 2016 #37

and you think these kinds of daily posts on DU are helpful? NRaleighLiberal Dec 2016 #42

Hippie-Punchers, Like Rust, Never Sleeps. Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #55

thanks... this place is like a magnet, I guess - draws one back! NRaleighLiberal Dec 2016 #57

Some people post little except Nevernose Dec 2016 #169

I wish hillary had never run again Garion_55 Dec 2016 #53

Him or just about any other qualified dem candidate Calculating Dec 2016 #91

i agree 100% this was not an election about the issues Garion_55 Dec 2016 #123

You forgot about ejbr Dec 2016 #61

+1 progressoid Dec 2016 #69

Hillary was a poor candidate. Red Oak Dec 2016 #62

That salient fact seems to be lost on the Cult of Personality Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #67

She was a great candidate ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #73

Great candidate for 2004, probably. nt Gore1FL Dec 2016 #113

Oh dear. ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #127

And couldn't beat a Trump? Red Oak Dec 2016 #251

She received millions an millions more votes than he did! lunamagica Dec 2016 #237

She received three million more votes (and counting) than him! lunamagica Dec 2016 #236

Not ignoring it. That's great. She still lost. Red Oak Dec 2016 #250

Anyone would have lost under the same circumstances lunamagica Dec 2016 #261

Really? Anyone would have lost? You are wrong. Red Oak Dec 2016 #275

None of those you mentioned had to deal with voting machines, Assange and Russian hackers lunamagica Dec 2016 #288

You think Hillary had to deal with more than the others? Come on! Red Oak Dec 2016 #289

K&R! stonecutter357 Dec 2016 #63

I normally stay out of these threads, but holy shit Saviolo Dec 2016 #75

Cornel West is, indeed very happy ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #83

Cornel West isn't happy about Trump Saviolo Dec 2016 #95

Mel culpa ismnotwasm Dec 2016 #106

"You think Jill Stein and Cornel West are happy to have a racist misogynist in the White House?" DanTex Dec 2016 #88

Exactly Scruffy1 Dec 2016 #167

What utter claptrap. nt Skidmore Dec 2016 #185

Oy veh FailureToCommunicate Dec 2016 #85

What's that? Cha Dec 2016 #89

The floggings will continue...untill morale improves FailureToCommunicate Dec 2016 #96

LOL.. perfect saying Cha Dec 2016 #102

Thank you for all the solutions you offer. gordianot Dec 2016 #92

Well thank God we don't have to worry about Hillary's emails anymore huh? workinclasszero Dec 2016 #100

There's one... Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #109

Jill Stein, Cornel West workinclasszero Dec 2016 #115

*spittake* Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #122

Whatevs, sarandon.. funny, she had a mention in my post, too, working.. Cha Dec 2016 #112

Yes Cha, Sarandon and her ilk have to kill the poor to save the poor workinclasszero Dec 2016 #120

Such nobility.. let them eat cake Cha Dec 2016 #128

Goldman has had it's claws into that gig for a while. Spitfire of ATJ Dec 2016 #142

Troll Tragl1 Dec 2016 #143

Welcome to DU! Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #150

Thanks Tragl1 Dec 2016 #151

IF I may...... democrank Dec 2016 #164

No, that's not what "alt-left" means at all. DanTex Dec 2016 #166

Blame Bernie? Primaries are supposed to be a fight ProgressIsLeft Dec 2016 #194

Not all the blame, just some. DanTex Dec 2016 #199

I disagree Dan, sorry ProgressIsLeft Dec 2016 #205

Her fav/unfav were about equal when Bernie entered the race. When she was SoS DanTex Dec 2016 #231

When Bernie entered the race however nobody knew who he was ProgressIsLeft Dec 2016 #263

Welcome to DU... SidDithers Dec 2016 #232

Why thank you Sid :) ProgressIsLeft Dec 2016 #264

I said it during the primary, and I still believe it Saviolo Dec 2016 #228

"UPDATE: Exxon-Mobil CEO for Secretary of State!" Cooley Hurd Dec 2016 #174

I didn't pick him, Trump did. How do you think Jill Stein feels about the choice? DanTex Dec 2016 #176

PUTIN LACKEY and Exxon-Mobil CEO for SOS. Our democracy is FUCKED. Maru Kitteh Dec 2016 #178

Conservatives are NEVER happy Warpy Dec 2016 #180

Umm, conservatives are happy now, thanks to the help that Greens and BoBs gave them. DanTex Dec 2016 #183

I hate to have to point out the obvious Warpy Dec 2016 #198

Yes, the electoral college needs to go. DanTex Dec 2016 #202

I'm not surprised at all. n/t QC Dec 2016 #191

I am no fan of the green party... Else You Are Mad Dec 2016 #189

True, a lot of Green voters and BoBs are ignorant sheep. I place more responsibility DanTex Dec 2016 #204

Hillary should have... Else You Are Mad Dec 2016 #207

Maybe, maybe not. Courting the alt-left risks losing the center. DanTex Dec 2016 #208

Would you mind losing the center... Else You Are Mad Dec 2016 #209

Of course not. I'm just not sure it would have worked. DanTex Dec 2016 #212

If that were true, I wouldn't bead at Hillary for losing... Else You Are Mad Dec 2016 #217

Sure, her campaign wasn't great, and she was a flawed candidate. DanTex Dec 2016 #219

But, that is their right. Else You Are Mad Dec 2016 #222

If course it's their right, it doesn't make it any less reprehensible. DanTex Dec 2016 #224

That I agree with. Else You Are Mad Dec 2016 #225

It's okay because the president appointing the Goldman execs BainsBane Dec 2016 #200

DU rec... SidDithers Dec 2016 #221

sadly it took leftists being thrown into concentration camps before this contingent got it. forjusticethunders Dec 2016 #227

Hillary got the popular vote. killbotfactory Dec 2016 #235

I disagree w/ the term alt left, but I do agree the BoBers & greens fucked everything up royally. NT LostOne4Ever Dec 2016 #255

This message was self-deleted by its author Uponthegears Dec 2016 #257

I had a snarky reply up and self-deleted it Uponthegears Dec 2016 #258

Just another finger pointing op NWCorona Dec 2016 #259

Too funny... J_William_Ryan Dec 2016 #276

Jill Stein is an avowed enemy of Hillary Clinton and the Democratic Party oberliner Dec 2016 #281

Must be nice to have what Trump has: KPN Dec 2016 #287

It is going to be a tough four years Gothmog Dec 2016 #290

Agreed, they all got played for fools as Trump makes it obvious he just manipulated R B Garr Dec 2016 #291