General Discussion

joshcryer

(62,536 posts)

58. gapminder disagrees

Reply to TheBlackAdder (Reply #15)

Sun Jan 8, 2017, 01:04 AM

Jan 2017

Click here to purchase valentine hearts!

Edit history

Please sign in to view edit histories.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

87 replies

= new reply since forum marked as read

Highlight:

It's not a question of blaming trade deals OR blaming automation. [View all] Ken Burch Jan 2017 OP

Personally, I think it is 95+% automation. I also think our future, be it with guaranteed income or Hoyt Jan 2017 #1

Where I live it's 95% free trade hollowdweller Jan 2017 #2

There is no evidence that free trade is responsible for anywhere near that many jobs mythology Jan 2017 #7

That is the Free Traders bullshit excuse. Demsrule86 Jan 2017 #10

At the same time those jobs were supposedly shipped overseas, Honda, Toyota, Siemens, BMW, etc., Hoyt Jan 2017 #14

I don't know how many times I can see another job lost Jim Beard Jan 2017 #33

Those jobs didn't go overseas. Loss of radio stations probably has more to do with Internet and Hoyt Jan 2017 #37

This is true but because of the internet Jim Beard Jan 2017 #45

I want to add the simple invention of voice caller systems.... Jim Beard Jan 2017 #85

You said hollowdweller Jan 2017 #72

Toyota starts people at 14 an hour here I believe. hollowdweller Jan 2017 #73

Monsanto sent my friends Dad hollowdweller Jan 2017 #70

ROTF: Look at the chart below: Since the recession ended in 2009 eniwetok Jan 2017 #13

I'm with you on the guaranteed income thing. Ken Burch Jan 2017 #3

How would a foreign corporation force reduction in social spending? Hoyt Jan 2017 #5

By challenging it as a subsidy to domestic corporations Ken Burch Jan 2017 #8

Yet Canada and Trudeau are supporting TPP. I'd like to see a link to the case you cite. Hoyt Jan 2017 #11

I'm aware of a number of BainsBane Jan 2017 #29

Those provisions have been in trade agreements since at least 1959. Both Canada and Mexico are eager Hoyt Jan 2017 #34

I wasn't aware of that BainsBane Jan 2017 #43

so why don't corps just automate in the US? why do they move their factories overseas? nt TheFrenchRazor Jan 2017 #61

Razor, a lot of them do just automate here, eliminating millions of jobs. What do you have against Hoyt Jan 2017 #68

wages hollowdweller Jan 2017 #71

yeah, guaranteed income is totally going to happen. NOT. but thanks for helping get rid of our jobs. TheFrenchRazor Jan 2017 #62

Assuming you are young, I'd suggest training for jobs that are resistant to technology, outsourcing, Hoyt Jan 2017 #69

That's the line we just used in the election. hollowdweller Jan 2017 #74

What's your solution. You could have said, "All TVs will be made in America, and you can pay 3 times Hoyt Jan 2017 #77

There are benefits to automation that are hard to deny Kilgore Jan 2017 #4

Depends hollowdweller Jan 2017 #75

Automation includes technology. How many clerical and other jobs have computers eliminated? Hoyt Jan 2017 #6

it does matter if you are talking about certain jobs coming back JI7 Jan 2017 #9

People don't want "certain jobs". OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #22

but they do want "certain" jobs as seen with coal country JI7 Jan 2017 #24

Again, no. OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #41

who has made the promise before ? the only thing they have voted for was coal JI7 Jan 2017 #42

Again, no. OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #46

once again, it shows nothing about who they voted for that let them down JI7 Jan 2017 #47

Wow. Serious misunderstandings. OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #48

who made promises and broke them ? they have voted for coal everytime , coal has destroyed them and JI7 Jan 2017 #49

To repeat: OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #51

yeah, i'm the elitist and a wealthy east coat nyc white man like donald trump is the common man for JI7 Jan 2017 #52

No one is arguing for Trump. OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #53

LOL , they VOTED FOR trump . IT'S WHAT THEY WANT JI7 Jan 2017 #54

You've met every coal miner in the country and all of them voted for Trump? OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #55

i'm not disregarding them. i'm acknowledging them and their reason for voting the way they did JI7 Jan 2017 #56

In what post did you acknowledge anything about them except your OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #59

it is a fact most of them voted for Trump JI7 Jan 2017 #60

No, I am saying OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #66

He's not. He's a rich yankee. hollowdweller Jan 2017 #79

Wrong hollowdweller Jan 2017 #78

Exactly hollowdweller Jan 2017 #76

Too many people that count themselves "environmentalists" OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #84

The problem is these anti trade anti automation arguments barely scratch the surface... JHan Jan 2017 #12

Don't jump to conclusions. OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #19

It's far from perfect however: JHan Jan 2017 #28

Wow. Serious misunderstandings. OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #35

Well I never "attacked" Trumka... JHan Jan 2017 #64

No I guess you didn't read them. OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #65

Interesting post BainsBane Jan 2017 #23

Yep, no chance of that culture changing with Trump. JHan Jan 2017 #30

That's because Germany actually cares about how its citizens fare, since the Nay Jan 2017 #83

Yeah but what if we used the tarriffs to create a big gov't jobs program? hollowdweller Jan 2017 #81

Progressives embraced globalization as part of the UN Millennial Development Goals (MDG). TheBlackAdder Jan 2017 #15

Exactly. OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #17

You might remember DU OPs and posts last year, supporting sending jobs to countries to lift wages. TheBlackAdder Jan 2017 #20

And this is all reflective of the decline of American empire BainsBane Jan 2017 #21

Actually no. OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #36

The hilarious part were all the columns and posts last year OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #25

The TPP would have given China keys to the kingdom. They would be able to undercut TPP partners. TheBlackAdder Jan 2017 #26

This message was self-deleted by its author BainsBane Jan 2017 #27

Yep. OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #40

gapminder disagrees joshcryer Jan 2017 #58

Doesn't surprise me, as they promote globalization and poverty reduction measures. TheBlackAdder Jan 2017 #63

It is for defenders of corporate trade. OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #16

Automation predates trade deals BainsBane Jan 2017 #18

It's too bad you don't know that corporations did dominate trade when NAFTA was passed. OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #31

Obviously corporations did BainsBane Jan 2017 #32

You continue to misunderstand. OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #39

I am not demeaning anyone BainsBane Jan 2017 #44

I'm not insulted. OrwellwasRight Jan 2017 #50

I lost two jobs at companies that moved to Mexico for cheaper labor. Buckeye_Democrat Jan 2017 #38

If it was trade deals then the jobs could come back. joshcryer Jan 2017 #57

You ignore globalization itself -- jobs were moving to cheaper places, in the US and overseas before karynnj Jan 2017 #67

My father rarely worked for corporations back in the 50's. The companies... Buckeye_Democrat Jan 2017 #82

Very well said. Nt karynnj Jan 2017 #87

Not my intent to ignore it-I see NAFTA and TPP as manifestations of globalization. Ken Burch Jan 2017 #86

Bookmarking to read later. There are some excellent arguments on both sides here. LongTomH Jan 2017 #80