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Zalatix

(8,994 posts)
Mon Jun 25, 2012, 12:21 AM Jun 2012

Population control will NOT save our environment; and why Stephen Hawking was right. [View all]

Overpopulation is not a new refrain; it was a subject of complaint even as far back as the Roman Empire. The problem is, you can have a small population of humans and still over-consume your way into a crisis or even ecological ruin and a catastrophic population crash. Malthusian theories can argue all day long about how much physical room the Earth has for human beings, but history shows one certainty: even 100 million is enough to ruin the ecosystem.

Take the deforestation that occurred on Rapa Nui aka Easter Island, for instance. Or better yet, look at deforestation patterns in Midieval Europe, from the 13th to 16th centuries, where the populace in the area never exceeded 150 million. There weren't a lot of humans there, at least compared to now, but they wrought much devastation on their ecosystem, with catastrophic consequences, such as famines and plagues that were fueled by the resulting waves of mass starvation and malnutrition.

Ironically, the mass deforestation was slowed down by the growing use of coal. Compared to Medieval times, coal was the first form of alternative energy, and petroleum was the alternative energy to whale oil. Alternative energy slowed the destruction of forests and saved the whales.

Of course, deforestation is still happening at a breathtaking pace, and the practice of using fossil fuels in place of trees is itself catching up with us in the form of pollution and global warming. At the same time the Malthusian crowd is again blowing the overpopulation trumpet.

Populations have swelled and declined, but regardless of the size of the world's population, or that of any one region, two things have always been constant: overconsumption and wastefulness.

No matter what size a given population is, overconsumption and wastefulness still make for an unsustainable society and will lead to the Malthusian sky falling on our heads.

The key to protecting our environment and global habitat is sustainability. We need a system of recycling that is as close to perfect as possible, and one in which we cut pollution to a bare minimum. We need to build consumer goods in a way that they can be recycled in an environmentally-friendly way, and build them to last. We need a society where few things go into the trash and almost nothing goes into landfills. We need a global agreement of hard and inflexible pollution REDUCTIONS, not just "cap and move pollution around to whatever nation can pay the pollution fee." We need to make use of solar energy, which can now be generated at night as well as during the day; the sun bathes the Earth in more energy PER DAY than modern society will use in centuries, and we need to harness a respectable portion of that. We must all become like Germany, who now uses more solar energy than the whole world combined. Composting must also become a religion, while research in nano-pesticides must begin so that we can ditch the use of chemicals. I could list the specifics all day long, but I think Democrats can get the picture. Waste not, want not, is an old but wise and very relevant saying.

Which brings me to Stephen Hawking, who once famously said that for our survival, we need to colonize other worlds. He's correct. This be a huge creator of jobs worldwide, and would result in access to more resources beyond Earth. Outer space is, potentially, the world's biggest jobs program, ever; it is likely to create an employee's market for anything from manual labor (think: asteroid miners in space suits, or people piloting mining drones) to jobs in the hard sciences and engineering. The prospect of putting factories on the moon, by itself, offers huge ecological benefits for the world. In the long term it will also solve the Malthusian problem of physical space.

However, there is an even bigger benefit to listening to Hawking's advice. The biggest benefit of all is that when it comes to long-term existence in outer space, you are forced to research and implement a system of total sustainability. Short term trips into orbit don't necessarily require sustainability, but people working in offworld factories and those taking trips to places like Mars will. Recycling of all resources is a must, as is the use of alternative and renewable energy. The sustainability issues that must be solved to achieve long-term space travel and colonization of inhospitable worlds will be of enormous benefit for us back on Earth.

There's another reason to shoot for sustainability over population control: whenever you hear about population control, it's YOU AND YOUR FAMILY who will be controlled. The Plutocracy will have no skin in the game at all; they won't use less resources or make any sacrifices, but YOU WILL. Malthusians are quick to say that it's the poor who overpopulate the most - problem is, they're talking about YOU, as in the person who is reading this and saying to themselves, "No, that can't be right". Yeah, it is right. It's all about controlling YOU so that the Plutocrats can have mansions the size of Los Angeles and flying yachts that rival the size of islands, along with all the resources such luxuries use.

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It's not an either/or proposition. wickerwoman Jun 2012 #1
Population growth isn't indefinite when the whole populace is prosperous. Zalatix Jun 2012 #3
I'm sure there are useful minerals on the moon/asteroids. wickerwoman Jun 2012 #5
Why should we ruin other worlds as we have our own? Skidmore Jun 2012 #11
LOL, you know how many stars are just in OUR Galaxy.. snooper2 Jun 2012 #22
Go with the energy source which contributes nothing to global warming golfguru Jun 2012 #7
Always available? Nukes are always available? RobertEarl Jun 2012 #42
i'm getting really sick of the use of the "breed like rabbits" crap. world fertility rate = 2.47 HiPointDem Jun 2012 #31
At the moment that's at least 1.47 more than is sustainable wickerwoman Jun 2012 #34
It isn't "breeding like rabbits". that phrase has so often been used to denigrate foreigners and HiPointDem Jun 2012 #35
Inability to provide adequately for children isn't a completely subjective stance. wickerwoman Jun 2012 #36
bill gates has three; but since he can "adequately provide for them" why peachy keen. albeit HiPointDem Jun 2012 #37
Sorry but I have better things to do than argue online with someone wickerwoman Jun 2012 #38
yes, i'm sure you have much better thing to do, like talk about poor people breeding like rabbits. HiPointDem Jun 2012 #39
She's already declared "victory". Zalatix Jun 2012 #45
2.47 =1.47 = 1.0 kids per 2 parents. That's an implosion, not sustainable. Look at Japan. Zalatix Jun 2012 #44
oops, sorry, misread you. HiPointDem Jun 2012 #52
Uh-oh, the Luddite brigade will flame you for supporting colonizing space. Odin2005 Jun 2012 #2
Better recycling of the resources we use, couldn't hurt, either. Zalatix Jun 2012 #4
Well, not exactly Scootaloo Jun 2012 #6
Propulsion technology is inadequate to even take humans to Mars Kolesar Jun 2012 #9
A manned Mars mission would only cost $30 billion. Odin2005 Jun 2012 #14
If you call the atrophied passenger that crawls out of the capsule at the end a "man" Kolesar Jun 2012 #21
Nuclear-electric engines would make it much easier. hunter Jun 2012 #24
We gotta dream! Kolesar Jun 2012 #25
The challenge is landing a craft capable of taking the crew back into Mars orbit muriel_volestrangler Jun 2012 #27
I think Odin2005 meant that $30 billion would be using conventional "chemical" rockets ... eom Kolesar Jun 2012 #28
Elon Musk designed Dragon to land on Mars bananas Jun 2012 #46
That lands unmanned, and does not take off again muriel_volestrangler Jun 2012 #48
Future versions will land and take off again. bananas Jun 2012 #50
Nuclear-electric makes it harder, and it is dangerous bananas Jun 2012 #49
The energy and effort to get something from an asteroid are magnitudes higher muriel_volestrangler Jun 2012 #10
"an effort far greater than anything that humanity has ever done" = the space age in general. Zalatix Jun 2012 #13
No, the space age was not that much of a technological leap, and has been tiny in scale muriel_volestrangler Jun 2012 #17
Never heard of a space elevator, I take it? Odin2005 Jun 2012 #15
Of course I have: muriel_volestrangler Jun 2012 #18
IOW we can't do it, we can't do it, we can't do it. Zalatix Jun 2012 #30
I favor unrestricted access to birth control for all eShirl Jun 2012 #8
women do that when they have political-economic agency, BOG PERSON Jun 2012 #47
Glad to K&R cbrer Jun 2012 #12
You lost me at ... GeorgeGist Jun 2012 #16
"Live simply, so that others may live". (Kopi, circa 800 AD) Zorra Jun 2012 #19
The plan is to seed a number of extraterritorial colonies with a small number of elites FarCenter Jun 2012 #20
GREETINGS FROM ALPHA CENTAURI Capt. Obvious Jun 2012 #23
Greetings from Tau Ceti! GliderGuider Jun 2012 #26
2 things-we quadrupled in 1/2 century, soon to reach 9billion & we're not adapting to earth in time stuntcat Jun 2012 #29
world population in 1960 = 3,039,451,023. If it had quadrupled over 50 years population would HiPointDem Jun 2012 #40
excuse me, in 3/4 century stuntcat Jun 2012 #41
i really despise the denigratory phrases like "sexing each other" "squirting out miracles" HiPointDem Jun 2012 #53
Especially since so many rich people have more than 2.47 kids. Zalatix Jun 2012 #56
You know I am all for colonizing space nadinbrzezinski Jun 2012 #32
All the money in the world will NOT protect the very rich? It does in Mexico. Zalatix Jun 2012 #57
No, that is not the kind of crash we are talking about nadinbrzezinski Jun 2012 #61
Population control, sustainability, space exploration, colonization and resource mining Uncle Joe Jun 2012 #33
Hawking was just being entertaining KurtNYC Jun 2012 #43
Physicist Bartlett: sustainable growth is contradiction Democrats_win Jun 2012 #51
duh. we'll have socialism once all the wealth is consolidated into 4 families' hands & HiPointDem Jun 2012 #54
Population control isn't enough by itself, but it's a NECESSARY part of the solution. Jim Lane Jun 2012 #55
Hawking was speaking about the threat to Humanity of alien invasion IDemo Jun 2012 #58
That doesn't contradict what I said. Zalatix Jun 2012 #59
The best form of population control is ending poverty. Dash87 Jun 2012 #60
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