General Discussion

Ikonoklast

(23,973 posts)

55. Correct. See: Canada, history of health care.

Fri Jun 29, 2012, 02:55 PM

Jun 2012

It didn't happen overnight.

So many wanted perfection in a health bill, or nothing.

Perfect, enemy of the good, and all that is lost on them.

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Let's see......a couple of anonymous DU'ers---- or............... [View all] trumad Jun 2012 OP

Love Stacey Canfield's message RockaFowler Jun 2012 #1

Who is she? Quantess Jun 2012 #44

I believe it's Natoma Canfield and reporter Stacey Frey Kennah Jun 2012 #110

The anonymous DU'ers see this victory as a stumbling block to The Glorius Revolution. Ikonoklast Jun 2012 #2

1917 Russia not happening treestar Jun 2012 #3

Millions dead. No one I knew, so it's all good. Ikonoklast Jun 2012 #11

Now THIS is offensive. maddiemom Jun 2012 #35

I think it is an honest assessment of a mindset found sometimes on DU. Skidmore Jun 2012 #54

I agree--it's all MY way or the highway. No nuance, no understanding, no maturity. MADem Jun 2012 #79

Theyd say the same about you.. iamthebandfanman Jun 2012 #111

You're truly making no sense... trumad Jun 2012 #149

perfectly stated ! Laura PourMeADrink Jun 2012 #140

Yep, exactly. TheWraith Jun 2012 #62

Einstein advocated for the end of capitalism and was a communist. white_wolf Jun 2012 #76

He was also a pacifist that abhorred violence. Ikonoklast Jun 2012 #90

And anyone who advocates for continuation of the status quo Doctor_J Jun 2012 #153

"Just because you're blazingly smart does not mean you have political acumen" Capn Sunshine Jul 2012 #229

this is the most hateful thing seen here yet CleanLucre Jun 2012 #64

It's an ironic statement. That's obvious if you read the comment contextually. nt MADem Jun 2012 #80

not beginning with #2 and your #79 CleanLucre Jun 2012 #83

I don't agree. MADem Jun 2012 #104

In a week?...nt SidDithers Jun 2012 #180

That is the craziest thing I ever saw on DU. Where on earth do you get that stuff from? robinlynne Jun 2012 #65

Ikonoklast got that argument from the Heritage Foundation and the right wing think tanks Zalatix Jun 2012 #116

The right wing think tanks are against health care for all. joshcryer Jun 2012 #123

The Heritage Foundation actually was the first to propose the Individual Mandate. Zalatix Jun 2012 #125

Yes, I'm well aware of this bullshit spin. joshcryer Jun 2012 #126

And you respond with bullshit spin. Zalatix Jun 2012 #128

They're extremely different. joshcryer Jun 2012 #129

"Mandates are necessary. Single Payer will require mandates, etc." Zalatix Jun 2012 #130

Because they both are going to cost you. joshcryer Jun 2012 #131

"Because they both are going to cost you"? If you think this is anyone's beef with the mandate Zalatix Jun 2012 #134

I don't think it, I know it. You even make the argument. joshcryer Jun 2012 #142

The problem here is that you "know" so many things that are simply not true. Zalatix Jun 2012 #144

Yes, they take a disproportionate piece of the pie. joshcryer Jun 2012 #146

Apologies for the disparaging remark. Zalatix Jun 2012 #147

You remove the mandate you take away the biggest pressure to improve it. joshcryer Jun 2012 #148

Well, I am not sure how credible this following claim is, but I keep hearing it. Zalatix Jun 2012 #150

It's all about choice perception. joshcryer Jun 2012 #185

But then 30 corporations called Obama's bluff and got him to back down. Zalatix Jun 2012 #189

So no one will argue that this is Romneycare? DirkGently Jun 2012 #174

RomneyCare is not the same as HeritageFoundationCare. joshcryer Jun 2012 #186

+1,000! Zalatix Jun 2012 #190

Act for the relief of sick and disabled seamen, 1789 Major Nikon Jun 2012 #136

Yes, you had to be an employer of sailors in that case. Zalatix Jun 2012 #137

The mandate was for the sailors themselves Major Nikon Jun 2012 #138

Yes, and you could avoid it by not being a sailor. How will you avoid this? Zalatix Jun 2012 #139

The ACA mandate doesn't pertain to "being alive" Major Nikon Jun 2012 #141

I think you misunderstand. The reason many of us are against the mandate to purchase from robinlynne Jun 2012 #165

To be clear, I hate a mandate without a public option. joshcryer Jun 2012 #187

there NEEDS to be! We really need socialized medicine. period. robinlynne Jun 2012 #191

Ironically, they appear to be bourgeoisie themselves. joshcryer Jun 2012 #121

treestar Diclotican Jun 2012 #84

That is an absolute bullshit lie and you know it. Zalatix Jun 2012 #115

You haven't been on DU nearly as long as I have treestar Jun 2012 #151

Sure you have. Zalatix Jun 2012 #152

Not specifically right now treestar Jun 2012 #154

Oh I see what your problem is. Zalatix Jun 2012 #155

Riots in Europe caused their safety nets to develop? treestar Jun 2012 #156

In France Zalatix Jun 2012 #164

I heard about the riots in England treestar Jun 2012 #167

Hell yeah I condone it. The French handled their business. Nobody got the guillotine. Zalatix Jun 2012 #171

You condone kidnapping and cops getting burned. At least we've established that. treestar Jul 2012 #198

Peaceful protesters get shot and beaten and pepper sprayed. Enjoy. Zalatix Jul 2012 #210

Perhaps that is more extreme treestar Jul 2012 #212

“Those who make peaceful protest impossible make violent protest inevitable" Zalatix Jul 2012 #213

Kidnapping is a CRIME treestar Jul 2012 #214

"Neither the US nor France prohibits peaceful protest" BWAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Zalatix Jul 2012 #217

All the time? treestar Jul 2012 #218

From all the knee slapper level errors you've posted it's apparent you haven't seen Occupy. Zalatix Jul 2012 #219

What are you raving on about? Are you unaware that the Occupy people treestar Jul 2012 #222

Wow, so much ignorance in your post. You really don't get it, do you? Zalatix Jul 2012 #226

I am sorry u don't believe treestar, however I have seen the same post hes talking about NavyDavy Jul 2012 #201

Why is it always "I can't point them out" or "I can't even find any now"? but yet Zalatix Jul 2012 #211

I found some and listed them in this post - 205 treestar Jul 2012 #215

Exactly Davy, it is a general mindset on DU treestar Jul 2012 #216

who are they? why are you talking about a they that does not exist? robinlynne Jun 2012 #192

Throughout the years there have been such posts treestar Jul 2012 #197

I agree treestar some will not believe you even if u post the post that ur referring to, NavyDavy Jul 2012 #202

I can't even find any now, because it is such a general impression treestar Jul 2012 #205

Who died and made you Joe McCarthy? Comrade Grumpy Jun 2012 #14

Stop hyperventilating. Ikonoklast Jun 2012 #17

The ACA is an advance, but doesn't go nearly far enough. Comrade Grumpy Jun 2012 #25

Says a lot about people who side with Scalia over Ginsburg too Major Nikon Jun 2012 #36

The problem is, by the nature liberalhistorian Jun 2012 #45

Correct. See: Canada, history of health care. Ikonoklast Jun 2012 #55

Yes, because the history of Canada mirrors the history of the US. progressoid Jun 2012 #58

Well it does in many ways treestar Jun 2012 #70

it may be DonCoquixote Jun 2012 #114

No one thought single payer rudycantfail Jun 2012 #175

true. robinlynne Jun 2012 #193

Slap that baby for not taking a big enough first step! Scootaloo Jun 2012 #46

The problem is private insurance, not incremental steps eridani Jul 2012 #228

Social Security is far different from when it was first passed. LiberalFighter Jun 2012 #53

Since when was Social Security ever a mandate to purchase retirement plans eridani Jun 2012 #85

I did not reply on the issue of mandates LiberalFighter Jun 2012 #87

I replied on the differing basic foundations of the two problems eridani Jul 2012 #227

right on! robinlynne Jun 2012 #194

It is a great victory treestar Jun 2012 #67

That's just BS - TBF Jun 2012 #56

Does the CPUSA endorse the ACA? treestar Jun 2012 #71

Here - TBF Jun 2012 #74

I think our official position is to fight for eventual Single Payer Starry Messenger Jun 2012 #102

The "Leftists want to get rid of the ACA" meme is mostly myth. Zalatix Jun 2012 #119

You are imagining things, to begin with. I have never seen a poster who wants choas, and does not ca robinlynne Jun 2012 #69

Yes. There's a lot dishonest spinning here. DirkGently Jun 2012 #172

Can't get much more "socialist" than the only one in the Senate!!! MADem Jun 2012 #82

Who died and made you Joe McCarthy? Zalatix Jun 2012 #117

One of the most voracious anti-ACA posters even admitted as much. joshcryer Jun 2012 #122

No kidding, Comrade. tblue Jun 2012 #30

Thank-you. weird stuff spilling out there. robinlynne Jun 2012 #66

Its not "wierd stuff". bvar22 Jun 2012 #88

ok. lol robinlynne Jun 2012 #93

+1 limpyhobbler Jun 2012 #68

half baked is better than no baked, IMHO.....and you have to start somewhere.....sorry ur NavyDavy Jul 2012 #203

and the anonymous alerter failed to get your post hidden snooper2 Jun 2012 #34

I was voting on Treestar's quote above, by mistake. maddiemom Jun 2012 #37

I have a fan club, or so it would seem. Ikonoklast Jun 2012 #41

Throw a rock into a pack of dogs,the one that yelps is the one you hit. Swede Jun 2012 #49

And when all the dogs get pissed off and bite you for offending one of their pack, then what? Zalatix Jun 2012 #118

What a terrible thing to say or think! robinlynne Jun 2012 #195

Throw a rock into a pack of dogs and I hope your ass is arrested for cruelty. robinlynne Jun 2012 #196

Reverend Al Sharpton made the saying famous. Swede Jul 2012 #224

disgusting. And I do like the reverend very much. I have cared for abused dogs. robinlynne Jul 2012 #230

u r wrong heaven05 Jun 2012 #50

Wrong thread? bornskeptic Jun 2012 #96

Then again.... Spitfire of ATJ Jun 2012 #63

The Tea Party doesn't have a monopoly on Teh Stoopid... chervilant Jun 2012 #158

It's not that people are stupid Spitfire of ATJ Jun 2012 #182

hmm... chervilant Jun 2012 #184

Oh come on Spitfire of ATJ Jun 2012 #188

SOME of the people chervilant Jul 2012 #199

I don't buy that. Spitfire of ATJ Jul 2012 #204

I'm not surprised chervilant Jul 2012 #206

Luckily I live in California. Spitfire of ATJ Jul 2012 #207

Unfortunately, chervilant Jul 2012 #208

Funny, isn't it how in the South you can disagree about everything Spitfire of ATJ Jul 2012 #209

This should be up for DUzy iamthebandfanman Jun 2012 #112

That's a fair enough observation. joshcryer Jun 2012 #120

RW radicals want the government to fail to bring in their glorious new order. freshwest Jun 2012 #135

Wow! Really? nt Zorra Jun 2012 #179

k&r... spanone Jun 2012 #4

after listening to thom hartmann yesterday i'm changing my position nashville_brook Jun 2012 #5

Thom can always be counted on for providing a much-needed dose of reason. GoCubsGo Jun 2012 #24

plus 1 chknltl Jun 2012 #51

I have always said, RoccoR5955 Jun 2012 #39

agreed - and, I'd add, the meme that those critical of this approach were pining for Single Payer nashville_brook Jun 2012 #170

I'm laughing my head off at ... frazzled Jun 2012 #143

so, hey Frazzled -- I'm laughing my head off at your ludicrous (wrong, of course) nashville_brook Jun 2012 #168

"Business" & corporatist ownership of healthcare are a wee bit different DirkGently Jun 2012 #169

The anonymous DU'ers... TZ Jun 2012 #6

And you won't.. trumad Jun 2012 #7

It was. WilliamPitt Jun 2012 #8

Yep---you are directly affected. trumad Jun 2012 #9

heck yes its scary TZ Jun 2012 #10

A friend is a cancer survivor. xmas74 Jun 2012 #61

There was a time when this would have helped me tremendously loyalsister Jun 2012 #73

Don't forget.. Looking for political purity nadinbrzezinski Jun 2012 #12

And have good insurance to begin with. RiffRandell Jun 2012 #18

Presente. Oh, and I'm not anonymous, either. EFerrari Jun 2012 #40

I am a Type 2 diabetic. I keep very close control. I have a job that provides good insurance. Raster Jun 2012 #98

I love you trumad. n/t cali Jun 2012 #13

DU rec...nt SidDithers Jun 2012 #15

This is a BFD!! Greybnk48 Jun 2012 #16

ZING! These people put there names and reputations on the line, unlike anonymous internet posters. FarLeftFist Jun 2012 #19

Did you tell us your name? tblue Jun 2012 #31

Me? Just a hard-working blue collar Union member who doesn't get enough airtime. FarLeftFist Jun 2012 #59

k & r HappyMe Jun 2012 #20

K&R! nt Chorophyll Jun 2012 #21

Are they agaist the ACA because it is good for business? Rain Mcloud Jun 2012 #22

They all pretty much say this is a first step in the right direction.. annabanana Jun 2012 #23

Thanks. Give ACA a chance. JDPriestly Jun 2012 #26

Why have a thread denouncing DUers? Just celebrate and stop putting others down. tblue Jun 2012 #27

indeed ibegurpard Jun 2012 #91

+100. nt Mojorabbit Jun 2012 #103

It is as Moore says, a mandate for action.... Bluenorthwest Jun 2012 #28

Well Done! bvar22 Jun 2012 #89

We agree, mirabile dictu! MineralMan Jun 2012 #29

I didn't like the way the law turned out, but I was still glad it was upheld yurbud Jun 2012 #32

You said it best... MrMickeysMom Jun 2012 #105

Kudos... a la izquierda Jun 2012 #33

K&R Raffi Ella Jun 2012 #38

Excellent OP. nt msanthrope Jun 2012 #42

Thx! Great post. RegieRocker Jun 2012 #43

Great company to keep with!! Thanks, trumad. freshwest Jun 2012 #47

Hear Hear, Sir The Magistrate Jun 2012 #48

Ding ding we have a winner malaise Jun 2012 #52

So long as we dont have to agree with MM & DK on anything else. Dr Fate Jun 2012 #57

Some of those quotes are taken slightly out of context. limpyhobbler Jun 2012 #60

But you do notice,,,, trumad Jun 2012 #160

From Sanders' quote, rudycantfail Jun 2012 #177

Trumad -- how optimistic of you! This deserves a big ol' K&R! pacalo Jun 2012 #72

LOL...this will really annoy the ones who want to be pissed about good news! Logical Jun 2012 #75

K&R, trumad Auggie Jun 2012 #77

Trumad, well done! I feel the very same way! nt MADem Jun 2012 #78

Senator Sanders said that from day 1 of the PP & ACA, TTE, it's not what he had wanted but it IS patrice Jun 2012 #81

Apparently it isn't possible to cheer for a tactical victory without eridani Jun 2012 #86

+1 CleanLucre Jun 2012 #95

That amoral values system you speak of, wasn't created by the Affordable care act Hippo_Tron Jun 2012 #106

Yes, that's very true. ACA is probably the best we can get as long as eridani Jun 2012 #107

I understand, but I'm mostly a utiltarian when it comes to governing philosophy Hippo_Tron Jun 2012 #109

+1,000,000,000 x 1,000,000,000. Please, please consider turning coalition_unwilling Jun 2012 #132

yes, the McCarthyites are out en masse in this thread Doctor_J Jun 2012 #162

I come to DU to hear anonymous people Enrique Jun 2012 #92

I agree with those famous people in this case Enrique Jun 2012 #94

The inventor of the wheel is an anonymous person. athenasatanjesus Jun 2012 #97

heh, heh.... fascisthunter Jun 2012 #99

Nice post Trumad! CreekDog Jun 2012 #100

Well! Hrmph! Michael Moore, Krugman, Sanders and Kucinich are all just DLC/Blue Dog sellouts! bluestateguy Jun 2012 #101

I agree. nm rhett o rick Jun 2012 #108

maybe if ya tell them to 'go fuck themselves' iamthebandfanman Jun 2012 #113

K&R SunSeeker Jun 2012 #124

Get this to the greatest page!! DonCoquixote Jun 2012 #127

A reasonble argument in the OP, JoeyT Jun 2012 #133

THANK YOU for starting this thread! PBass Jun 2012 #145

Thanks trumad. Baitball Blogger Jun 2012 #157

You might want to add this malaise Jun 2012 #159

This message was self-deleted by its author Doctor_J Jun 2012 #161

YES!! BlancheSplanchnik Jun 2012 #163

Of course, every single one of those people know we need universal healthcare DirkGently Jun 2012 #166

I wouldn't call pre-sexisting conditions a modest change. trumad Jun 2012 #173

Would you call it the solution? DirkGently Jun 2012 #176

I don't know what "pre-sextisting conditions" you have, but mine require modesty. nashville_brook Jun 2012 #178

Im like what are you talking about. trumad Jun 2012 #181

I don't know how it will play out, I'm not sure anyone does Autumn Jun 2012 #183

K & R Scurrilous Jul 2012 #200

Let's see... a DU poster who admits he's here merely to stir shit, or anything else in the world.... LanternWaste Jul 2012 #220

It's 5pm somewhere. trumad Jul 2012 #221

No, see, those people only have credibility when they're criticizing Obama. Arkana Jul 2012 #223

Boy, did this thread stir up a hornets nest NNN0LHI Jul 2012 #225