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unblock

(56,193 posts)

25. did i have a crystal ball, no. but i knew the way sausage is made in washington, so i knew

Sat Jun 30, 2012, 11:24 PM

Jun 2012

there would be changes, and i had a pretty good sense that obama would go with whatever he could get passed.

frankly, though, i think it was the republicans and the conservadems in congress who forced his hand.

and with the benefit of hindsight, i think it's pretty clear that had he stuck with the public option, the whole thing would have gone down like clinton's plan.

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why don't the anti-aca folks just form and join the church of i-don't-believe-in-health-insurance? [View all] unblock Jun 2012 OP

There are so many loopholes that honestly I think if they're credible... joshcryer Jun 2012 #1

None of them are going to have to pay anything, yet they still squeal like pigs harun Jul 2012 #52

The presidential candidate I supported was against the private mandate.. Fumesucker Jun 2012 #2

LOL, I just realized I'd responded to this before. Twilight zone! joshcryer Jun 2012 #3

Yes, I remember.. Fumesucker Jun 2012 #6

I thought mandates were a no-brainer at the time, but I never... joshcryer Jun 2012 #7

Did you also think Obama lacked a brain? Fumesucker Jun 2012 #12

I thought it was a glorious messaging approach. joshcryer Jun 2012 #14

One man's "glorious messaging approach" is another man's "baldfaced lie".. Fumesucker Jun 2012 #19

I'm open to accepting it was a baldfaced lie. joshcryer Jun 2012 #26

I think that Obama was convinced by somebody at some point Proud Liberal Dem Jul 2012 #55

As I originally said, I think it was messaging. joshcryer Jul 2012 #57

I think he was naive and thought most people would participate in the system if premiums were Hoyt Jul 2012 #74

The presidential candidate I supported was against the private mandate.. Zalatix Jun 2012 #13

He was also for closing Gitmo. joshcryer Jun 2012 #16

I'm STILL voting for Obama in 2012. I'm still contributing to his campaign. Zalatix Jun 2012 #20

It's nighttime here. joshcryer Jun 2012 #23

I'm pushing O'Malley in 2016. Chan790 Jul 2012 #46

I like her ideology, but frankly, I'll take a partisan over a bipartisan any day. joshcryer Jul 2012 #47

LOL thinking the same damned thing. Warren 2016. Who for Veep? Zalatix Jul 2012 #75

Is Obama now going around telling us how not closing Gitmo is the greatest thing ever? Fumesucker Jun 2012 #24

Heh! Touche. joshcryer Jun 2012 #27

You were the one who brought up Gitmo.. Fumesucker Jun 2012 #30

Gitmo was an example of something outside of his control. joshcryer Jun 2012 #33

If it had a public option.. Fumesucker Jun 2012 #36

The mandate will assure it will. joshcryer Jun 2012 #43

The insurance companies now have their fangs in our jugulars.. Fumesucker Jul 2012 #48

Yes, he was strongly against it DJ13 Jun 2012 #28

had it been called a tax all along would there even be such objections? stabbed in the back, really? unblock Jun 2012 #4

Did you think in 2008 that Obama was going to call for the private mandate? Fumesucker Jun 2012 #9

did i have a crystal ball, no. but i knew the way sausage is made in washington, so i knew unblock Jun 2012 #25

OMB, liberal economists, Paul Krugman all saw a no-mandate approach was more expensive. joshcryer Jun 2012 #10

Of course no mandate would be more expensive.. Fumesucker Jun 2012 #15

No, the reason it was deemed more expensive... joshcryer Jun 2012 #17

So you're telling me there *is* an alternative to ripoff private insurance? Fumesucker Jun 2012 #29

The OP has explained it to you, clearly. joshcryer Jun 2012 #31

The OP was a rant, not an explanation.. Fumesucker Jun 2012 #38

Pfft, I'm tempted to start the No Health Insurance Church. joshcryer Jun 2012 #44

Then Krugman is incorrect. girl gone mad Jul 2012 #66

I'll take Krugman over anonymous message board posters. joshcryer Jul 2012 #69

Does not address my points. girl gone mad Jul 2012 #72

You've redfined "freeloaders" outside the scope of the models. joshcryer Jul 2012 #73

what if obama had simply raised income taxes .... DJ13 Jun 2012 #34

yeah, well, sigh, unfortunately, we didn't get president kucinich and the 75th congress.... unblock Jun 2012 #41

Don't give em any ideas. longship Jun 2012 #5

knowing the way they think, if the idea originated on du, they'll never go near it! unblock Jun 2012 #11

So now objecting to buying for profit health insurance EFerrari Jun 2012 #8

no, failing to pay the tax makes one a tax evader. unblock Jun 2012 #18

Boom. That's a brilliance bit of logic. joshcryer Jun 2012 #21

Two things. EFerrari Jun 2012 #32

well, you're certainly right that the right-wing will always find some cause to get riled up about unblock Jun 2012 #37

I have insomnia so I watch late night teevee. EFerrari Jun 2012 #40

Easier than that. Ruby the Liberal Jun 2012 #22

It's probably a bad idea to marginalize wholesale EFerrari Jun 2012 #35

is it any different than the way the banking industry is enshrined in our housing system? unblock Jun 2012 #39

Is the banking industry really the best counter-example you could come up with? Fumesucker Jun 2012 #45

i'm not a cheerleader here. i'm just pointing out that there's nothing different about this unblock Jul 2012 #50

Yes, it really is different. The many countries that do it differently EFerrari Jul 2012 #53

i agree that american policy has become truly messed up in many respects. unblock Jul 2012 #77

Heritage Foundation policy has now become Democratic orthodoxy... Fumesucker Jun 2012 #42

Do you ProSense Jul 2012 #49

I have my perspective and you have yours.. Fumesucker Jul 2012 #51

Yeah, ProSense Jul 2012 #58

I am confused. Do you agree with Fumesucker that the mandate is rhett o rick Jul 2012 #59

It was a ProSense Jul 2012 #60

The mandate is highly divisive, that's made perfectly clear just by this thread. Fumesucker Jul 2012 #63

Well, ProSense Jul 2012 #67

The meme is that health care reform is done, finis, fait accompli.. Fumesucker Jul 2012 #70

It is divisive because the effect has been blown out of proportion. rhett o rick Jul 2012 #78

I'm commenting on what *is*, not what might be.. Fumesucker Jul 2012 #62

Here's ProSense Jul 2012 #64

Nope, health insurance reform perhaps, health care reform not so much.. Fumesucker Jul 2012 #65

This makes ProSense Jul 2012 #68

Yep. EFerrari Jul 2012 #54

You mean the Church of Tea? ashling Jul 2012 #56

Because they'd have to give up their Medicare, VA and other socialist goodies. Those are exempt from freshwest Jul 2012 #61

There actually is a church like that: Christian Scientist Initech Jul 2012 #71

my point is that they don't have to abandon anything they already believe. unblock Jul 2012 #76