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Gore1FL

(22,942 posts)

347. They were Classical Liberals. I provided links.

Tue Apr 18, 2017, 11:59 AM

Apr 2017

Trying to apply modern values to 1776 is absurd. To suggest that those who overthrew Tories and based a new government on the philosophies of John Lock, "Father of Liberalism," were anything other than pretty far out to the left in their day is strange denial of reality on your part.

They were liberal for their day. Likewise for abolitionists in the pre-Civil War era. You can find hard right conservatives today that are against slavery. In their day, abolitionist were pretty god-damned progressive, however.

Being an activist doesn't make one left. Being a liberal and being an activist for liberal ideas however does put one in a further leftward category than being middle-of-the-road. I am at a loss as to why this is is so hard for you to grok.

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It would be nice if the far left, for once, did some introspection. [View all] DanTex Apr 2017 OP

Yes, no one likes people who lecture, constantly complain, and are constantly dissatisfied. Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #1

Except when it comes to weed. Then we all love complainers... DanTex Apr 2017 #2

What? Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #5

So you're satisfied with the weed laws in this country? News to me! DanTex Apr 2017 #8

I'm satisfied with the weed laws in my state. Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #11

I guess that's why you've never complained about it before... DanTex Apr 2017 #15

Like I said Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #19

I don't think weed should be illegal, but the fact of the matter is... DanTex Apr 2017 #24

It's an issue. People have been trying to blow it off or treat it like a joke for too fucking long. Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #35

I agree with a lot of that. I don't know why you treat me like an enemy. DanTex Apr 2017 #46

No.... I have no idea what Jeff Sessions has said on the matter. Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #48

Google it. I'm surprised you don't know. Hmmm. DanTex Apr 2017 #50

That was sarcasm. Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #59

An issue more important than weed? Gee, let's see. DanTex Apr 2017 #159

Okay, but these "far left" people you seem to think you're battling Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #162

Well, they claim to be committed to those issues. DanTex Apr 2017 #174

Why are you wasting time obsessing over what the people at counterpunch think? Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #178

Probably the same reason you obsess over weed laws that you can't do anything to change. DanTex Apr 2017 #180

I think you allowed yourself to be distracted Hortensis Apr 2017 #242

Oh, the weed laws are changing. Believe me. Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #281

Good to hear. Soon you will be in heaven then. DanTex Apr 2017 #286

I live in Oregon, I don't need "heaven". Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #287

LOL. Yeah, Manhattan. DanTex Apr 2017 #292

I have. The East Coast is not for me, although I know plenty of people who thrive on it. Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #296

Well, then maybe it's on me to visit Oregon. DanTex Apr 2017 #297

I do not smoke at all and really never have fun n serious Apr 2017 #143

That's because there isn't a real war on those issues. but there is on abortion rights JI7 Apr 2017 #23

You need to be more specific with these elaborate straw creatures you are constructing Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #27

you are the one who compared it to porn JI7 Apr 2017 #36

I also compared it to booze. Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #40

Damn! NurseJackie Apr 2017 #39

"Dan" himself said we should do some introspection, too. Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #140

Oh my! :-D NurseJackie Apr 2017 #151

clever Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #154

I know. NurseJackie Apr 2017 #166

dont forget the helmet! Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #169

. NurseJackie Apr 2017 #173

There is no reason to stand in the way of Big Weed HoneyBadger Apr 2017 #231

"big weed" is a bs term kevin sabet came up with to rebrand failed prohibition arguments. Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #322

.... Warpy Apr 2017 #4

So why does it persist? George II Apr 2017 #86

because energy cannot be created or destroyed? Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #133

Glad you got that off your chest, Dan. pangaia Apr 2017 #3

Yeah, me too....Geez..n/t monmouth4 Apr 2017 #12

Sure, as long as you are not including folks like Keith Ellison in your description of the Far Left Tom Rinaldo Apr 2017 #6

I absolutely do not include folks like Keith Ellison. I admire him. DanTex Apr 2017 #10

Fifteen years ago both those publications were somewhat readable. LisaM Apr 2017 #285

during obama's yrs the party did little locally, regionally, or state legislatures and got clobbered msongs Apr 2017 #7

It would be nice if the far left pick the traitorous pig up by the Lint Head Apr 2017 #9

My introspection Cartoonist Apr 2017 #13

... opiate69 Apr 2017 #16

We nominated the most progressive candidate in decades. DanTex Apr 2017 #17

The platform was progressive, yes. Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #22

Indeed, as was the candidate. And the candidate lost. DanTex Apr 2017 #26

it was a progressive platform! Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #30

I agree that people should read the Dem and GOP platform and compare them. DanTex Apr 2017 #34

I think if people agree with the GOP platform at all, there's a problem. Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #42

Agreed, for sure. DanTex Apr 2017 #47

Bernie pushed her left. zentrum Apr 2017 #367

I, too, am strongly of the opinion that Bernie Sanders caused HRC to be a better candidate. Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #368

Yeah, you and I need to zentrum Apr 2017 #371

Most progressive? Cartoonist Apr 2017 #89

Of course she had flaws. But she was more progressive than Obama, Kerry, Gore, or Bill. DanTex Apr 2017 #92

No one has President Obama's "charisma" but he most Cha Apr 2017 #137

How is Hillary more progressive than POTUS Obama? FDRsGhost Apr 2017 #161

Look at the campaign that she ran. DanTex Apr 2017 #165

I agree and also disagree FDRsGhost Apr 2017 #170

Hillary was not more progressive than Obama, her immediate predecessor as nominee karynnj Apr 2017 #261

As always, let's give all the credit to the male candidate. athena Apr 2017 #277

Bingo. n/t QC Apr 2017 #20

... SixString Apr 2017 #31

Exactly. (n/t) SMC22307 Apr 2017 #73

Yet another great fallacy ... NanceGreggs Apr 2017 #77

I disagree with your analysis. Cartoonist Apr 2017 #99

Everything Nance wrote is factually correct. There are no alternative facts there. nt stevenleser Apr 2017 #109

Your disagreement ... NanceGreggs Apr 2017 #116

The wrong choice Cartoonist Apr 2017 #177

But alas if Bernie was nominee Bloomberg would of run Chevy Apr 2017 #379

Sanders lost to Hillary. That's a fact lunamagica Apr 2017 #120

This message was self-deleted by its author comradebillyboy Apr 2017 #131

Thank you Nance...nt comradebillyboy Apr 2017 #132

This is plain wrong: Tom Rinaldo Apr 2017 #196

Hmm.. Kentonio Apr 2017 #212

Sooooo NOT the point. NanceGreggs Apr 2017 #268

Not losing, stolen. nt William769 Apr 2017 #103

Hillary had the most Progressive Platform of any Democratic Cha Apr 2017 #121

Ah, Yes, the Ideologically Pure Dammit Jim Apr 2017 #156

Agree on both statements...and riversedge Apr 2017 #187

Thank You Muchly Dammit Jim Apr 2017 #194

Most definitely stein and sarandon own Cha Apr 2017 #288

Did Susan change her phone number? lapucelle Apr 2017 #404

No I had forgotten that pos Hypocrisy from sarandon.. Cha Apr 2017 #405

Couldn't have said it better. StubbornThings Apr 2017 #216

If YOU are satisfied, then you're not doing it right! dchill Apr 2017 #14

That depends what you are talking about LOL. DanTex Apr 2017 #18

there is no far left that wants socialism JI7 Apr 2017 #21

Can't dispute what you've seen, cheapdate Apr 2017 #38

reads jacobin and quotes Zizek forjusticethunders Apr 2017 #185

Those were just some illustrative examples. cheapdate Apr 2017 #264

My point is that "actual leftist socialists" are frauds too forjusticethunders Apr 2017 #311

Okay. You know my friends then? cheapdate Apr 2017 #313

these types have always been out there. it's more like a cool kids club than actual political JI7 Apr 2017 #318

I see. I'll bet I could guess your "type" too. cheapdate Apr 2017 #326

exactly, the lack of involvement in lower level office pretty much shows this JI7 Apr 2017 #319

Zizek is an idiot, but everybody should subscribe to Jacobin. DemocraticWing Apr 2017 #329

No argument there. cheapdate Apr 2017 #340

I want socialism! DemocraticWing Apr 2017 #328

Introspection is for others.. 3rd party voters are smugly Cha Apr 2017 #25

Hey Cha, what's happening with you? CajunBlazer Apr 2017 #233

Not much.. just Cha Apr 2017 #291

Nothing much CajunBlazer Apr 2017 #293

You're productive.. Mahalo Cha Apr 2017 #294

Thanks, I need all of the luck I can get CajunBlazer Apr 2017 #295

We need to be as progressive as possible while being electable. . . . nt JEFF9K Apr 2017 #28

I see only truths. K & R JHan Apr 2017 #29

So let me see....... Glitterati Apr 2017 #32

Seriously, tell me what the hard left has accomplished. Ever. I rest my case. DanTex Apr 2017 #37

There's a case here? Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #41

Post removed Post removed Apr 2017 #43

... opiate69 Apr 2017 #45

Indeed, the far left are losers, who have failed in every possible way. DanTex Apr 2017 #49

Post removed Post removed Apr 2017 #52

That was very original. How did you think of that? DanTex Apr 2017 #54

Post removed Post removed Apr 2017 #57

So witty! No wonder the far left has made so much progress! DanTex Apr 2017 #58

And if you stomp your feet a few more times Glitterati Apr 2017 #60

And meanwhile, the clueless far left will still accomplish nothing. Seriously, wake up. DanTex Apr 2017 #61

Post removed Post removed Apr 2017 #64

As long as you don't name one accomplishment of the far left, you prove my point. DanTex Apr 2017 #66

All you have are personal attacks and insults.. when someone Cha Apr 2017 #111

This is very true. Kentonio Apr 2017 #215

3rd party voters are Losers and Clueless.. that's being kind Cha Apr 2017 #290

Dan didn't direct his insults at 3rd party voters Kentonio Apr 2017 #321

There's a meltdown going on but you need to Cha Apr 2017 #106

People in glass houses Glitterati Apr 2017 #44

The left pushed the social issues and won askyagerz Apr 2017 #125

MA is a progressive state which was the first to legalize gay marriage. We voted for Hillary. n/t seaglass Apr 2017 #147

Thank you from the bottom of my fucking heart elehhhhna Apr 2017 #53

+1 FDRsGhost Apr 2017 #163

I think that living to be constantly oppositional is often frazzled Apr 2017 #33

And it is easy to dupe them with fake news as the past election shows. All you have to do is nikibatts Apr 2017 #51

"Like, you know, " mahannah Apr 2017 #55

Post removed Post removed Apr 2017 #56

Tell me one thing the far left has accomplished. Ever. I rest my case. DanTex Apr 2017 #63

Oh wait ... winning frazzled Apr 2017 #98

Fine. Run Hillary again. Put Debbie in charge . Winning. elehhhhna Apr 2017 #157

Losing centrists? You mean like the ones who turned around the massive losses stevenleser Apr 2017 #112

There are no "Losing Centrists that run the party".. you Cha Apr 2017 #124

Another mighty wall of straw, which will defend from the invisible enemy . . . hatrack Apr 2017 #62

You could defeat the "wall of straw" by naming one thing the far left has accomplished. DanTex Apr 2017 #65

Post removed Post removed Apr 2017 #130

So let me get this straight - CajunBlazer Apr 2017 #280

I certainly don't have to answer to you ProfessorPlum Apr 2017 #302

Hmmm.... I think you have answers CajunBlazer Apr 2017 #314

Yeah, good luck with that ProfessorPlum Apr 2017 #315

My suspicions are confirmed CajunBlazer Apr 2017 #316

So, your suspicions are that I have to vote for my best option ProfessorPlum Apr 2017 #325

My suspicions are that you aren't practical enough.... CajunBlazer Apr 2017 #363

You really said this??????? George II Apr 2017 #309

I can't believe that's still there. betsuni Apr 2017 #317

LOL! betsuni Apr 2017 #330

Your concern is noted ProfessorPlum Apr 2017 #331

Nope. Obama did not want to make a grand bargain. betsuni Apr 2017 #332

Your understanding of why regulations are needed ProfessorPlum Apr 2017 #333

Oh dear, you've called me both childish and a naive child in two posts. betsuni Apr 2017 #337

No, I want you to stop being naive and childish ProfessorPlum Apr 2017 #341

Ah, ohhh, I love it when you insult me, big grand bargain turn-on! betsuni Apr 2017 #344

All you have are vapid insults.. "BlahblahblahblahBLAH" Cha Apr 2017 #126

How many more years of "Bernie SUX!" do you want? hatrack Apr 2017 #181

Oh, brother. NurseJackie Apr 2017 #189

Whatever . . . hatrack Apr 2017 #192

Thank you! n/t QC Apr 2017 #284

Yes, it's my Democratic Party and I don't want BS Cha Apr 2017 #289

Well, you can worry about what Sanders says, or what everyone else DOES . . . hatrack Apr 2017 #306

BS isn't helping with misrepresentaion of the Democratic Party. Cha Apr 2017 #310

I vaguely remember last spring and summer how we were told here at DU and other rpannier Apr 2017 #67

it's biting us all collectively in the ass. JHan Apr 2017 #68

No, but given the amout of energy some people put into the drama here Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #69

Tell me one thing the far left has accomplished. I rest my case. DanTex Apr 2017 #70

Define far left and the period in which you speak rpannier Apr 2017 #83

The period is the last 30 years. DanTex Apr 2017 #87

Wow! Such a short period. But since you're asking for anything rpannier Apr 2017 #97

You know, my lifetime. The 1800s is great and all. DanTex Apr 2017 #105

That wasn't what you asked for rpannier Apr 2017 #110

What DU doesn't have enough of is "Let's take a shit on the left" threads. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #71

I was hoping someone could tell me one thing the far left has accomplished. DanTex Apr 2017 #72

Your question is rhetorically vague. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #75

I was talking the last three or four decades. My lifetime. And the answer is nothing. DanTex Apr 2017 #79

The Democrats include the far left in their coalition Gore1FL Apr 2017 #84

The "middle of the road" got us Obamacare and gay rights, for starters. DanTex Apr 2017 #90

Nope. The middle of the road hindered those efforts. Pressure from the left brought it home. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #94

That's a joke. DanTex Apr 2017 #102

It must get tiring moving those goalposts. nt Gore1FL Apr 2017 #129

Dan, you've been here since 2002? Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #145

Yup, on and off. Almost my entire adult life. DanTex Apr 2017 #155

I think you've created a "far left" straw creature for your own purposes, here. Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #160

No. Unfortunately, the far left and the Green Party are very real. DanTex Apr 2017 #168

Well, good luck. Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #171

Well... sheshe2 Apr 2017 #276

The GOP seems to do wonders with less than 60. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #370

Never read my post. sheshe2 Apr 2017 #372

I read your post. It had to do with having a filibuster proof majority. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #373

No ya didn't... sheshe2 Apr 2017 #374

I never said anything about filibuster-proof. Filibuster-proof has NOTHING to do with my point. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #375

Well... sheshe2 Apr 2017 #377

Facts that are topical aren't a problem. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #378

Absolutely right. zentrum Apr 2017 #369

Oh bullshit. progressoid Apr 2017 #122

10 years ago the "sensible" people were all against gay marriage. Warren DeMontague Apr 2017 #136

The middle of the road brought about gay marriage equality? Exilednight Apr 2017 #226

It was Supreme Court justices nominated by Democrats, not the Green Party. DanTex Apr 2017 #232

There's a lot that is factually wrong with your statement. Exilednight Apr 2017 #237

Factually, it was the Supreme Court that established gay marriage. DanTex Apr 2017 #238

Show me hard facts, not just simplistic math, but actual proof that Nader voters Exilednight Apr 2017 #239

Math isn't "simplistic" just because you don't like what it implies. It's math. DanTex Apr 2017 #240

That's conjecture, not proof. Exilednight Apr 2017 #246

No, it's not a mathematical proof. Such things don't exist outside of mathematics. DanTex Apr 2017 #249

I disagree with your sanity argument. No sane person would have voted Exilednight Apr 2017 #253

I knew sane people who voted for Nader. Young and naive. DanTex Apr 2017 #257

Sanity is a subjective term. Exilednight Apr 2017 #258

Don't forget the hundreds if not thousands Chevy Apr 2017 #376

The far left didn't free the slaves Progressive dog Apr 2017 #198

The political spectrum has existed for a long time. The far left is not a new phenomena. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #225

Nothing remotely "left" at all about people who would vote or not vote Eliot Rosewater Apr 2017 #228

The "far left" is defined by the political spectrum of the day. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #255

I dont have a clue what that response means. Eliot Rosewater Apr 2017 #283

We were talking abut slavery in this sub-thread. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #300

The founding fathers and Abraham Lincoln were not far left Progressive dog Apr 2017 #235

LOL yeah... American abolitionists and American Revolutionaries are middle of the road types... Gore1FL Apr 2017 #254

you missed the part where I was talking about the far left Progressive dog Apr 2017 #270

FFS.... They were classical liberals. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #299

For FS they weren't far left Progressive dog Apr 2017 #327

Ah yes, history will always remember Franklin, Jefferson, and Madison as "middle of the road." Gore1FL Apr 2017 #334

Actually, Franklin spent years trying to Progressive dog Apr 2017 #346

They were Classical Liberals. I provided links. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #347

Again "classical liberal" is not the same as far left Progressive dog Apr 2017 #364

I am saying they were far left for their era, which is how one should gauge it. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #365

They were not far left for any era Progressive dog Apr 2017 #383

LOL! We aren't talking about seating arrangements in the French National assembly in 1789. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #384

Again you are pretending that liberal and far left are synonyms Progressive dog Apr 2017 #385

I am taking this in the context of what is being discussed in this thread. I ask a third time: Gore1FL Apr 2017 #386

It would be nice if the far left, for once, did some introspection. Progressive dog Apr 2017 #388

*Far Left* is a relative term Gore1FL Apr 2017 #389

There is no point repeating arguments Progressive dog Apr 2017 #390

You aren't making arguments, you are avoiding answering two pretty simple questions. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #391

Yes, you would think that those were simple questions Progressive dog Apr 2017 #392

Europe wasn't in the United States in the 1850s. It still isn't. I never mentioned Lincoln. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #393

So you go from far left to progressive and from Progressive dog Apr 2017 #394

My assertion has never changed. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #395

You've meant the same thing, but Progressive dog Apr 2017 #396

I accept your concession. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #397

I concede nothing Progressive dog Apr 2017 #398

Your failure to come up with an answer was a concession Gore1FL Apr 2017 #399

No it wasn't but I'm not surprised that you would make that claim Progressive dog Apr 2017 #400

Resorting to name-calling isn't the same as providing answers Gore1FL Apr 2017 #403

I'm glad that you realize that Progressive dog Apr 2017 #406

If you don't want to have a discussion, then don't waste my time. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #407

I'm not forcing you to reply and I don't work for you Progressive dog Apr 2017 #408

I am not defending the far right. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #416

You have your own definition of far right Progressive dog Apr 2017 #419

You have your own definitions for everything. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #420

Do you really think that when someone Progressive dog Apr 2017 #421

Please refrain from further wasting my time Gore1FL Apr 2017 #422

No, actually I just think that it's humorous when Progressive dog Apr 2017 #424

Please refrain from wasting my time nt Gore1FL Apr 2017 #425

This! mcar Apr 2017 #74

I thought we were done debating who contributed what to the past election.. LakeArenal Apr 2017 #76

There are many people here more interested in pointing fingers than fixing problems. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #80

Bullshit. Some of us know the 3rd party progressive nonsense is going to REPEAT Eliot Rosewater Apr 2017 #348

Stopping it by helping us lose future elections, too! Bravo! nt Gore1FL Apr 2017 #349

I know who is doing this and why, so dont waste your time with me. Eliot Rosewater Apr 2017 #361

I would hope you'd know who and why. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #362

Divisive post tiredtoo Apr 2017 #78

Actually, what the far right wants to see is Jill Stein's 2016 campaign. DanTex Apr 2017 #82

What has the middle of the road accomplished? Gore1FL Apr 2017 #88

More and more Republican control of our country. EOM tiredtoo Apr 2017 #95

THIS StubbornThings Apr 2017 #220

Seems a bit odd to say this jimlup Apr 2017 #81

It would be nice if we could join forces to defeat the Republicans. (n/t) klook Apr 2017 #85

+1 Gore1FL Apr 2017 #91

Lots of divisive comments to what in my NoMoreRepugs Apr 2017 #93

I consider myself far left. nevergiveup Apr 2017 #96

+1 Gore1FL Apr 2017 #100

You keep asking in your thread "What has the "far left" accomplished?" Saviolo Apr 2017 #101

My definition, basically, is the Green Party/CounterPunch/CommonDreams/etc. nt DanTex Apr 2017 #107

I didn't realize the Green Party Saviolo Apr 2017 #114

Good for Ralph on the seatbelts. But the damage he did in 2000 was hundreds of times worse. DanTex Apr 2017 #115

He shouldn't have run in 2000, true Saviolo Apr 2017 #123

Oh come on! You can hit that horse harder than that. Put a little shoulder into it. ornotna Apr 2017 #104

Hillary was required to be perfect, unlike all the Dem nominees Justice Apr 2017 #108

The far left more consistently votes for the Democrats, so I don't get it. Buckeye_Democrat Apr 2017 #113

The most popular politician in the country askyagerz Apr 2017 #117

In his state with his constituents.. Not in my state.. we like our own Senators Cha Apr 2017 #135

National Fox poll. That says a lot right there askyagerz Apr 2017 #138

I didn't see the poll.. nor any of my Cha Apr 2017 #141

It's called opinions askyagerz Apr 2017 #142

So true... starts at the top. InAbLuEsTaTe Apr 2017 #152

Hmm. Obama did tell us not to let perfect be the enemy of the good. PatrickforO Apr 2017 #118

I consider myself pretty left askyagerz Apr 2017 #139

Good point. I believe the onus is on us as a party to have a great PatrickforO Apr 2017 #312

Exactly askyagerz Apr 2017 #320

Bullshit! I sure don't talk to many people were delighted at the loss of the 2016 election. Akamai Apr 2017 #119

I Am About As Far Left As One Can Be colsohlibgal Apr 2017 #127

Yeah, it disappointed me too. Buckeye_Democrat Apr 2017 #128

Well said ProfessorPlum Apr 2017 #175

3rd party Elitist Assholes like stein and sarandon are Cha Apr 2017 #134

Truth JustAnotherGen Apr 2017 #144

Stein and Sarandon are two sad people who are proud of their efforts to elect trump Gothmog Apr 2017 #401

K&R ismnotwasm Apr 2017 #146

This stinks like right wing ideological drivel. The Big Ragu Apr 2017 #148

The far left in the country doesn't have the same money at its disposal. The far left, those of it JCanete Apr 2017 #149

If we were smart we would lean left rather than right. Trying to be GOP lite is why we lose. Vinca Apr 2017 #150

For many of those you are talking about it is personality based. NCTraveler Apr 2017 #153

The "far left" thing FDRsGhost Apr 2017 #158

I agree about expanding the party. DanTex Apr 2017 #164

Manchin however is a sitting senator FDRsGhost Apr 2017 #172

Sure, I think Manchin should have opposed Sessions and Gorsuch. DanTex Apr 2017 #179

Last November? Nothing. Now? Everything. FDRsGhost Apr 2017 #182

The people to blame for the "both parties are the same" narrative are the idiots pushing it. DanTex Apr 2017 #186

They are blinded by vanity... NurseJackie Apr 2017 #193

What far left? There's barely a left at all in the U.S. (nt) bekkilyn Apr 2017 #167

That's something else that US leftists should think about. DanTex Apr 2017 #190

I think you're giving these people way too much power bekkilyn Apr 2017 #204

Not all my focus and vitriol, just some of it. DanTex Apr 2017 #206

You're still giving them too much power bekkilyn Apr 2017 #213

There's no denying that they threw the 2000 election to W. That's an obvious fact. DanTex Apr 2017 #230

I view them as more of a symptom that a lot of people are dissatisfied with Dems bekkilyn Apr 2017 #234

Do they not have any responsibility for their actions? DanTex Apr 2017 #236

The Greens aren't asking what they can do differently bekkilyn Apr 2017 #244

Well I think they should be. Because I think that they could be a force for good instead of a force DanTex Apr 2017 #248

Okay, but then you need to give them reasons to be allies bekkilyn Apr 2017 #266

As if Trump is not enough of a reason? An outright racist? Really? And W before him? DanTex Apr 2017 #269

It's not enough of a reason bekkilyn Apr 2017 #273

You are treating the far left as if they had no free will or responsibility. DanTex Apr 2017 #274

Maybe we don't need to accommodate them if they are pro-GOP bekkilyn Apr 2017 #278

I agree. We don't have to accommodate them. DanTex Apr 2017 #279

There are a few "irredeemables" on both sides bekkilyn Apr 2017 #282

Why can't we be friends? DemocratSinceBirth Apr 2017 #176

+1 Gore1FL Apr 2017 #301

I see no point in a op like this one. Why rehash the past? Time to move forward. Demsrule86 Apr 2017 #183

thanks for trying. nt JCanete Apr 2017 #359

Couldn't disagree more. The Democrats have ONLY been successful when embracing liberalism. Zen Democrat Apr 2017 #184

Bill Clinton was successful, and he didn't embrace liberalism. DanTex Apr 2017 #191

Bill Clinton was popular, a great public speaker, and yet what did he accomplish for Dems? Zen Democrat May 2017 #427

I agree this has been a problem since McGovern....so I'm going back to the 70s. Sancho Apr 2017 #188

the far left got george w bush and donald trump both elected... beachbum bob Apr 2017 #195

I think it's time to stop calling the Nader/Stein voters left WomenRising2017 Apr 2017 #197

More importantly, we should all be more focused on actual outcomes, MineralMan Apr 2017 #199

We spent most of the primaries being told we werent allowed a choice. Kentonio Apr 2017 #323

To which "we" do you refer? MineralMan Apr 2017 #336

Oh come on Kentonio Apr 2017 #338

You know, I've always assumed that every member of DU is MineralMan Apr 2017 #339

It's not about what someone on DU said Kentonio Apr 2017 #342

I see. Please pardon my error. MineralMan Apr 2017 #343

No apology required. Kentonio Apr 2017 #345

Great post Gothmog Apr 2017 #200

if you mean fall in line behind whatever gop lite the party is offering? nope dembotoz Apr 2017 #201

K&R NCTraveler Apr 2017 #202

K&R betsuni Apr 2017 #203

Ok, Dan. Just WHO is the "far left"? Who are you sourcing? Eyeball_Kid Apr 2017 #205

The Green Party and it's supporters, and many lefty media outlets. DanTex Apr 2017 #208

I miss unrec. CrispyQ Apr 2017 #207

The point is that before telling the Dems what to do, the left should look in the mirror. DanTex Apr 2017 #209

Rethink their strategy? Are you frikkin kidding me? Kentonio Apr 2017 #324

Yes, rethink it. Is their current strategy accomplishing anything? DanTex Apr 2017 #351

How about you rethink your damn strategy Kentonio Apr 2017 #355

Well, the Dems held the White House for eight years and enacted many historic reforms. DanTex Apr 2017 #356

Obama ran as a progressive for christs sake Kentonio Apr 2017 #357

And governed as one too. DanTex Apr 2017 #358

We just ran on the most progressive platform ever. WomenRising2017 Apr 2017 #210

Most on DU who identify with the far left got in line behind HRC. CrispyQ Apr 2017 #211

The post is addressing people who are pleased WomenRising2017 Apr 2017 #214

Maybe instead of saying "far left" the OP should have just specified "Green" or "Nader/Stein" bekkilyn Apr 2017 #218

I'm left and I wasn't offended at all WomenRising2017 Apr 2017 #222

Agreed, but why keep giving power and attention to her? bekkilyn Apr 2017 #224

They keep doing it because it is easier to point fingers than to solve the underlying problems. nt Gore1FL Apr 2017 #227

They didn't vote for Trump, so how are they responsible for him? PotatoChip Apr 2017 #223

"Far Left"? Act_of_Reparation Apr 2017 #217

Post removed Post removed Apr 2017 #219

Are Democrats no longer "far left"? Damn, how things have changed. StubbornThings Apr 2017 #221

Ah yes, us horrible monsters on the 'far left' and our crazy ideas. Kentonio Apr 2017 #229

It's not fair to imply that people on the left are gleeful that Trump is in. Ken Burch Apr 2017 #241

True. For example, I am on the left, and I am not the least bit gleeful. DanTex Apr 2017 #243

And we don't have many "far left" types on THIS board, so why are you calling them out here? Ken Burch Apr 2017 #245

We don't have many Republicans on this board, but people call out the GOP here all the time. DanTex Apr 2017 #256

The right will never be in our political coalition. Gore1FL Apr 2017 #303

We can only control what we do bekkilyn Apr 2017 #247

Sure, of course. DanTex Apr 2017 #251

I would argue that more introspection is needed all around bekkilyn Apr 2017 #267

The GOP controls the White House, Congress, SCOTUS & 33 state legislatures. CrispyQ Apr 2017 #250

True, 2016 didn't go as well for Dems as 2008 or 1992 did. DanTex Apr 2017 #252

Obama's 2008 campaign was far more progressive. PotatoChip Apr 2017 #259

Actually, no, it wasn't. Obama had more charisma, but in terms of issues, 2016 was more progressive DanTex Apr 2017 #260

We had a reasonably progressive platform, but it was rarely talked about. PotatoChip Apr 2017 #262

Yes, it was talked about all the time. In all the debates, in rallies, etc. DanTex Apr 2017 #263

Of course the "far left" ignored it. The Greens had their own platform to run on. (nt) PotatoChip Apr 2017 #265

The platform wasn't the problem bekkilyn Apr 2017 #271

Yeah, I agree, she could have done many things better, including more resources in those states. DanTex Apr 2017 #272

Overall, I think she would have done a good job bekkilyn Apr 2017 #275

Crushed tiptonic Apr 2017 #298

You always need a far left zentrum Apr 2017 #304

Chris Hedges is a perfect example of the stupidity and impotence of the far left. DanTex Apr 2017 #335

"The Stupidity of the Left". Wow. zentrum Apr 2017 #366

Yes. The far left in this country is quite stupid. DanTex Apr 2017 #381

If only as a scapegoat when centrism fails. n/t Orsino Apr 2017 #387

I'm watching the Ken Burns documentary of the Roosevelts. athena Apr 2017 #305

Some that crossed my timeline recently: Saviolo Apr 2017 #352

The mantra of the non-empathetic left is to crush the Democrats. joshcryer Apr 2017 #307

Yes. For all the noise here, they are a minority who Hortensis Apr 2017 #360

This message was self-deleted by its author thucythucy Apr 2017 #308

This thread should be locked Mosby Apr 2017 #350

I am really enjoying this thread Gothmog Apr 2017 #353

Me too. DanTex Apr 2017 #354

you got some creative spin offs, well done. JHan Apr 2017 #380

Politics is broken Worktodo Apr 2017 #382

Another useless bash democrats thread. gtar100 Apr 2017 #402

we're in the midst of life-altering fascism bigtree Apr 2017 #409

Yes. That's what makes it so egregious that the far left helped bring this about. DanTex Apr 2017 #410

those folks are individuals with their own agendas bigtree Apr 2017 #411

They, and others like them, are the far left. DanTex Apr 2017 #412

I don't think you've provided any evidence of that, outside of pointing to a handful of individuals bigtree Apr 2017 #413

That's the sense in which I'm using the term "far left". DanTex Apr 2017 #414

then address those individuals and their individual agendas, statements, actions bigtree Apr 2017 #415

Actually, yes, the individuals I am pointing to are organized. DanTex Apr 2017 #417

you overstate their individual influence bigtree Apr 2017 #418

But not their collective influence. DanTex Apr 2017 #426

Jettison them, move a little to the right and pick up the win in the center. Foamfollower Apr 2017 #423