General Discussion

Lee-Lee

(6,324 posts)

122. And there is a real problem and one you can really fix

Thu Jun 15, 2017, 10:23 AM

Jun 2017

Stop tolerating prosecutors who drop charges and don't pursue the strongest convictions for people who commit violent crimes and who have demonstrated a propensity for violence.

The police did the right thing and arrested him. Then the prosecutors and the courts let him go with no record.

Had the prosecutors and the courts done their jobs he would have been convicted and would have then been barred by federal law from purchasing or possessing firearms.

The laws didn't fail here. We didn't lack for laws to prevent this. The laws are in place that, had people done their jobs, would have prevented him from owning firearms and at least made getting them
much more difficult.

The system failed here because people didn't do their jobs.

You don't need more laws to fix that. You need different people in those jobs who will do what they are supposed to.

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If the left had its way, this shooting would never have happened. [View all] athena Jun 2017 OP

Good point. Thanks for that. n/t reflection Jun 2017 #1

Just so. dchill Jun 2017 #2

Why do you think that? hack89 Jun 2017 #3

What law do you think would have prevented this? Lee-Lee Jun 2017 #4

Oh, howsabout the laws letting gun nuts carry them across state lines and openly Hoyt Jun 2017 #105

Which stricter requirements would we have wanted to stop him from getting a gun? jmg257 Jun 2017 #5

You cannot, if you are being honest, claim that stricter gun laws athena Jun 2017 #11

I didn't make that argument. So again, which stricter gun laws DO we want that will prevent it? jmg257 Jun 2017 #15

You seem to have missed my point. athena Jun 2017 #21

I am NOT demanding proof at all - I am asking for laws that would prevent the shooting, as jmg257 Jun 2017 #25

As it turns out, this specific crime could easily have been prevented athena Jun 2017 #88

What kind of "mental health problems" should disqualify an individual? What level of "criminal Marengo Jun 2017 #41

Depression. Bipolar disorder. Schizophrenia. Sociopathy. Narcissism. athena Jun 2017 #48

How should we identify these people and Lonusca Jun 2017 #56

A quick exam by a psychologist should be required to own a gun. athena Jun 2017 #68

How are you going to implement that, logistically Lee-Lee Jun 2017 #75

I sought treatment for depression many years ago and am a competitive target shooter... Marengo Jun 2017 #57

I'm sure a therapist could clear you to own a gun with a quick exam. athena Jun 2017 #67

Who appointed you the spokesperson for these millions of people? Marengo Jun 2017 #79

Interesting you accuse others of projection Lee-Lee Jun 2017 #80

A "regular of the gun forum" can't legitimately criticize your points? Marengo Jun 2017 #86

What degree of depression are we talking about? Doreen Jun 2017 #64

As someone who as been depressed, athena Jun 2017 #66

I fully understand depression as I feel it most of the time ( even when happy. ) Doreen Jun 2017 #81

A mental health professional can determine that. athena Jun 2017 #87

The shooter came from one of the only states to issue "gun licenses" Lee-Lee Jun 2017 #89

A mental health evaluation is not among the criteria athena Jun 2017 #91

I already posted explaining the logistics of that Lee-Lee Jun 2017 #93

And there you go again, projecting your experience as universally applicable. I know a person... Marengo Jun 2017 #84

The desire to own a gun for anything other than practical purposes would be a start. hunter Jun 2017 #104

How do you cope with the fact that you will never be able to legally inflict "wookie" style... Marengo Jun 2017 #137

Oh please... hunter Jun 2017 #138

They are reasonable. atreides1 Jun 2017 #128

You will never be able to prove athena Jun 2017 #129

domestic violence, for starters. niyad Jun 2017 #14

Good start, and already law in many places. jmg257 Jun 2017 #17

As long as it is not a federal law, it's useless. athena Jun 2017 #22

I demanded no proof at all, and actually agreed with the suggestion. Huh - not sure jmg257 Jun 2017 #23

OK, I misunderstood your post. athena Jun 2017 #83

No worries - I see you were quite busy in this thread! Cheers! jmg257 Jun 2017 #85

It is a federal law already Lee-Lee Jun 2017 #38

Have you looked at a form 4473 lately? Marengo Jun 2017 #44

Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2017 #6

If you're going to blame all liberals for the actions of a single self-identified liberal, athena Jun 2017 #10

Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2017 #61

He has a history of domestic violence, so maybe that marylandblue Jun 2017 #7

Agreed gopiscrap Jun 2017 #8

Agreed, that guy should not have been able to purchase a military grade weapon like that. Initech Jun 2017 #9

We just need a law sarisataka Jun 2017 #12

Because it's possible to shoot someone without a gun? athena Jun 2017 #13

So will your claim is if the left had its way sarisataka Jun 2017 #18

See my point earlier in the thread about demanding proof for hypothetical arguments. athena Jun 2017 #24

Your point would be valid if it was a hypothetical argument sarisataka Jun 2017 #28

I did not make such a claim. athena Jun 2017 #96

You started this whole discussion with a hypothetical yourself. WillowTree Jun 2017 #92

There is nothing wrong with making an argument based on a hypothetical. athena Jun 2017 #97

It's constitutionally protected loyalsister Jun 2017 #130

Men with a history of spousal abuse should have their guns confiscated. I know it won't happen in bettyellen Jun 2017 #16

+1 flibbitygiblets Jun 2017 #26

53% of women killed by guns are killed by an intimate partner or family member. athena Jun 2017 #30

Yes. And we can't ignore that standing up for gun control hurt HRC but is truly bettyellen Jun 2017 #34

Good point. HRC never gets credit for that. athena Jun 2017 #39

"Hurt" is an understatement Lonusca Jun 2017 #49

Easily- more than her stand with women's reproductive rights... bettyellen Jun 2017 #51

So in retrospect it doesn't look like Lonusca Jun 2017 #53

Becasue the NRA should be steamrolling the government with big money? bettyellen Jun 2017 #58

Interesting change of attitude Lonusca Jun 2017 #62

I'm proud that she stood up for sensible gun control as well as reproductive rights.... aren't you? bettyellen Jun 2017 #73

That's what I was going to say, thank you. Yes standing up for gun control hurt her. I think lunamagica Jun 2017 #55

They do ban ownership if convicted- but conviction is the key Lee-Lee Jun 2017 #35

I thought it was a state thing? It sucks if repeated violent episodes get bettyellen Jun 2017 #36

Some states but also Federal Lee-Lee Jun 2017 #40

Oh yes- I think that I've also read enforcement is non existent as far bettyellen Jun 2017 #45

That's up to individual areas and departments Lee-Lee Jun 2017 #54

Wow- interesting. Thank you! bettyellen Jun 2017 #59

One thing we know, at least Congressmen aren't worried as hell about their health care. Pinkflamingo Jun 2017 #19

We really can't have this arguement until we find out how he got the gun. Mr.Bill Jun 2017 #20

Yes we can. athena Jun 2017 #27

If you want to talk in broad hypothetical terms, sure. Mr.Bill Jun 2017 #31

You should read this article about the shooter. athena Jun 2017 #74

Thanks for the link. n/t Mr.Bill Jun 2017 #78

What law would you say would have stopped it? Lee-Lee Jun 2017 #82

"One map shows why Americas gun violence is so much worse than anywhere else" EX500rider Jun 2017 #90

The U.S. is 14th in the world in murder rates. athena Jun 2017 #100

No, not even close, US is 94th EX500rider Jun 2017 #106

I see the issue, you need to pick rate per 100,000 in the drop down box EX500rider Jun 2017 #107

Seems to me if any gun nut can walk around with a rifle/pistol in public, that makes it easy. EOM Hoyt Jun 2017 #32

I agree, Mr.Bill Jun 2017 #43

Exactly. Thanks for pointing it out. Hoyt Jun 2017 #29

Historians will look at this time in our country with a curiosity, all future Eliot Rosewater Jun 2017 #33

Sometimes it is a Muslim in a mass shooting in America? Zero compared to Christians! Fred Sanders Jun 2017 #37

At the rate of more than one mass shooting per day, athena Jun 2017 #42

Bigger problam is hatred. Lonestarblue Jun 2017 #46

Excellent point. athena Jun 2017 #50

Gunners have been fueling hatred too. Starting with the NRA leadership, to gun owners who frequent Hoyt Jun 2017 #71

Very good point. blueseas Jun 2017 #47

I agree, as someone who should not be allowed to own a gun myself. athena Jun 2017 #52

Is anyone attempting to force you to own a firearm? Marengo Jun 2017 #60

Correct...The last bit of sanity on the R's side was lost whathehell Jun 2017 #63

Of course it could. nycbos Jun 2017 #65

This person had a history of domestic violence. athena Jun 2017 #69

Wasn't aware. nycbos Jun 2017 #70

Apparently, he had a history of other gun-related offenses, too. athena Jun 2017 #72

K & R democrank Jun 2017 #76

Thank you! (n/t) athena Jun 2017 #77

Yes, stricter gun laws would have prevented this. Namely, the banning of ALL guns, period! Fluke a Snooker Jun 2017 #94

How would that be legal with the 2nd amendment in place? Marengo Jun 2017 #95

Sometimes just gotta say gunners' "freedom" stops where the majority of non-gun owners' starts. nt Hoyt Jun 2017 #111

That didn't answer my question. How is a complete ban on the civilian possession of firearms Marengo Jun 2017 #124

Don't think I have endorsed complete ban, although I wouldn't protest a proposal. Hoyt Jun 2017 #125

No one is arguing in favor of banning all guns. athena Jun 2017 #98

We don't need hunting. Government relocation policies take care of that Fluke a Snooker Jun 2017 #112

What is a "government relocation" policy? Marengo Jun 2017 #123

Relocation of animals to regulate their growth Fluke a Snooker Jun 2017 #134

LOL! Right click, Save As... Marengo Jun 2017 #136

Yes, Hillary has been for Sensible Gun Laws Cha Jun 2017 #99

Thank you, Cha! athena Jun 2017 #101

The russians, stein, Voter Suppression, etc made us Cha Jun 2017 #102

Which proposed law would have prevented today's events? linuxman Jun 2017 #103

One law is that just about any fool can carry a rifle or pistol openly in Virginia. Seems to me Hoyt Jun 2017 #110

So he was willing to murder, but would have been discouraged by open carry. linuxman Jun 2017 #113

You are not listening. With no toting allowed, a fool carrying a gun would be a criminal. Hoyt Jun 2017 #114

Oh, I'll enjoy every freedom, thank you. linuxman Jun 2017 #115

A little old lady took Loughner down. Hoyt Jun 2017 #118

I wouldn't know. linuxman Jun 2017 #120

Sounds like the junk you hear from the 3%ers. Hoyt Jun 2017 #127

Go to bed, hoyt. linuxman Jun 2017 #131

You are sounding just like a typical gun fancier. Your gunz are more important Hoyt Jun 2017 #133

There's more of that nonsense talk. linuxman Jun 2017 #135

He carried the gun for about 40-50 feet. Lee-Lee Jun 2017 #121

He could have walked miles with it under Virginia law. Hoyt Jun 2017 #126

All these killers are people with guns. Let that sink in. L. Coyote Jun 2017 #108

Deep. linuxman Jun 2017 #132

Some of the left have supported the NRA Progressive dog Jun 2017 #109

Conservatives have attacked liberals for being anti-gun for decades. athena Jun 2017 #116

I don't care what "they" argue, Progressive dog Jun 2017 #119

Shooter had a history of violence though charges got dismissed: Liberty Belle Jun 2017 #117

And there is a real problem and one you can really fix Lee-Lee Jun 2017 #122