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Daveparts3

(49 posts)
Mon Jul 9, 2012, 06:27 PM Jul 2012

Now, You See My Fists? [View all]

Now, You See My Fists?
By David Glenn Cox


It was just a simple police stop, I was walking back home from the store, penny food under my arm, when I saw him. A police cruiser parked crookedly on the side road, red and blue lights flashed wildly. Two black uniformed police officers held a wallet and stood over a subject sitting in the grass. He laid one arm across a raised knee his other propping him up. The man in the grass appeared casual, more relaxed about the situation than the police officers. Or maybe he was just tired; maybe he was just another soldier of the road, another veteran of our harsh times.

It brought back memories of an E-mail with a link to a video sent to me. In it, a young man was stopped by police in Fullerton California; he is lucid, conversational and was in no ways threatening or potentially violent. I watched this first video lasting only eight or nine minutes, but after watching it I went searching for a longer version. I wanted to understand how this could happen, the complete video was shocking and not for the faint of heart, a confrontation leading to a young man being tazered half a dozen times and beaten to a bloody pulp is over thirty minutes long.

As the video opens, a cop waves his baton assertively, like a peacock preening or a wild bull rutting in the ground. It is a full fifteen minutes after police begin their interrogation of this young man before things start going terribly wrong. The young man is obviously becoming tired of the police interrogation tactics. Questions asked with a snarl full of condescension, asked with intent to aggravate trying to get a rise out of the citizen.

“Seems like every day we gotta talk to you about something,” - Officer Manuel Ramos

“Two days in a row,”- Corporal Jay Cicinelli

As Ramos interrogates, Cicinelli calls out potential charges they could use to run this young man in on.

“So, I’m thinking of a 496?” - Corporal Jay Cicinelli

Ostensibly, police were investigating auto burglaries; it is unclear whether these burglaries took place that night, that week or last month. In any case, a quick inspection of this young man finds him not in possession of any property you might expect to be found on someone involved in auto burglaries.

“Hey, what is your name? Hey, what is your name? - Officer Manuel Ramos

“I think its Kelly or something,”- Corporal Jay Cicinelli

“Gonna take you to jail on suspicion of burglary”- Officer Manuel Ramos


There were no outstanding wants or warrants to hold this young man. His name was Kelly Thomas, the reason he didn’t give his name was because the cops already knew his name. This wasn’t a bust or an investigation it was just a roust, let’s go fuck with the homeless guy. So after fifteen minutes of abusive interrogation, after quarter hour of being detained and threatened with arrest treated with contempt and scorn. He is treated as untermunchin, because of his appearance and because of his poverty.

“Sit down, sit down, sit down!”- Officer Manuel Ramos

“Put your feet out in front of you get your hands out from behind you.

Put your feet out in front of you get your hands out from behind you.

Put your feet out in front of you get your hands out from behind you!

Put your feet out in front of you get your hands out from behind you!

Put your feet out in front of you.” - Officer Manuel Ramos

“Which one is it dude?” – Kelly Thomas

“Both!” - Officer Manuel Ramos

“So, should we take you for having someone else’s mail? - Corporal Jay Cicinelli

“Put your hands on your knees; put your feet out in front of you.” - Officer Manuel Ramos

“I can’t do both!”- Kelly Thomas

“Your gonna have to, real quick!”- Officer Manuel Ramos

“What’s wrong with you?” – Kelly Thomas

“Put your hands on your fucking knees” - Officer Manuel Ramos

“Now, you see my fists, they’re getting ready to fuck you up.” - Officer Manuel Ramos

“Start punching dude,” – Kelly Thomas

Hey, I’m sick of playing games, which is it?” – Kelly Thomas

“I’m tired of fucking around with you, get on the ground!” - Officer Manuel Ramos

“Get on the ground, on the ground!” - Corporal Jay Cicinelli

Then for the crime of talking back, of not tipping your hat, cringing properly or saying yes sir, this young man is beaten to death by police on the streets Fullerton California. Tazered repeatedly, tazered until their guns run out of juice. This black uniformed gang after empting all the high voltage from their tazer guns into the body of a defenseless young man then use the butt of their empty tazer guns to pistol whip this young man’s face beyond a mother’s recognition, all for the crime of talking back with attitude.

“Okay, I’m sorry dude,” - Kelly Thomas

“I’m sorry! I’m sorry! I’m sorry.”- Kelly Thomas

“Put your hands behind your back!” - Officer Manuel Ramos

By this time the two officers have struck Thomas countless times with their nightsticks tackling him to the ground. They demand he put his hands behind his back but by now Thomas is simply too terrified to comply. As these two officers with weapons are still beating him they demand he give up all defense of his own body from their assault. It is better known on the street as, resisting assault, protecting yourself from the blows while the police beat you with their clubs.

“Okay, hang on a second” - Kelly Thomas

“Okay, I can’t breath dude” - Kelly Thomas

“Please, I can’t breathe!”- Kelly Thomas

Meanwhile, Corporal Jay Cicinelli is on top of Thomas kneeing him in the side while Ramos has him in a choke hold demanding he put his hands behind his back.

“Help, help, I can’t breathe!” – Kelly Thomas

“Lay on your fucking stomach” - Corporal Jay Cicinelli

“Relax dude,”- Officer Manuel Ramos

“I can’t,” - Kelly Thomas

“Relax,”- Officer Manuel Ramos

“Okay please, I can’t fucking breathe!”- Kelly Thomas

Officers then tazer Thomas, two more times as more officers arrive. Before the night is over six Fullerton officers will participate in the beating death of Kelly Thomas. Tazered two more times as Thomas answers, “Okay, okay, please sir.” The police response to his plea is to hold the trigger while applying the tazer to Thomas once more. Clearly he is frantic and in fear for his life, a wounded captured animal instinctively seeking escape.

“No, no, oh no!” – Kelly Thomas

Unidentified policeman to two new arriving policemen, “help us!”

Five policemen are now on top of Kelly Thomas; they have choked him, tackled him and beat him, all while repeatedly applying high voltage to him. As an officer says, “He must be on something.” This is the first justification, a young man minding his own business is somehow responsible for his own beating death. He must be on something he says as five two hundred pound policemen are on top Kelly Thomas suffocating the life out of him.

Thomas cries out, “Dad, Dad! Daddy, Oh Dad, dad help me! Oh dad, dad, dad my legs are broken. Dad, help me, dad, dad, dad help me dad.”

“There’s fucking blood everywhere” - unknown Fullerton Police officer.

“I can’t breath, oh help me dad, help me,”- Kelly Thomas

“Dad they’re killing me, dad” - Kelly Thomas

Thomas is losing strength now as the tone and intensity of his voice begins diminishing while still crying, “daddy, daddy, daddy.” By the reflection of the police lights you can see a pool of body fluids puddling around Kelly Thomas on the sidewalk. His last words were “Help me, help me, help me.”

“You did pretty good,” Corporal Jay Cicinelli to Officer Ramos

“Hey, what is your name? Hey, what is your name?” unidentified police officer addressing the limp, unconscious and bleeding body of Kelly Thomas.

“Well, his chest is still going up and down,” – unidentified Fullerton Police officer

“I got out my tazer and I just sort of smashed his face to hell.” – Fullerton Policeman

After being beaten into a unconscious bloody pulp, police relent as the young man has entered into an unconsciousness from which he would never return. There was no apparent sense of urgency about getting this unconscious bleeding young man any sort of medical attention, instead he lays there unconscious on the cold pavement in a puddle of his own blood and urine

We watch film clips from the history channel, of brutal black uniformed thugs beating down innocents and making us reevaluate just what it actually means to be a human being. We think, what sort of mind could create such depravity? Yet this happened on the streets of an American city quite recently. So how is this any different, one group of lawless black shirted goons versus any other group of black shirted goons.

Ostensibly, the officers simply want to know his name. Only they already know him, he’s a homeless guy who stays close to the bus station. Crazy huh, think about time the next time you see a “No Public Restroom” sign. You have to have money in your pocket to use the restroom in this country making the Bus station possibly the only restroom for miles.

Kelly Thomas was a diagnosed schizophrenic but on the night of his murder he was the sanest man involved in the confrontation. His death is a warning to us, a clarion call, the living proof of the Stanford experiment for all to see. Proof that while history doesn’t always repeat, it does rhyme. A Brave New World class structure, it’s okay to kill Gammas because there’s so many of them. Murdered by the state, without judge or jury just because they wanted to and because they could and there was no one to stop them.

“He’s looks cyanotic now,” - Paramedic

“Yeah, he’s pretty cyanotic. – Other Paramedic

Definition:
Cyanosis is a physical sign causing bluish discoloration of the skin and mucous membranes. Cyanosis is caused by a lack of oxygen in the blood. Cyanosis is associated with cold temperatures, heart failure, lung diseases, and smothering. It is seen in infants at birth as a result of heart defects, respiratory distress syndrome, or lung and breathing problems.

“He ain’t dead, he ain’t half dead,” – unidentified Fullerton Police Officer

“Your DAR (Tazer) is on the back of the trunk, it’s got blood all over it.”- Unidentified Fullerton Police Officer

“I got out my tazer and sort of smashed his face to hell.” - Unidentified Fullerton Police Officer

Official cause of death; mechanical compression of the thorax

Kelly Thomas (April 5, 1974 – July 10, 2011)

Officer Manuel Ramos - charged with second-degree murder and involuntary manslaughter.

Corporal Jay Cicinelli - is charged with involuntary manslaughter and felony use of excessive force.

120 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Now, You See My Fists? [View all] Daveparts3 Jul 2012 OP
Jesus Christ ! russspeakeasy Jul 2012 #1
omg! babylonsister Jul 2012 #2
Damn! Is this in America? kentuck Jul 2012 #3
Dear G-d! I couldn't finish reading it and I won't watch the vid. SammyWinstonJack Jul 2012 #4
I watched every minute of it...could not stop really zeemike Jul 2012 #45
Yes, look what we have become. SammyWinstonJack Jul 2012 #52
Good god. progressoid Jul 2012 #5
Good God! Meiko Jul 2012 #6
INVOLUNTARY manslaughter? Zoeisright Jul 2012 #7
Involuntary? 2nd degree? That's bullshit... nc4bo Jul 2012 #8
Yes but they were in the process of torturing him when he died. zeemike Jul 2012 #48
Sick animals. damnedifIknow Jul 2012 #9
Seen this before - GoneOffShore Jul 2012 #10
Why would some sick individual alert on this uncomfortably ugly OP? PufPuf23 Jul 2012 #11
The alerter was of the opinion Auggie Jul 2012 #12
I get it Son of Gob Jul 2012 #17
The OP is one of the best folks one can find on the internet with a powerful lot to contribute TheKentuckian Jul 2012 #94
word n/t grasswire Jul 2012 #106
This message was self-deleted by its author JTFrog Sep 2012 #120
With only 27 posts, what else could he be, but a troll. RC Jul 2012 #14
Here is an earlier incarnation of theirs. Notice the tombstone? Electric Monk Jul 2012 #18
I do see the TS and posts at DU2. PufPuf23 Jul 2012 #21
I place a story about a horrible Injustice Daveparts3 Jul 2012 #24
Sorry, I should have included a sarcasm smilie. RC Jul 2012 #42
Not a troll, a zombie. You got banned for something before, and then registered a new account. Electric Monk Jul 2012 #46
Thanks Ghost Dog Jul 2012 #95
Not long after this damnedifIknow Jul 2012 #13
Too sad malaise Jul 2012 #15
yeah. mad dogs in uniform spreading like a plague. the Earth is overdue for another cleansing. marasinghe Jul 2012 #19
Or the other explanation. zeemike Jul 2012 #49
Somewhere a woman knits, remembering each and every injustice... Junkdrawer Jul 2012 #16
Holy fuck ornotna Jul 2012 #20
After reading that no way can I watch a person die. DiverDave Jul 2012 #22
I watched the video and it is far worse. Quantess Jul 2012 #112
yeah. me too. d_r Jul 2012 #25
kick. nt limpyhobbler Jul 2012 #23
I know I will get hate for this, but... Abra Jul 2012 #26
This is the dumbest post I've seen in a while ornotna Jul 2012 #27
You criticize me for being dumb Abra Jul 2012 #37
Uh, no ornotna Jul 2012 #41
okay :) Abra Jul 2012 #43
Of that I have no doubt Hugabear Jul 2012 #70
Doubt it quakerboy Jul 2012 #111
Didn't you represent Mark Furman? 12AngryBorneoWildmen Jul 2012 #101
He was also MENTALLY ILL. redqueen Jul 2012 #28
I watched the video Abra Jul 2012 #39
Use crisis intervention training or a CIT team to diffuse the situation TomClash Jul 2012 #56
absolutely grasswire Jul 2012 #63
Okay, good answer. I carefully reviewed the tape and have changed my opinion about this incident. Abra Jul 2012 #80
I don't see how anyone could have thought that guy was a "very dangerou suspect" patrice Jul 2012 #84
Easy answer Abra Jul 2012 #108
You are right about the blows to the head. SylviaD Jul 2012 #96
I agree. Abra Jul 2012 #109
It was not the blows to the head (although that certainly didn't help) PotatoChip Jul 2012 #116
Thank you for clarifying. SylviaD Jul 2012 #119
Certainly NOT beat him to death! 1monster Jul 2012 #75
There were no outstanding wants or warrants to hold this young man. the cops leftyohiolib Jul 2012 #30
Post removed Post removed Jul 2012 #33
Yes. Abra Jul 2012 #40
They knew him. They knew he was mentally ill and harmless. sabrina 1 Jul 2012 #72
+1 Blecht Jul 2012 #77
I Love You. 12AngryBorneoWildmen Jul 2012 #102
The 'incident' was a depraved, sick and brutal gang murder. sabrina 1 Jul 2012 #35
You are correct, I hate you for attempting to defend the indefensible. GReedDiamond Jul 2012 #38
Sorry to hear that. Abra Jul 2012 #44
I don't put anyone on ignore, so we'll see what happens... GReedDiamond Jul 2012 #47
Not quite... Abra Jul 2012 #50
I'll give you the benefit of the doubt... GReedDiamond Jul 2012 #53
Maybe. Who knows.... Abra Jul 2012 #65
1+ That's what I saw. Makes it no less horrifying & disgusting. & It's not an excuse for cruelty. patrice Jul 2012 #83
Total Delusional Fabrication. 12AngryBorneoWildmen Jul 2012 #104
Post removed Post removed Jul 2012 #68
" I know about brutality. I hate injustice. And I fucking HATE the police." -Abra, Post #50... GReedDiamond Jul 2012 #71
Post removed Post removed Jul 2012 #91
“Now, you see my fists, they’re getting ready to fuck you up.” limpyhobbler Jul 2012 #76
pigs.... mike_c Jul 2012 #90
Post removed Post removed Jul 2012 #103
The cops KNEW him well and KNEW he was mentally ill. tblue37 Jul 2012 #107
Yes, that's an embarrassingly dumb post. Quantess Jul 2012 #113
This has been a huge story here in Southern California (Fullerton is in Orange County). SunSeeker Jul 2012 #29
Kelly Thomas' dad is a retired police officer. grasswire Jul 2012 #62
Yes. But for that fact, I think Kelly Thomas would be just another statistic. SunSeeker Jul 2012 #93
I know quite a few cops. Flatulo Jul 2012 #31
Murder with depraved indifference The Wizard Jul 2012 #32
He was a kind, gentle, and friendly person. He had a loving family, parents, a sister who sabrina 1 Jul 2012 #34
This is just flat out murder. MrSlayer Jul 2012 #36
This event has been all over my local news for a while. Spitfire of ATJ Jul 2012 #51
An Empire state of mind TomClash Jul 2012 #54
welcome back, Dave grasswire Jul 2012 #55
Post removed Post removed Jul 2012 #57
I do believe he was talking about the uniforms the officers were wearing. ornotna Jul 2012 #58
black-uniformed grasswire Jul 2012 #60
That's what it should be. Exactly. A complete DevonRex Jul 2012 #114
They were not Black. Here are photos of two of the cops who have been charged in the sabrina 1 Jul 2012 #61
Black Uniformed Gang Daveparts3 Jul 2012 #74
Thank you for explaining it was the uniforms, not the officers. xfundy Jul 2012 #79
"The OP is a troll, IMO. " Fumesucker Jul 2012 #82
No, Daveparts3 Jul 2012 #86
Dave, are your previous essays available somewhere else? grasswire Jul 2012 #59
Unless there's more than one... pretty easy to find Electric Monk Jul 2012 #64
why the snark? n/t grasswire Jul 2012 #73
I'm sick to my stomach. cry baby Jul 2012 #66
I remember seeing this when it came out. I'm glad the cops were charged. joshcryer Jul 2012 #67
Thank you for posting this MannyGoldstein Jul 2012 #69
Ah, Fullerton PD. Le Taz Hot Jul 2012 #78
Have things gotten worse over the years? eridani Jul 2012 #81
What you said.... we're just now hearing about it more. DCKit Jul 2012 #85
Twain said, Daveparts3 Jul 2012 #89
It got markedly worse after 9/11 and has never stopped getting worse. yardwork Jul 2012 #88
Can we talk about police brutality and fascism yet? yardwork Jul 2012 #87
that is the courage of davparts grasswire Jul 2012 #92
It's good to see that the father has a top-notch attorney. In an earlier brutality case, AnotherMcIntosh Jul 2012 #97
I live not too far from there. The police there are so out of control it's not funny. Initech Jul 2012 #98
I believe this is the same incident. grasswire Jul 2012 #105
Compare this with the thread last week -- jerseyjack Jul 2012 #99
His complaint has merit? DiverDave Jul 2012 #117
OOPS DiverDave Jul 2012 #118
Hopefully justice will find these sick fucks. Cheap_Trick Jul 2012 #100
Time to disband this police force- secondvariety Jul 2012 #110
Kelly Thomas was outright murdered. Fantastic Anarchist Jul 2012 #115
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