General Discussion

Squinch

(60,033 posts)

146. So many things in that post!

Tue Aug 1, 2017, 10:32 AM

Aug 2017

First, do you not just LOVE Tammy?

I love Kamala, but Tammy would also make a great "favorite son" for our future.

Second, about her assertion that it needs to be done incrementally. That was a big no-no sentiment according to BS supporters during the campaign. But up thread I was having a (somewhat inane) conversation with Omaha Steve about Hillary's 1993 plan and the conversation got me thinking: can you imagine if Hillary had gotten full throated support for her plan in 93? We would definitely have universal healthcare of some form today.

And yes. I love Tammy, but I fear her statement was not well-considered. It will be brought back to beat her up by the people who want to destroy us from the inside. None of whom are our true allies.

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BS: "We will be taking on [...] the establishment wing of the Democratic party" [View all] KitSileya Aug 2017 OP

You do understand that the "establishment wing" of the Democratic Party has opposed Voltaire2 Aug 2017 #1

He wants to fight the Democratic party as we are fighting for our lives against nazis KitSileya Aug 2017 #2

This message was self-deleted by its author m-lekktor Aug 2017 #5

Oh really? Do tell. I was there at the time. yardwork Aug 2017 #6

so was I. she was not trying for single payer. m-lekktor Aug 2017 #37

That's not what your post said. It's good it was deleted. yardwork Aug 2017 #39

It was single payer. Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #23

that is vague, it does not say single payer. If I remember it was called managed health care. m-lekktor Aug 2017 #36

I am not going to parse words here...an attempt was made to put every US citizen on Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #98

Nah, it is more productive to argue within the party, thus guaranteeing continued reign by the GOP Eliot Rosewater Aug 2017 #165

People who don't understand that winning is the only thing that can save the Democratic Party and Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #201

It was called "managed competition" this 1993 NYT article discusses it m-lekktor Aug 2017 #61

You can call it what you want it was single payer...the only one that we ever had a chance at. There Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #90

No, health care in 93 was not single payer, it was never proposed as single payer. Warren DeMontague Aug 2017 #189

I would bet my bottom dollar, we will not get single payer in this country...we may eventually have Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #199

The GOP will never pass a flat tax, either. Doesn't stop them from talking about it. Warren DeMontague Aug 2017 #200

Conyers is part of the progressive caucus. Voltaire2 Aug 2017 #11

I don't give a damn...if we follow this , we lose. Learn to exist in a big tent party. It is our Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #30

I agree. Chemisse Aug 2017 #58

Strengthening the Democratic party is our only chance to fight back against the pernicious GOP Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #95

You don't get to parse the party, or murielm99 Aug 2017 #204

I don't? Sure I do. Voltaire2 Aug 2017 #208

Conyers has been introducing that bill all by himself murielm99 Aug 2017 #210

If Clinton is part of the "center right establishment" faction of the Democratic Party, lapucelle Aug 2017 #209

Voltaire has his own rating system, murielm99 Aug 2017 #211

OOPS...is John Conyers in these? Omaha Steve Aug 2017 #14

Are these photos supposed to be proof of something? Squinch Aug 2017 #21

Bernies whereabouts circa 1993-94. He was right behind Hillary Clinton as she spoke on healthcare Omaha Steve Aug 2017 #68

And what does that prove to you? What would the graphs show? Who Bernie has Squinch Aug 2017 #69

Need Glasses? Omaha Steve Aug 2017 #110

Nope. Can you answer the question: What were those photos meant to prove? Squinch Aug 2017 #111

Apparently you need glasses Omaha Steve Aug 2017 #119

Not sure what is the point of the inane harping on my vision, but no matter. BUT Squinch Aug 2017 #123

I trust Hillary on this Omaha Steve Aug 2017 #127

Yes. I saw that. It was a very gracious note. And you are saying Squinch Aug 2017 #132

Last reply to you Omaha Steve Aug 2017 #139

Well, Steve, to be fair, I'm not seeing any links or photos of value from YOU either. Squinch Aug 2017 #143

Actually, Sanders was in Vermont. That's where these pictures were taken. lapucelle Aug 2017 #206

I like the photos, thank you very much. I see no reason for sarcastic remarks. Jim Beard Aug 2017 #73

Why should John Conyers be at a rally in Vermont? lapucelle Aug 2017 #198

This message was self-deleted by its author Omaha Steve Aug 2017 #86

You mean we should fight off the fascist nazis trying to kill us and the environment BEFORE Eliot Rosewater Aug 2017 #164

Here's the thing: a lot of us bought that argument during Bush years yurbud Aug 2017 #169

At some point in the Bush years loyalsister Aug 2017 #202

Did you mean that as a criticism of Wellstone & Dean? yurbud Aug 2017 #203

Not at all loyalsister Aug 2017 #205

Post removed Post removed Aug 2017 #10

I oppose it too because you wont get it...and then we will end up a permanent minority. Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #19

Evidence? delisen Aug 2017 #20

for what? Voltaire2 Aug 2017 #207

Medicare for all is just a campaign slogan-not a policy Progressive dog Aug 2017 #122

You do understand that two Democrats in Congress lapucelle Aug 2017 #196

The establishment wing authored the single payer bill BainsBane Aug 2017 #214

Gonna need to see the rest of the email, and who it's actually from... JHB Aug 2017 #3

As I said, the email as a whole is screencapped KitSileya Aug 2017 #4

Found it, thanks. In context, I think it's an unforced error... JHB Aug 2017 #18

I received the same email from Bernie this morning. yardwork Aug 2017 #7

You got the same one? I haven't but you as a source I'm WePurrsevere Aug 2017 #167

Thanks for posting this. yardwork Aug 2017 #8

Post removed Post removed Aug 2017 #9

Ugh, he is totally going to fuck over Democrats in 2018. For that reason I hope Jane is found seaglass Aug 2017 #12

I don't know what will happen, but this will be used against Sen. Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #33

Exactly what Putin wants Bladewire Aug 2017 #13

Post removed Post removed Aug 2017 #15

I'd grieve that with the admins. That's ridiculous. Squinch Aug 2017 #17

I did lillypaddle Aug 2017 #75

I guess you didn't get the memo leftofcool Aug 2017 #22

He's not even a damn Dem lillypaddle Aug 2017 #77

+1000 R B Garr Aug 2017 #152

And yet even here at DU we are required to treat him as if he is. Eliot Rosewater Aug 2017 #166

With you 100% Expecting Rain Aug 2017 #195

Skinner disagrees. QC Aug 2017 #170

Same with me yesterday leftynyc Aug 2017 #113

Forum rules explicitly name him Bradical79 Aug 2017 #140

Apparently the admins are tired of hearing about this, QC Aug 2017 #172

Newsflash: There are disagreements on the American left. Jim Lane Aug 2017 #16

Newsflash! leftofcool Aug 2017 #26

Sad scottie10 Aug 2017 #41

No. People who are supposed to be allies saying they are going to "take on the Democratic party" Squinch Aug 2017 #51

Thank you. I see much more value in possessing real-world pragmatism... NurseJackie Aug 2017 #100

Easier to make your case when you misquote, isn't it? Jim Lane Aug 2017 #182

Exactly, and the problem with this is that he becomes R B Garr Aug 2017 #158

If we have any sense at all, it very much does mean that we need to STFU and present Squinch Aug 2017 #28

This should be a separate post...it is exactly on the money. Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #43

Oh, I've been saying it forever but it doesn't seem to get any traction. It tends to devolve Squinch Aug 2017 #48

Unless you are from Vermont, I don't undertand why you would 'follow' Bernie Sanders) Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #56

I don't see him voluntarily taking himself out of the limelight any time soon. He Squinch Aug 2017 #60

We have to hope he does not cause us to lose 2020. Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #92

This message was self-deleted by its author HopeAgain Aug 2017 #59

Well said! Divided will lead to failure! n/t RKP5637 Aug 2017 #63

So we should be like nice little storm troopers? Jim Beard Aug 2017 #82

I suppose that asinine argument was inevitable. Because monstrous hyperbole is Squinch Aug 2017 #87

I am not opposed to you holding your breath. Jim Beard Aug 2017 #94

Lol. As we watch our Republic crumbling around us, I guess this is what passes Squinch Aug 2017 #102

Your Message Is Not Consistent With Your Actions ProfessorGAC Aug 2017 #156

LOL! You guys are too much! Really! Squinch Aug 2017 #157

What Guys? ProfessorGAC Aug 2017 #215

"Howard Dean to withhold support if DCCC funds candidates opposed to abortion rights" Tom Rinaldo Aug 2017 #118

yes the Rs will unite despite trump and encourage Dem splits. I dont lunasun Aug 2017 #138

Exactly! When we get back in power then we put on the all out push for single payer brush Aug 2017 #162

Yes it does mean you unite and forget your differences and fight against a common dangerous foe Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #38

Then how about we unite behind single payer? Jim Lane Aug 2017 #217

As it sometimes happens, into the midst of the furor comes the calm voice of logic and reasoning. jamesatemple Aug 2017 #45

Once again, have you read the platform? You are calling for something that was already done, and Squinch Aug 2017 #55

"Once again", Squinch? jamesatemple Aug 2017 #114

Clinton "vehemently?" opposed Sanders views on about healthcare. delisen Aug 2017 #49

I watched an old Jack Benny TV program and there was a comment made in a skit.... Jim Beard Aug 2017 #88

"Vehemently" is of course my subjective characterization of what she said Jim Lane Aug 2017 #193

I can't believe all the anger I see directed at Bernie on DU. Bluepinky Aug 2017 #54

What progressive policies were not embraced in the 2016 platform? Squinch Aug 2017 #57

I have had to ask numerous times on this forum if people read the 2016 Dem Platform. ..so I lunasun Aug 2017 #144

Great to link to it! That platform should be pinned somewhere, because about half Squinch Aug 2017 #147

At least 5 or 6 times on this forum alone I have posted but it's not just here that lunasun Aug 2017 #149

Thank u for posting the platform. Bluepinky Aug 2017 #185

If he wishes to remain an "Independent" leftynyc Aug 2017 #116

He did a very, very, very, very bad thing QC Aug 2017 #175

He never misses a chance to malign the Democratic Party. Demit Aug 2017 #24

Me too. I liked him once and was on the fence on who to vote for early in the primary. Squinch Aug 2017 #31

I used to really like him also. Blue_true Aug 2017 #213

you have a hard time recognizing your friends ProfessorPlum Aug 2017 #126

But he was a Democrat, briefly, when it was to his advantage to be. That's the salient point. Demit Aug 2017 #161

You forgot to add that Sanders and his cultists demand absolute purity. Jim Lane Aug 2017 #194

"Establishment" Dems are further right than Eisenhower and Nixon tiredtoo Aug 2017 #25

You might want to give the Democratic Party platform a once over. Because you're wrong. Squinch Aug 2017 #35

from Rachel Maddow tiredtoo Aug 2017 #52

Again, take a gander at the Democratic platform. Squinch Aug 2017 #53

We never win with a left presidential candidate...there have always been conservadems...in a Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #42

McGovern was from a different time tiredtoo Aug 2017 #83

A more liberal time when even the GOP was quite liberal and yet he could not win. Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #84

And today we are in a more conservative time. Trump just won tiredtoo Aug 2017 #89

Dude you JUST invoked LBJ and EISENHOWER!!!! moda253 Aug 2017 #179

i used FDR and LBJ as examples of good Democrats tiredtoo Aug 2017 #190

You want to take it on? Try joining the party first. GoCubsGo Aug 2017 #27

Bernie Is Not a Democrat dlk Aug 2017 #29

Thank you for making this point! ProfessorPlum Aug 2017 #128

Skinner disagrees. QC Aug 2017 #176

Propaganda 101: Poison the well tactic kyburbonkid Aug 2017 #32

Count me in. n/t DefenseLawyer Aug 2017 #34

This isn't about bashing anyone's favorite democrat. Mr. Evil Aug 2017 #40

We are in the minority...the iron is as cold as it has ever been... Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #46

+1 We need universal coverage, not necessarily single payer. NT Adrahil Aug 2017 #99

"I represent the Democratic Wing of the Democratic Party" Warren DeMontague Aug 2017 #44

Wellstone was not an independent. Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #47

At least you admit thats what this is about. But no matter. Either the language is divisive, or not Warren DeMontague Aug 2017 #65

"So let's cut to the chase -- some people aren't going to like anything Sanders says, ever, period. betsuni Aug 2017 #70

what. pointing out the obvious is that funny? Warren DeMontague Aug 2017 #187

You are correct. I am a Democrat. If Sen. Sanders wants to be independent that is his right. But Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #85

If Sanders had said he was from ANY wing of the Democratic Party, you would have a point. Demit Aug 2017 #103

Most DUers want single payer but understand we are the minority party... brush Aug 2017 #163

I must add the 'progressive wing' (although I dispute that... as I am progressive and often don't Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #50

This is the perfect time to push for single payer, now that Trumpcare is dead Not Ruth Aug 2017 #62

Yes, it is. But it's not the time to be saying you are going to be "taking on" Democrats. Squinch Aug 2017 #79

time to primary Sanders. stonecutter357 Aug 2017 #64

You dont support a single payer, medicare for all system? Warren DeMontague Aug 2017 #67

How do you primary an independent? IronLionZion Aug 2017 #74

The guy is a prophet. DU establishment wing immediately sets up for a fight. rgbecker Aug 2017 #66

I lulzed. Squinch Aug 2017 #76

He's a prophet Squinch... a prophet lol JHan Aug 2017 #130

. Squinch Aug 2017 #134

On top of Trump and the GOP's bullshit ,.... JHan Aug 2017 #137

Trump and Bernie have a lot in common Fresh_Start Aug 2017 #153

"Never Ever" , Pie in the Sky" bahrbearian Aug 2017 #71

Go away Bernie. joeybee12 Aug 2017 #72

+1000, Conyers hasn't had to malign Democrats when R B Garr Aug 2017 #160

....Where Sanders reveals he does not understand game theory JHan Aug 2017 #78

No kidding... he reminds me of the Socialist Club back in college... Adrahil Aug 2017 #97

whatever the plan is.. JHan Aug 2017 #131

I don't think there are any Democrats who DON'T want universal healthcare. Squinch Aug 2017 #135

+++++++ Also... JHan Aug 2017 #142

So many things in that post! Squinch Aug 2017 #146

I love her to bits, but yeah .. I cringed a bit.. not because she's wrong.. JHan Aug 2017 #148

Don't you know we have to oppose getting health care for 95% KitSileya Aug 2017 #159

Reminds me of how Nixon's basic income plan was axed. JHan Aug 2017 #177

+1 NT Adrahil Aug 2017 #136

Thank you, Bernie Sanders. David__77 Aug 2017 #80

I'm not a member of any organized political party IronLionZion Aug 2017 #81

It sounds like he's comparing (or equating) Democrats to the GOP. That's offensive to me. NurseJackie Aug 2017 #91

I love you and your Notes to the Alerters, Nurse Jackie. betsuni Aug 2017 #101

I know! Right? (But I can't take credit for that note. I was quoting the OP's note...) NurseJackie Aug 2017 #106

But in the past I've enjoyed your "Notes to the Democratic Underground Alerters" series. betsuni Aug 2017 #117

Those were partly in-jest, tongue-in-cheek... and partly (mostly?) serious. NurseJackie Aug 2017 #120

+1 uponit7771 Aug 2017 #107

Umm, Bernie, the enemies are on the other side of the aisle mcar Aug 2017 #93

+1 betsuni Aug 2017 #104

Thank you! NurseJackie Aug 2017 #108

Kind of ridiculous some need the reminder mcar Aug 2017 #109

Post removed Post removed Aug 2017 #129

Yeah shenmue Aug 2017 #178

Good. alarimer Aug 2017 #96

Who? LexVegas Aug 2017 #105

I am very troubled by this. apcalc Aug 2017 #112

Well said. His actions are perfectly consistent, and always to the detriment of Democrats. Squinch Aug 2017 #125

I started thinking some time ago he's part of the big russian picture nini Aug 2017 #150

Agree apcalc Aug 2017 #197

Agreed about his taxes, and everything else. R B Garr Aug 2017 #155

You can't fight the Republican Party and Half the Democratic Party at the same time nt stevenleser Aug 2017 #115

We seem to get constantly pulled backward by the extreme left. Blue_true Aug 2017 #216

As a member of the only wing of the established Democratic party, Progressive dog Aug 2017 #121

Good for Bernie Sanders ProfessorPlum Aug 2017 #124

Go Bernie! MuseRider Aug 2017 #133

I would love to see him work with Vermont Governer and get it passed in Vermont Tavarious Jackson Aug 2017 #191

Always happy to see Bernie Sanders is still fighting for the American people. Autumn Aug 2017 #141

Is there any doubt in anyone's mind now? George II Aug 2017 #145

There sure shouldn't be. Beyond just garden variety R B Garr Aug 2017 #151

Sanders is not going to win any support with this crap Gothmog Aug 2017 #154

Much more than you might think. I stand with Bernie. aikoaiko Aug 2017 #168

And I stand with the Democratic Party Gothmog Aug 2017 #171

So do I. Standing with Bernie and the Democratic Party are not mutually exclusive. aikoaiko Aug 2017 #173

Is Sanders running as a member of the party for re-election to the Senate? Gothmog Aug 2017 #180

He's set up his 2018 re-election committee. He's running as an independent. George II Aug 2017 #184

Thank you for this information Gothmog Aug 2017 #192

We are fighting for our lives against nazis, you said. Hell to the yes, we are. Why would anyone.... Hekate Aug 2017 #174

Post removed Post removed Aug 2017 #181

Delusions of persecution. JHan Aug 2017 #183

You probably get hides because you're still refighting the 2016 primary. emulatorloo Aug 2017 #188

Well if it was my post you can rest assured I got a warning. moda253 Aug 2017 #186

Ahaha Egnever Aug 2017 #212