General Discussion

pangaia

(24,324 posts)

150. This is one of the best threads I have see. Pretty respectful on a difficult topic.

Thu Aug 17, 2017, 11:43 AM

Aug 2017

I'm trying to understand what I can about this 'group.' Seeing your experience vs Lisa M, is it, for example? Mineral Man's posts, and many others. I read that article in The Atlantic...and responses to it..etc...

The whole concept of violence and when it is or is not appropriate, necessary, is a huge question, or maybe it is not.. I fall very much on the non-violent side, whatever that REALLY means. On the other hand, what would I DO... if? In the moment something were happening....
If the 2 guys I see maybe once a month somewhere in the smallish town where I live, driving around in 2 pickups flying confederate battle flags (do they know each other).... were to one day be joined by others who may live here(I have no idea) in some rally, threatening stance, whatever it might be.. intimidating a small group of Muslim families in the local park on a Sat afternoon...also an Iranian family, dad plays zarb !!
What WOULD I do? I think I know...I hope I do...

Even HH The Dalai Lama has said about it, that there are instances when defensive violence may be necessary.

At least I have learned that for me, so far, 'antifa,' is still an undefined term, open to study...

God, I sound so professorial.. ugh!!

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Opinions on "Antifa"? [View all] underpants Aug 2017 OP

They have history in Europe lunasun Aug 2017 #1

lots to read about it here as well - not saying it is accurate, but it is info. NRaleighLiberal Aug 2017 #2

I am Antifa. ck4829 Aug 2017 #3

the path to progress IndieRick Aug 2017 #55

Indeed. A fighting spirit does not need actual physical hand to hand fighting. ck4829 Aug 2017 #57

VERY well said . Thank you for kacekwl Aug 2017 #187

I'm anti-fascist. (n/t) Iggo Aug 2017 #4

White supremacists would have called civil rights marchers in the cilla4progress Aug 2017 #5

The right wing media is trying to frame the story irisblue Aug 2017 #6

Exactly! Antifa has been twisted/morphed to mean PRO-FASCIST liberal. Hortensis Aug 2017 #180

Antifa has been labeled IndieRick Aug 2017 #193

Yeah. But the evolution of "Antifa" is a Frank Luntz-type creation. Hortensis Aug 2017 #194

I support Antifa. Weekend Warrior Aug 2017 #7

I am in favor of all antifa who are nonviolent. Which is probably most of them. Nt LostOne4Ever Aug 2017 #8

antifa is not the problem Fresh_Start Aug 2017 #9

Agree. SharonClark Aug 2017 #46

+1 Raine1967 Aug 2017 #49

true bdamomma Aug 2017 #120

Anyone who shows up to rallies to stir shit up, start fights, and destroy property.... Initech Aug 2017 #10

people who stir up violence are police agents DBoon Aug 2017 #63

+1 leftstreet Aug 2017 #125

I saw less destruction of property in Charlottesville than in other protests... AntiFascist Aug 2017 #175

Post removed Post removed Aug 2017 #11

Antifa and the Black Lives Matter movement are nothing alike. demmiblue Aug 2017 #20

Time for Democratic leaders to speak up about not being supportive of any group using vilence. haveahart Aug 2017 #12

Yeah, no -- GO ANTIFA! obamanut2012 Aug 2017 #66

Which is what the Nazis want. ProgressiveValue Aug 2017 #98

All the antifa will take a swing at the Nazis ? uponit7771 Aug 2017 #127

Seems to me to be an odd position to take. JayhawkSD Aug 2017 #13

The Original Antifa: JaneQPublic Aug 2017 #14

Excellent. I'm using that. underpants Aug 2017 #30

Damn right! workinclasszero Aug 2017 #32

👍🏻 Floyd R. Turbo Aug 2017 #37

No......because Antifa is anti-government. LisaM Aug 2017 #96

The antifa represent a wide range of political beliefs, all united against fascism. Coventina Aug 2017 #101

Seattle is a liberal city and however loosely you want to associate them with other groups or not, LisaM Aug 2017 #104

Well, all I can say is that your experience with them is vastly different from mine. Coventina Aug 2017 #106

I'm glad if you have an experience of Antifa as a peace-loving and positive force. LisaM Aug 2017 #108

You must be kidding - OMG! they had the nerve to disrupt Milo womanofthehills Aug 2017 #170

Thanks to Kpete: ret5hd Aug 2017 #102

Link and quote Antifa saying they're anti gov? Not the DAA but Antifa uponit7771 Aug 2017 #131

+1 uponit7771 Aug 2017 #128

And they died fighting Nazi's. Trump/Bannon are bound and determined Eliot Rosewater Aug 2017 #151

There is no comparison between the KKK/Nazis and Antifa. DanTex Aug 2017 #15

Excellent underpants Aug 2017 #45

Is this the new way to label anarchists? I mean the big A ones who show up to uppityperson Aug 2017 #16

A hate group. Expecting Rain Aug 2017 #17

The only group they hate are fascists and fascists deserve hatred. white_wolf Aug 2017 #158

I do not support their tactics. n/t demmiblue Aug 2017 #18

Even when they are saving lives?????? You are black and white - sad womanofthehills Aug 2017 #177

They are the same black bloc/anarchists that always engage in violence Lee-Lee Aug 2017 #19

That's pretty much what I thought. The destructive ones. underpants Aug 2017 #44

Yes, I agree with this. I remember the 1999 WTO protests in Seattle. LisaM Aug 2017 #83

When you brag that womens marches were nonviolent countryjake Aug 2017 #112

I didn't actually say that, I said that they walked by people trying to disrupt the march. LisaM Aug 2017 #115

There is little comparison between the WTO event and pro-Nazi rallies... AntiFascist Aug 2017 #178

Thank you, those are the people I was thinking of also uppityperson Aug 2017 #119

+1 uponit7771 Aug 2017 #132

Don't feed the Nazi Trolls the violence they want to create. Don't compromise about Nazis. L. Coyote Aug 2017 #21

Fighting fascism is a SOCIAL DUTY! Coventina Aug 2017 #22

You've stated that you "thank them" so they will come to your aid when the violence they seek... Expecting Rain Aug 2017 #23

Well guess what? Violence has never happened. Coventina Aug 2017 #24

cosign obamanut2012 Aug 2017 #67

+1,000,000 countryjake Aug 2017 #113

+1 leftstreet Aug 2017 #126

One of the Nazis said it best: Nevernose Aug 2017 #25

I appreciate your point. David__77 Aug 2017 #27

that obamanut2012 Aug 2017 #68

"Antifa" is undefined. MineralMan Aug 2017 #26

Antifa has an established identity here too. It is an embrage of violence. Expecting Rain Aug 2017 #29

Yes. And that identity is negative, as seen MineralMan Aug 2017 #33

You didn't feel that was 6 months ago. B2G Aug 2017 #147

Yes, I did feel that WAY 6 months ago. MineralMan Aug 2017 #149

They are not anti-liberals - things are not black and white as you see them womanofthehills Aug 2017 #169

Baader-Meinhof Group was antifa MattBaggins Aug 2017 #58

American activists are sometimes to quick to accept existing labels. MineralMan Aug 2017 #60

+1 uponit7771 Aug 2017 #135

I support struggle against fascists. David__77 Aug 2017 #28

You lose the moral high ground when you support people who use the same violent tactics Expecting Rain Aug 2017 #31

I could care less about "moral high ground." I care about personal integrity. David__77 Aug 2017 #36

It's very easy to condemn the antifa when you aren't an obvious target of fascists. Coventina Aug 2017 #39

I'm thinking back to high school when a white supremacist/anti-gay fascist threatened me. David__77 Aug 2017 #53

It is not integrity to back far-left anrchaist bully boys. Expecting Rain Aug 2017 #40

I understand your perspective. David__77 Aug 2017 #52

I do not believe that you believe that. ret5hd Aug 2017 #103

Did you read your own meme? Expecting Rain Aug 2017 #144

So antifa plow cars into people and hang people and support ... wtf are you saying here? thx uponit7771 Aug 2017 #136

you also lose the moral high ground when you make broad brush statements and false equivalencies fishwax Aug 2017 #148

You don't seem to understand what Antifa is... Expecting Rain Aug 2017 #157

on the contrary, you clearly don't understand what Antifa is fishwax Aug 2017 #160

They practice the same violent tactics (codename "direct action") Expecting Rain Aug 2017 #162

"direct action" does not equal "violence" fishwax Aug 2017 #163

It would be naive or disingenuous to suggest Antifa's concept of "direct action" Expecting Rain Aug 2017 #164

Again, you clearly have a pretty limited knowledge of antifa fishwax Aug 2017 #174

No, I'm intimately familiar with these people and know many of the locals by sight... Expecting Rain Aug 2017 #181

I suspect there's a confirmation/selection bias at play here fishwax Aug 2017 #184

Yes ideologically opposed to liberalism. Expecting Rain Aug 2017 #185

You know who helped the nazis come to power and it wasn't antifa The_Casual_Observer Aug 2017 #176

False dichotomy between doing nothing and feeding the Nazis the street violence they crave. Expecting Rain Aug 2017 #182

Sorry but you are completely wrong. The_Casual_Observer Aug 2017 #183

Repeating the charge doesn't make it true. Expecting Rain Aug 2017 #186

Somebody else claimed recently that both side engaged in the same tactics tkmorris Aug 2017 #167

Equating liberal Democrats who don't stand for violence... Expecting Rain Aug 2017 #172

You loose high moral ground when you look the other way womanofthehills Aug 2017 #171

I don't know about everything they've done in the past Downtown Hound Aug 2017 #34

Interesting article. Mme. Defarge Aug 2017 #35

Thanks for the link. I read it all. Trying to see into "what is what," pangaia Aug 2017 #121

wasn't at least some of the antifa violence NewJeffCT Aug 2017 #38

Yes. Sad that DUers have fallen for it. Coventina Aug 2017 #41

What's sad is that enemies of our party and enemies of liberalism... Expecting Rain Aug 2017 #42

And just who are you calling a troll? Coventina Aug 2017 #43

You're a troll? pangaia Aug 2017 #124

Teehee! Coventina Aug 2017 #143

This is one of the best threads I have see. Pretty respectful on a difficult topic. pangaia Aug 2017 #150

It is a difficult dilemma, no doubt about it. Coventina Aug 2017 #152

Ah, we all stumble and fall, do we not. So it's the journey that is important... pangaia Aug 2017 #153

Well if Cov is a troll underpants Aug 2017 #47

I've little doubt you fail to see the irony in your statement. LanternWaste Aug 2017 #56

teehee obamanut2012 Aug 2017 #71

Coventina is not trolling the forum. Solly Mack Aug 2017 #64

Brava! countryjake Aug 2017 #114

lulz obamanut2012 Aug 2017 #69

Antifa has no interest in political parties leftstreet Aug 2017 #129

I fear that people who cover their faces are making things easy for false flag mischief... .n/t annabanana Aug 2017 #188

There will always be troublemakers. Anifa groups do train on detecting Coventina Aug 2017 #190

as we have seen here on du there are some(many?) folks to the left of the party dembotoz Aug 2017 #48

Anti-fascist but not Antifa Thomas Hurt Aug 2017 #50

"Nascent movement" -- lol NO obamanut2012 Aug 2017 #72

Well, I wanna be careful here.... Adrahil Aug 2017 #51

The enemy of my enemy is my friend. Nazis/KKK/alt.right types are my enemies. Glorfindel Aug 2017 #54

Non violence begets non violence Not Ruth Aug 2017 #59

hahahahha wrong -- this is why the Nazis were not stopped obamanut2012 Aug 2017 #73

But it's why MLK won. Bonx Aug 2017 #92

No, MLK never advocated just be killed by terrorist. We're not supposed to INITIATE or EXACERBATE uponit7771 Aug 2017 #139

Saw this on #OurResistance; non violence is cowardice?????; I disagree of course Not Ruth Aug 2017 #116

I wonder how many felt that way when the Nazis first seized power? white_wolf Aug 2017 #159

I am opposed to Antifa as a violent group. It hurts progressive causes. kwassa Aug 2017 #61

They are not a "violent group -- that would be the Nazis obamanut2012 Aug 2017 #75

from the Atlantic article kwassa Aug 2017 #85

That's black block ... they're mixing up the groups in the article along with DAA. Antifa uponit7771 Aug 2017 #140

They should have no place in the Democratic party NobodyHere Aug 2017 #62

hahahaha wrong obamanut2012 Aug 2017 #74

Vandalism and violence is wrong at this point. HopeAgain Aug 2017 #78

They saved democratic protesters in Charlottesville womanofthehills Aug 2017 #173

They have been around fighting Fascists since the 30s obamanut2012 Aug 2017 #65

interesting enough by your username President Obama would disagree with you 100% snooper2 Aug 2017 #99

let the trump supporters make themselves look as indefensible as possible beachjustice Aug 2017 #70

Agree HopeAgain Aug 2017 #76

The Gandhi/King approach won't work with Nazis unfortunately. The_Casual_Observer Aug 2017 #77

If and when you commit violence, we will disavow you... nt HopeAgain Aug 2017 #79

Who is WE? You? The_Casual_Observer Aug 2017 #80

Yes me and all the Democratic leadership, I suspect. HopeAgain Aug 2017 #81

Wrong. Expecting Rain Aug 2017 #88

"kumbaya" ! The_Casual_Observer Aug 2017 #89

I'm not saying there's never a time to fight with violence. beachjustice Aug 2017 #100

Can you elaborate on this.. pangaia Aug 2017 #130

you might be right, but I still think whether to be aggressive with violence is a complex matter beachjustice Aug 2017 #189

State monopoly on violence is one of the Enlightenment values and Westphalian order AngryAmish Aug 2017 #82

My opinion on Antifa is... workinclasszero Aug 2017 #84

I'll condemn anyone who went to that rally looking for violence NobodyHere Aug 2017 #87

What can you expect from a KKK/nazi rally but violence? workinclasszero Aug 2017 #93

The Nazis were the ones who got the permit -- they are who was looking for violence obamanut2012 Aug 2017 #110

this obamanut2012 Aug 2017 #109

+1000000 GrapesOfWrath Aug 2017 #165

the word "Antifa" sounds scary and foreign. mainer Aug 2017 #86

Not a fan, personally. Oneironaut Aug 2017 #90

My feelings about Antifa are pretty straight-forward. MrScorpio Aug 2017 #91

This message was self-deleted by its author kentuck Aug 2017 #94

Antifa really hates Starbucks, but who do they like? Not Ruth Aug 2017 #117

I have been seeing Antifa United stickers all over Frankfurt... a la izquierda Aug 2017 #95

LOL.... pangaia Aug 2017 #134

They are too militant from what I've seen. We should not get caught up in that. phleshdef Aug 2017 #97

At the anti-racism march in Minneapolis last night moda253 Aug 2017 #105

Inevitable get the red out Aug 2017 #107

They have been around for almost 100 years obamanut2012 Aug 2017 #111

anti-fa KG Aug 2017 #118

I stand with anti-Fascists. D-Day wasn't a picnic. WinkyDink Aug 2017 #122

Antifa wants to preserve our Democracy, Fascists want to destroy it Tom Rinaldo Aug 2017 #123

Flavor-Of-The-Month for the RW Machine Montauk6 Aug 2017 #133

+1 uponit7771 Aug 2017 #142

I'm sure all the Sensible Centrists will be along to provide us with the correct opinion..... vi5 Aug 2017 #137

Somebody tell Chris Matthews the difference between Black Bloc hooligans librechik Aug 2017 #138

Ask here Not Ruth Aug 2017 #141

They are heroes defending this nation - for which we should all be very grateful! ElementaryPenguin Aug 2017 #145

They provide a conduit for Agents Provacateurs. Even if they are sincere in their anti-fascist yodermon Aug 2017 #146

I am soooooo glad heaven05 Aug 2017 #154

I get upset sometimes. But is a society, the best response to mob violence is nonviolence. Blue_true Aug 2017 #155

Twelve Million piles of ashes say you are wrong obamanut2012 Aug 2017 #192

i am antifa AmandaRuth Aug 2017 #156

Trolling for a race war: Neo-Nazis are trying to bait leftist antifa activists into violence and ollie10 Aug 2017 #161

Is this link unconnected to Antifa? kentuck Aug 2017 #166

Interesting underpants Aug 2017 #168

Message auto-removed Name removed Aug 2017 #179

Support them 100% OBenario4 Aug 2017 #191