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Trumpocalypse

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21. Don't confuse them with facts. nt

Reply to DetlefK (Reply #15)

Thu Aug 24, 2017, 06:43 AM

Aug 2017

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Response to the argument that "Sanders voters" put Trump in office. [View all] Ken Burch Aug 2017 OP

Exacyly. I'm fact, some trump voters would have voted Sanders had he been the nominee. snowy owl Aug 2017 #1

DURec leftstreet Aug 2017 #2

The issue is not with the article rufus dog Aug 2017 #3

Well put. It's about what the article is being used for. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #7

Yes. HughBeaumont Aug 2017 #17

So we're back to needing the "not all" preface? Oh jeeze. bettyellen Aug 2017 #84

We're back to not blaming an entire campaign for what a small sliver of people did. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #90

Again- you are conflating some voters w the campaign. Some voters were GOPers exhorted to vote bettyellen Aug 2017 #93

You seem to think that acknowledging the effects of TPP in the Upper Midwest means dismissing Ken Burch Aug 2017 #101

You want to bring this back to the primaries and I refuse to. We're taking the general.... bettyellen Aug 2017 #107

Why do you think I want to bring this back to the primaries? Ken Burch Aug 2017 #118

Fixing the voter suppression and finding out the depth of Russian interference are not campaign bettyellen Aug 2017 #121

If people slammed her for that, they were idiots. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #122

Anyone can point to one factor and say it swung it. It was that close. bettyellen Aug 2017 #123

I'm with you on all of that. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #127

It feel so like the dark ages. We need more people out there fighting. bettyellen Aug 2017 #129

Just concede that the headline AS IS is an undeserving broadbrush. HughBeaumont Aug 2017 #97

Most headlines are inaccurate clickbait, so yeah. But it's a new poll and as such... bettyellen Aug 2017 #99

There were red flags in Ohio for sure. HughBeaumont Aug 2017 #102

I agree that she overreached because their polling was pretty flawed. From what I understand they bettyellen Aug 2017 #109

I agree with all you wrote there. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #120

Ding Ding Ding: We have a winner! Chasstev365 Aug 2017 #104

Another thing that is not discussed GeoWilliam750 Aug 2017 #9

Is there any data on that? NurseJackie Aug 2017 #20

And then by positing his own questionable cause, lapucelle Aug 2017 #103

Another data question Jim Lane Aug 2017 #115

Post removed Post removed Aug 2017 #28

Ken the Newsweek article is about the --minority-- of Sanders voters who did not vote Dem in the GE emulatorloo Aug 2017 #4

I believe the intent is to absolve Sanders voters rufus dog Aug 2017 #5

I am aware of all of that. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #6

I do not believe applegrove posted the article to invalidate the Sander's campaign emulatorloo Aug 2017 #8

Read the later responses in this thread. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #43

Perhaps that's because of your confirmation bias? emulatorloo Aug 2017 #111

For the life of me madokie Aug 2017 #18

There are those whose hatred of Hillary was greater than dislike of Trump n2doc Aug 2017 #22

It's a mistake to put it down to "hatred of Hillary". Ken Burch Aug 2017 #42

There were many reasons why Trump won n2doc Aug 2017 #45

Fair enough. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #49

If you go to JPR you will see the mindset that produced this. Its twisted and tortured but its there stevenleser Aug 2017 #38

Thats just a few individuals madokie Aug 2017 #47

I'm not saying JPR has more than a hundred or so sick individuals. The point is however, the talking stevenleser Aug 2017 #95

See also wayofthebern on Reddit. emulatorloo Aug 2017 #110

I can only imagine. Probably the same garbage right? stevenleser Aug 2017 #124

Same with me. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #44

I can't either burrowowl Aug 2017 #131

Seems to me that before any conclusions can be drawn, the data has to be corrected for voter diva77 Aug 2017 #10

This is a really important point Bettie Aug 2017 #30

Given that these were people who voted, those aren't relevant mythology Aug 2017 #46

I get what you're saying. My point is that even if those people voted the way they say they voted, diva77 Aug 2017 #88

Thank you. FOR EXAMPLE -- RandomAccess Aug 2017 #126

thanks for the links diva77 Aug 2017 #130

We continue to make these mistakes because we are passionate. SleeplessinSoCal Aug 2017 #11

It hurts all of us MFM008 Aug 2017 #13

The "hate" on Hillary has been festering and fed for decades. Hulk Aug 2017 #12

The Democratic Party had better come out with a strong, clear and concise message, or it won't be rpannier Aug 2017 #14

One message won't work everywhere...we must tailor the message to the state. Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #27

There's no place where we have to nominate people who will pledge Ken Burch Aug 2017 #36

You always need Joe Manchin types for red states...we never had the majority without a big tent. Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #106

What a steaming pile of bullpucky. Double-speak word-salad at its finest. DetlefK Aug 2017 #15

Don't confuse them with facts. nt Trumpocalypse Aug 2017 #21

Bernie's campaign didn't cause anyone who would otherwise voted HRC in the fall to avoid doing so. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #37

But your OP isn't about his campaign. Your OP talks about Bernie-voters. DetlefK Aug 2017 #40

This is simply a group of people who voted for Bernie once. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #48

This is why your OPs are wrongheaded. The poll is counting voters, period. bettyellen Aug 2017 #87

+1 nt Fresh_Start Aug 2017 #94

Best... reply... EVER! Nailed it. NurseJackie Aug 2017 #100

Snore. WinkyDink Aug 2017 #16

Just an opinion - not a response Justice Aug 2017 #19

Correlation is evidence, just often piss poor evidence Major Nikon Aug 2017 #54

How many wrote in Sanders when he wasn't on the ballot? nm MichMan Aug 2017 #23

Don't know. And I've never defended anyone who did. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #34

"We have no evidence for any conclusions about these people beyond that." betsuni Aug 2017 #24

Yes. Alienation. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #33

What is status quo? betsuni Aug 2017 #39

OK...the overall political culture in D.C. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #50

Go to JPR and read past threads. Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #25

this obamanut2012 Aug 2017 #31

Believe it or not LovesPNW Aug 2017 #56

There is no question that some of those who supported Sen. Sanders refused to vote for Demsrule86 Aug 2017 #105

Typical joeybee12 Aug 2017 #26

yup obamanut2012 Aug 2017 #32

Are you moving us forward with this? Cary Aug 2017 #29

A small percent of Bernie voters are coal miners and misogynists. So what? lostnfound Aug 2017 #35

Bernie did not get any significant support from misogynists. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #55

"Every supporter" BannonsLiver Aug 2017 #125

The horse is dead, Ken. blogslut Aug 2017 #41

I proved I accepted the primaries by campaigning for HRC in the fall. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #58

RIP, horse. blogslut Aug 2017 #59

I'm beating no horse. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #61

+1. (n/t) FreepFryer Aug 2017 #71

What's the name of your dog? WhiteTara Aug 2017 #51

He wasn't. Hillary would have done worse if he'd been barred from the primaries. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #52

"No chance of getting anyone with occupy values" to vote for HRC? That's patently false. FreepFryer Aug 2017 #57

Not without their being an Occupy candidate in the primaries. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #60

You say "they" as if you claim some privileged understanding of an exceptionally diverse coalition. FreepFryer Aug 2017 #63

I do know they rejected the limits of mainstream politics. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #67

Your congoing effort to consider "them" a singular bloc betrays a need to oversimplify. Why? (nt) FreepFryer Aug 2017 #68

I take them seriously. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #70

Again with the "they". Some did, some didn't. Seeking company in the depths of self-recrimination? FreepFryer Aug 2017 #72

Some did...BECAUSE Bernie had been in the race, because they had been heard. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #75

Defensive & false."None of their values had been included in the primary discussion" is a giveaway. FreepFryer Aug 2017 #76

True. WhiteTara Aug 2017 #81

After he LOST the primary WhiteTara Aug 2017 #62

His speech in Philly WAS a full throated endorsement. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #69

Knowing this was an active Russian effort to split the Democrats, did he do all he could to unite? FreepFryer Aug 2017 #73

Seee dossier's page 15 for a lot more on the Russian conspiracy to subvert the Democratic Party vote FreepFryer Aug 2017 #83

Mendacity Expecting Rain Aug 2017 #74

I expect people to believe the truth. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #79

Ken. I see you are very attached WhiteTara Aug 2017 #77

+1. Also have no interest - neither in absolution nor refighting the primary. FreepFryer Aug 2017 #80

I've dwelled on the TPP because it elected Trump. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #85

Me thinks thou doth protest too much. nt. WhiteTara Aug 2017 #86

I supported and campaigned for the ticket Ken Burch Aug 2017 #89

Okay, I'm taking a break from work, so WhiteTara Aug 2017 #108

I agree that that happened. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #116

Join your local Party. WhiteTara Aug 2017 #117

I've been locall involved the whole time. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #119

Thanks Ken LovesPNW Aug 2017 #53

The rhetoric isn't as lame as the strawmen. BannonsLiver Aug 2017 #98

It was always bullshit Major Nikon Aug 2017 #64

Not Voting Has Consequences Too ollie10 Aug 2017 #65

So, basically, Sanders eventually exhorting people who voted for him in the primaries stopbush Aug 2017 #66

Indeed. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #91

Bullshit. nt LexVegas Aug 2017 #78

Logic? Math? Statistical scattering? I suppose you'll be using science and reason next!! Bucky Aug 2017 #82

I don't doubt that some Sanders voters voted for Trump... kentuck Aug 2017 #92

This may be saying the same thing GaryCnf Aug 2017 #96

This is the same argument that blames Nader voters for Bush. alarimer Aug 2017 #112

It's often important we fend both off injury and keep safe our sacred cows LanternWaste Aug 2017 #113

We all know 80-90% of Sanders voters voted for Hillary. DemocraticWing Aug 2017 #114

My point exactly. Ken Burch Aug 2017 #128