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Orsino

(37,428 posts)

57. Exactly what do we think Citizens United has done to our two major parties?

Thu Sep 7, 2017, 07:51 AM

Sep 2017

What do we think has been the effect of private donations coming disproportionately from the very rich?

How much success do we think the Democratic Party can have, or is willing to shoot for, in the face of the power now wielded by the wealthy?

Calling the party an "absolute failure" would be hyperbolic in the extreme, but what Sanders actually said makes more sense. He has indeed identified the biggest obstacle to progress, even if it's unfair to expect an entire party to disarm unilaterally in the face of corporate dominance.

We need to be more honest than the subject line of the OP in acknowledging the failure--inevitable, perhaps--of the Democratic Party to slay the beast of undemocratic private money that is responsible for most of our current ills. Sanders should be more honest in acknowledging that both parties have the same disease, if to different extents. If the Democratic Party is failing to fix it all, the GOP is actively trying to make us all fail. It's been baked into their platform for decades.

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The Democratic party is an absolute failure. [View all] Eko Sep 2017 OP

GOPers control all three gvt branches right now n/t leftstreet Sep 2017 #1

So did the Democratic party fairly recent. Eko Sep 2017 #2

Do you know how long Obama had "all theee branches"? Obviously not.... bettyellen Sep 2017 #8

Not that long ago Eko Sep 2017 #13

It's not subjective to say Trumps already had those majorities longer than Obama did in 8 years. bettyellen Sep 2017 #19

Hopefully it wont Eko Sep 2017 #23

Trump has not had the majorities longer...they took the house in 10 if we take the house in 18, it Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #59

You'd better research that. With Ted Kennedy's death and Al Franken's recount, the summer... brush Sep 2017 #88

We did not have a veto proof majority after Kennedy's death or Franken's recount Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #90

Aren't you saying the same thing I am? We didn't have a filibuster proof majority for a continuous.. brush Sep 2017 #92

No the Republicans have 52 Senators at this moment...they do not have a veto proof majority. Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #94

My point is Obama did not have a continuous 2-year, filibuster proof majority. Is that not true? brush Sep 2017 #99

Oh...sorry. I agree with that. I thought you meant that the GOP is in a better position than Obama Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #105

Glad you guys figured it out. Agree with both. Hortensis Sep 2017 #134

Yes. And too many times on the cable news shows that contention goes unchallenged. brush Sep 2017 #146

Umhm. Almost always. All day and into the mid evening reliably. Hortensis Sep 2017 #147

At some points he had the majority for mere days and then lost it.... bettyellen Sep 2017 #143

Ugh is right. Lieberman was not dependable. brush Sep 2017 #144

Um...obergefell happened in 2015 Docreed2003 Sep 2017 #33

So we didnt need all three branches Eko Sep 2017 #42

We held all branches until 10 when we lost the house...and if some could stop criticizing Democrats Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #58

The Judicial? HughBeaumont Sep 2017 #60

You're totally right. Thanks. bettyellen Sep 2017 #121

Two branches -nt Bradical79 Sep 2017 #98

Whoops. Although I fondly look back at Sotomayor's appointment... bettyellen Sep 2017 #122

Yeah, she was a pretty great addition Bradical79 Sep 2017 #124

GOP holds a majority of state governments, too. CrispyQ Sep 2017 #126

We have Gorsuch on the Supreme Court for 2+ generations. mountain grammy Sep 2017 #3

Major blow, Eko Sep 2017 #4

The worst is yet to come if we don't take back the Senate mountain grammy Sep 2017 #7

That should be petitioned in the courts icymist Sep 2017 #52

There is not way to do that. You have to vote for Democrats in order to save the courts period. Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #61

And we still got a Republican Suprene Court nominee. ZX86 Sep 2017 #168

Right but we wouldn't have had Hillary Clinton been elected...they might have refused to seat her Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #169

You hit the mail on the head. Great post lunamagica Sep 2017 #5

Good moose... Whiskeytide Sep 2017 #6

So Eko Sep 2017 #10

I did. Whiskeytide Sep 2017 #12

Yes you did. Eko Sep 2017 #15

"An absolute failure..." This from an alleged ally. He has continually attacked the party... brush Sep 2017 #9

More re-fighting old battles. shanny Sep 2017 #11

Yes, Eko Sep 2017 #16

Everyone says things in frustration. Me included mvd Sep 2017 #29

Im a retail manager. Eko Sep 2017 #38

In a way.. but the party has to leave him behind to move on nini Sep 2017 #31

Lol shanny Sep 2017 #48

Laugh all you want nini Sep 2017 #96

you're right, i shouldn't laugh shanny Sep 2017 #100

Really?? This isn't hard. Hillary doesn't attack the Democratic party. R B Garr Sep 2017 #101

so the Democrats in Congress saying that this book is counter-productive shanny Sep 2017 #106

"the Democrats" aren't saying that. And Bernie does plenty of whining. This thread R B Garr Sep 2017 #112

nice straw man shanny Sep 2017 #118

Wrong. No strawman. You said, "the Democrats in Congress" R B Garr Sep 2017 #119

I said "the Democrats in Congress saying..." shanny Sep 2017 #120

Then read your own sentence. You implied R B Garr Sep 2017 #123

If you think putting feelings and reactions in a book is the same nini Sep 2017 #103

i'll go with my original assessment shanny Sep 2017 #108

Of course you will nini Sep 2017 #110

We absolutely have to...or we will have a disastrous election in 18. Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #63

Excellent advice. brush Sep 2017 #89

This was said in August of this year and the battle won't end until some stop making comments like Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #62

Tell that to Bernie and the people who keep pushing him for 2020. pnwmom Sep 2017 #160

Post removed Post removed Sep 2017 #14

newsflash Skittles Sep 2017 #22

This includes Bernie - right? nini Sep 2017 #34

I Have No Problem With That Ccarmona Sep 2017 #47

You give your permission? Cary Sep 2017 #79

So it's not age then nini Sep 2017 #97

Yes, there should be no criticism of the party. progressoid Sep 2017 #17

absolute failure Eko Sep 2017 #20

It's not a statement of finality. progressoid Sep 2017 #30

absolute Eko Sep 2017 #32

Sure. Really funny. progressoid Sep 2017 #37

If words dont mean anything Eko Sep 2017 #40

Wow. progressoid Sep 2017 #45

Do those key words change Eko Sep 2017 #46

Yeah, we all want one of our major candidates from 2016 saying we're an absolute failure (sarcasm gi brush Sep 2017 #91

actually, to put a fine point on it, G_j Sep 2017 #35

And that differs how? Eko Sep 2017 #41

Providing a complete sentence G_j Sep 2017 #43

I provided the link Eko Sep 2017 #44

Thank you. nt Susan Calvin Sep 2017 #125

What you consider stupid shit others might not consider it so...but yeah in the age of Trump Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #64

POINT! GAME, SET, MATCH! haveahart Sep 2017 #18

that's what happens when you don't have Russia, the FBI and the media on your side Skittles Sep 2017 #21

And the malignant dark-money kleptocrats, all entered AGAINST the Democrats. Hortensis Sep 2017 #136

and fucking FACEBOOK Skittles Sep 2017 #148

We get it mythology Sep 2017 #24

You dont get it. Eko Sep 2017 #25

Its been 11 months since the election Eko Sep 2017 #27

This has nothing to do with the primary. Sen. Sanders has made derogatory remarks Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #66

Thank you. murielm99 Sep 2017 #26

Thanks. Eko Sep 2017 #28

I made a similar post not long ago...you are not the only one. I live in Ohio Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #68

🤗 sprinkleeninow Sep 2017 #36

About Time? shanny Sep 2017 #49

Maybe some of these Dems need to be primaried NCDem777 Sep 2017 #54

Of course the evil Dems must be dealt with ....why they want to deport DACA Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #69

And there are plenty of Dems who also wanted to start more wars NCDem777 Sep 2017 #145

Maybe it would be better to murielm99 Sep 2017 #162

As long as Sanders is out there trashing Democrats.... Historic NY Sep 2017 #39

He's been saying that since 1994 at least. ucrdem Sep 2017 #50

'current model and the current strategy ' melman Sep 2017 #51

conservatives think that the podesta emails clu Sep 2017 #53

It hit every newspaper in the country...Why would Sanders echo conservatives...and Podesta emails Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #70

did you read the BBC link clu Sep 2017 #75

Yes I read it, and I don't agree with it...having read Podesta's email first hand. Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #82

I don't care for Nina Turner blueinredohio Sep 2017 #55

I despise her...and how about Move On primarying Tim Ryan? Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #71

This message was self-deleted by its author m-lekktor Sep 2017 #56

Exactly what do we think Citizens United has done to our two major parties? Orsino Sep 2017 #57

Yeah and if we did what Sanders suggested, we would lose every election... Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #72

helping bush against gore? clu Sep 2017 #76

The old Nader-stole-it meme won't die. Orsino Sep 2017 #80

Nader caused the United victory...and in the age of Trump to call Democrats 'corporate' Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #102

We know that unilateral disarmament won't happen... Orsino Sep 2017 #138

A recent interview with the evil one, where he makes some valid points. CrispyQ Sep 2017 #132

Yep. Even Nader is bothering to note... Orsino Sep 2017 #139

I don't care to read anything murielm99 Sep 2017 #142

Sorry it was Nader...who cost us the election...and the Green rifffaff who claimed Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #81

The election that Gore won? Orsino Sep 2017 #131

The party was also diminshed and tarnished with descriptions such as... NurseJackie Sep 2017 #65

He is not an ally. He votes with Democrats mostly as they share ideology...in most cases. Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #74

You're right. People should look at a politicians WORDS and DEEDS before... NurseJackie Sep 2017 #77

I fear Sen.Sanders will try again in 20...hope not. Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #78

He may. But not as a Democrat. I suspect his protected status as an "ally"... NurseJackie Sep 2017 #83

I hope the current Dem leadership would not allow him to run as a Democrat. He is not a Democrat. Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #84

They won't. I think they learned a lesson. NurseJackie Sep 2017 #93

If they didn't after the general, they sure should have after the so called unity tour. Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #107

That was a complete disaster. What a sham. NurseJackie Sep 2017 #109

It was horrible...women thrown under the bus...and the party attacked constantly. Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #117

Exactly, can you imagine if anything like that was publicly said about Sanders? R B Garr Sep 2017 #95

Post removed Post removed Sep 2017 #67

Sometimes.. disillusioned73 Sep 2017 #73

Hmmm. What Could Have Happened In 2008, I Wonder ProfessorGAC Sep 2017 #85

Yes, there was that affect.. disillusioned73 Sep 2017 #87

I Buy That (nt) ProfessorGAC Sep 2017 #116

depressing.. nt G_j Sep 2017 #86

And yet, he desperately wanted to be the 2016 DEM PARTY presidential nominee! MoonRiver Sep 2017 #104

Are you guys ever going to stop tearing the party apart? awesomerwb1 Sep 2017 #111

Nice misleading representation of what was said. berni_mccoy Sep 2017 #113

Just stop already ornotna Sep 2017 #137

See post 153. Eko Sep 2017 #155

Repeat after me: Sen Sanders is adamant that HE IS NOT A DEMOCRAT. stopbush Sep 2017 #114

Well, looking at the state of affairs in washington, the dem party certainly isn't sucessful... JoeStuckInOH Sep 2017 #115

Excellent post. CrispyQ Sep 2017 #135

a wise person once told me 'Its not how big it is.... samnsara Sep 2017 #127

Here's a critique of the party from someone who people hate even more than Bernie. CrispyQ Sep 2017 #128

Listen for the sigh of frustration. guillaumeb Sep 2017 #129

Thanks for this. NastyRiffraff Sep 2017 #130

Message auto-removed Name removed Sep 2017 #133

He is none of the above. MrsCoffee Sep 2017 #140

I agree with your analysis Gothmog Sep 2017 #141

An English Lesson for you Rilgin Sep 2017 #149

The quote you 'fix' is exactly the same thing...it is an attack on the Democratic Party and you Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #150

The OP opinion is his opinion. His misquote of anothers sentence is not Rilgin Sep 2017 #151

I haven't seen attacks...but there is no doubt Sen. Sanders had been critical of the Democratic Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #152

No. That is a fair characterization Rilgin Sep 2017 #154

I happen to believe that Sen. Sander does in fact dislike the Democratic Party and has for years. Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #161

See post 153. Eko Sep 2017 #156

I honestly take you post seriously. Eko Sep 2017 #153

I'm sorry, but G_j Sep 2017 #157

I did quote accurately. Eko Sep 2017 #158

No, You took words and attributed them to what was not the subject of a sentence. Rilgin Sep 2017 #159

Ok here is some english. Eko Sep 2017 #163

You are right, i remembered "strategy" as "tactics". The point remains the same. Rilgin Sep 2017 #164

I dont believe I ever added quotes to the paraphrase. Eko Sep 2017 #165

Oh yeah. Eko Sep 2017 #166

And last but not least. Eko Sep 2017 #167