General Discussion

pangaia

(24,324 posts)

76. Conservatives in other countries are.. what... moderates? here.

Wed Sep 13, 2017, 09:44 PM

Sep 2017

Friends in Norway, Denmark, for example, always complain about taxes, the electronic tolls on the highways, VAT( I think), etc.... Its the thing to do. Blah blah...but when push comes to shove, they LOVE the great roads, the health care, the school system, the family care, child care, They, for the most part, understand the concept of 'the commons.' And the great value of caring for it.

here.... I WANNA DO WHAT I WANNA DO. Its MY money.. FREEDOM..

They wouldn't move to this soon to be shit hole for anything..

Shit, I'm retired and have an offer of a place to live in Finland. It IS on my mind. freakin cold in winter, though. LOL. But, the ALLEGRO goes directly from Helsinki Station to St Petersburg and THERIN lies the Mariinsky Theater...

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Im all for single payer if you can write a bill that makes sense, but this bill is an embarrassment [View all] factfinder_77 Sep 2017 OP

Why in the WORLD would he put forth a bill like this, ESPECIALLY this and not Eliot Rosewater Sep 2017 #1

Read? Reading? HarmonyRockets Sep 2017 #7

Why dont you copy and paste for us the details of how it is paid for. Eliot Rosewater Sep 2017 #9

Why don't you just go ahead and read it. HarmonyRockets Sep 2017 #16

I am waiting for someone to copy and paste the detailed explanation here Eliot Rosewater Sep 2017 #17

I just read it ismnotwasm Sep 2017 #45

is there some magic way to do it that would not require tax revision? Egnever Sep 2017 #70

I read it to, and I am not even sure if the revenue he is suggesting is enough. There are a lot of still_one Sep 2017 #92

OK, well if it does describe in detail how to pay for it, and if the problem Eliot Rosewater Sep 2017 #122

Message auto-removed Name removed Sep 2017 #141

Here HarmonyRockets Sep 2017 #142

Perfect, and it will work, but not until Eliot Rosewater Sep 2017 #143

I didn't see any of that in what was proposed on Wednesday. In fact none of that... George II Sep 2017 #145

Guess that would take too much effort. InAbLuEsTaTe Sep 2017 #126

Ok I read it and it involves raising taxes substantially and does not address the 20% gap Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #118

It's just aspirational symbolism for now greeny2323 Sep 2017 #2

I agree with that.... but.... Adrahil Sep 2017 #29

Thank God we have Schumer and Pelosi trying to fix DACA and the ACA. SunSeeker Sep 2017 #113

Bingo. You touched on the only thing that matters BannonsLiver Sep 2017 #44

Aspirational for what....a successful bill or something else? George II Sep 2017 #52

To be fair, 45 has floated a lot of stuff without basis in reality. forgotmylogin Sep 2017 #97

Ding Ding. Ding! peggysue2 Sep 2017 #98

Over 100 house members signed on to Conyers bill delisen Sep 2017 #102

Republicans control congress right now. JI7 Sep 2017 #3

The GOP has already started: factfinder_77 Sep 2017 #5

Just to be clear HarmonyRockets Sep 2017 #12

MOre likely the poster is showing you now what at least half the country believes Eliot Rosewater Sep 2017 #19

I think the smart part is making people want it first. Demit Sep 2017 #34

You were provided a link to how to pay for it and you refused to click on it. scipan Sep 2017 #138

The problem is that Bernie's bill.... Adrahil Sep 2017 #31

There are options HarmonyRockets Sep 2017 #32

Not good enough. Adrahil Sep 2017 #33

Legislators don't pass laws based on "options". George II Sep 2017 #146

Bernie doesn't know how to build consensus. LuvLoogie Sep 2017 #58

Just like when the fucking John F. Kennedy talked about going to the moon Gore1FL Sep 2017 #86

Right? beam me up scottie Sep 2017 #87

Thanks! ProfessorGAC Sep 2017 #119

Other countries have single payer MyNameGoesHere Sep 2017 #120

See his website for more specifics. Gore1FL Sep 2017 #144

The responses to that tweet are awesome. n/t TCJ70 Sep 2017 #36

Yeah they are! beam me up scottie Sep 2017 #83

Thanks! Those were fun to read! nt Gore1FL Sep 2017 #90

Uh HarmonyRockets Sep 2017 #4

:) Donkees Sep 2017 #15

So Sanders require Trump tax reform to match up with his "options"..its just empty words. factfinder_77 Sep 2017 #18

Well lookie there... beam me up scottie Sep 2017 #23

Rep. Conyers Funding of H.R.676 - Expanded & Improved Medicare For All Act factfinder_77 Sep 2017 #25

There you go HarmonyRockets Sep 2017 #27

You're kidding, right? All that says is "taxes, if passed in the future, will pay for it." SunSeeker Sep 2017 #114

The same way they fund wars and tax cuts. dogman Sep 2017 #6

The status quo is all we have for the foreseeable future. Demsrule86 Sep 2017 #13

And they wonder why Dems lose. dogman Sep 2017 #20

I stand with Senator Booker, Senator Harris, and Senator Gillibrand! Warren DeMontague Sep 2017 #8

But the REPUBLICANS DON'T LIKE IT! And they're TWEETING! beam me up scottie Sep 2017 #14

In some alternate universe, this exact same proposal has been raised in the Senate, but without Warren DeMontague Sep 2017 #112

Yeah, that's where it looked like this was headed -- no costs attached. I think that's R B Garr Sep 2017 #10

I expect the "concern troll" label will be applied tymorial Sep 2017 #28

Oh, your observation has been coming true all over the place. Any comments R B Garr Sep 2017 #139

Its not serious. Its more bullshit. nt LexVegas Sep 2017 #11

Yep, it will definitely cost usa few seats in 2018 because of how stupid it is. Lee Adama Sep 2017 #21

What a real Democrat looks like HarmonyRockets Sep 2017 #22

I stand with Senator Cory Booker! beam me up scottie Sep 2017 #24

Cory Booker 2020! R B Garr Sep 2017 #93

This has been my thought too tymorial Sep 2017 #26

WOW HarmonyRockets Sep 2017 #30

Cory Booker (D-N.J.) voted no on prescription drug price legislation factfinder_77 Sep 2017 #35

Looking for redemption? dogman Sep 2017 #46

Booker is a co-sponsor of the Affordable and Safe Prescription Drug Importation Act tammywammy Sep 2017 #94

In Canada, imported drugs are subject to strict regulations. lapucelle Sep 2017 #115

Very disappointing to say the least. InAbLuEsTaTe Sep 2017 #127

And then he voted yes on an amended proposal a week later- out of the loop? bettyellen Sep 2017 #136

I agree with you. It really is interesting.nt chowder66 Sep 2017 #39

Yup. Can't imagine why. pangaia Sep 2017 #60

Most people already pay a lot in taxes for their healthcare. guillaumeb Sep 2017 #37

right, Some seem to forget the expenses that will disappear or be greatly reduced... pangaia Sep 2017 #63

I mentioned this in another thread: guillaumeb Sep 2017 #66

Conservatives in other countries are.. what... moderates? here. pangaia Sep 2017 #76

I would not have to move too far. guillaumeb Sep 2017 #79

We would be better off rallying around a public option. DemocratSinceBirth Sep 2017 #38

This is absolutely the way to go. Half the nation wouldn't want to give R B Garr Sep 2017 #40

Medicare-for-all would be the ultimate freedom of choice... TCJ70 Sep 2017 #41

How would it be the ultimate freedom of choice if you can only choose from one plan? DemocratSinceBirth Sep 2017 #42

What kind of argument is that? TCJ70 Sep 2017 #48

It's a good argument. That's what it is. DemocratSinceBirth Sep 2017 #50

No they do not. leftofcool Sep 2017 #59

that's the smart thing to do at the moment. JHan Sep 2017 #111

Nice dose of reality, JHan. brer cat Sep 2017 #123

Shoring up the ACA should be the focus. JHan Sep 2017 #135

Ain't it about time you picked our side on this one? crosinski Sep 2017 #43

I'm all in favor of starting a war in Iraq or Afghanistan but darn there's no funding for it. Nt lostnfound Sep 2017 #47

Good one! JoeOtterbein Sep 2017 #55

Same thing was said about Obamacare. We gotta start Chimichurri Sep 2017 #49

Not surprising. We can do anything and everything. Don't worry about how to pay for it! George II Sep 2017 #51

I saw that to pay for it we would need an eleven percent payroll tax and a nine percent income tax. DemocratSinceBirth Sep 2017 #53

Or call it F35 Stealthcare. dogman Sep 2017 #56

Payroll taxes are 15.3%, from the first dollar earned. DemocratSinceBirth Sep 2017 #62

Your numbers are off Egnever Sep 2017 #65

I will wait for the CBO Score DemocratSinceBirth Sep 2017 #77

Now you will wait? Egnever Sep 2017 #82

Am I allowed to elaborate ? DemocratSinceBirth Sep 2017 #84

My self-pay premium for my employer based plan while unemployed was $1600+/month. dogman Sep 2017 #85

COBRA insurance is obscenely high. Under my plan you could buy into Medicare. DemocratSinceBirth Sep 2017 #96

According to Bernies proposal those numbers are off. Egnever Sep 2017 #61

Or Berniecare might end up costing nothing due to decreased administrative overhead Not Ruth Sep 2017 #78

Some estimates have been as high as 26%. George II Sep 2017 #80

I am going to do the prudent thing and wait for peer reviewed numbers. DemocratSinceBirth Sep 2017 #88

Excellent analysis. NurseJackie Sep 2017 #64

But not close to resembling the truth. Egnever Sep 2017 #67

As long as your Medicare is covered, right? n/t QC Sep 2017 #105

What does that have to do with this? George II Sep 2017 #109

I paid into medicare for more than 50 years comradebillyboy Sep 2017 #128

The organized attacks on Bernie and all that he does are interesting. CentralMass Sep 2017 #54

LOL. pangaia Sep 2017 #69

Seriously. I guess criticizing Booker, Harris, Franken and Gillibrand is okay now? Warren DeMontague Sep 2017 #116

Is there an actual piece of legislation or is it still in the proposal stage? lapucelle Sep 2017 #57

Funny how that got left out, eh? TCJ70 Sep 2017 #71

Hey, it worked for the GOP BayouBengal07 Sep 2017 #68

Your post is BS too INdemo Sep 2017 #72

This Right Here..... LovingA2andMI Sep 2017 #104

K&R Gothmog Sep 2017 #73

One would also hope that you would show how their savings in health care spending Egnever Sep 2017 #74

in my gut i questioned the whole thinig.. i didnt even listen to samnsara Sep 2017 #75

I am willing to wait for a CBO score or a score from a dispassionate researcher. DemocratSinceBirth Sep 2017 #81

LOL. Gee who could have predicted that he'd do for health care what he did for Hillary. ucrdem Sep 2017 #89

You're not alone. NurseJackie Sep 2017 #95

Thank you! ucrdem Sep 2017 #99

Ouch! comradebillyboy Sep 2017 #129

Regardless of the facts of this particular bill. In regards to health care Docreed2003 Sep 2017 #91

Why would there need to be tax increases? Kleveland Sep 2017 #100

"Call them taxes if you wish"- that's what they would nd Lee-Lee Sep 2017 #117

How do all of those first world countries do it? panader0 Sep 2017 #101

Universal coverage and single payer aren't synonymous. DemocratSinceBirth Sep 2017 #110

Well Ontario has a 15% Goods and Services tax. MichMan Sep 2017 #130

Yes, please provide a balanced plan relayerbob Sep 2017 #103

Post removed Post removed Sep 2017 #106

It doesn't look like it's meant to become law BainsBane Sep 2017 #107

You want to see our details?? We don't need no stinkin' details!! ucrdem Sep 2017 #108

typical heaven05 Sep 2017 #121

The issue i have with this, is that today, true health care costs are hidden form taxpayers Calista241 Sep 2017 #124

I'm glad Rep. John Conyers isn't embarrassed by Sen. Sanders in their joint effort. Nanjeanne Sep 2017 #125

They have been friends and allies for decades. QC Sep 2017 #133

... Nanjeanne Sep 2017 #134

Thanks for this. This is a great move by Sanders AND Conyers nt riderinthestorm Sep 2017 #137

Sanders has an extremely poor record of legislative success. Weekend Warrior Sep 2017 #131

Blah, blah, blah. KPN Sep 2017 #132

it's not the first time Bernie has been lax on details Skittles Sep 2017 #140