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Jim Lane

(11,175 posts)
19. Important distinction: "like the message" and "credit the message" are two different concepts.
Thu Oct 5, 2017, 12:28 AM
Oct 2017

You write, "What's the matter? You don't like the message?"

If you habitually assess a proposition about the world according to whether you like it or not, you will not have an accurate picture. I don't like the message that more than 60 million people voted for the odious Trump, but that message is more credible than the view I'd get if I polled all my friends.

The OP was based on a self-selected sample. By contrast, scientific pollsters, striving for random samples, aren't perfect, but they get much closer to the truth. Here's one such result:

Significant majorities of registered voters now have an equally unfavorable opinion of both major party presidential candidates, according to a new survey released Wednesday, following a difficult stretch for Hillary Clinton's presidential campaign.

Fifty-nine percent of registered voters say their opinion of Clinton is unfavorable, while 39% say it's favorable, according to the new poll from the Washington Post/ABC News.

Those numbers put Clinton on equal footing with Donald Trump, who also faces a daunting favorability deficit. Trump is viewed unfavorably by 60% of registered voters, compared to 37% who say they have a favorable opinion of the GOP nominee, according to the poll.


That poll was from late August of 2016. The numbers were probably about the same by Election Day. In assessing enthusiasm of support, we have to bear in mind that each major-party candidate received a significant number of votes from people who were primarily voting against the other one. (This is actually a small ray of hope about those millions of Trump voters. Many of them disliked "their" candidate. They voted for him only because of the effects of a quarter of a century of right-wing attacks on Clinton.)

You point to the views of a "majority of sane voters" without elaboration. If "sane" is defined as "voted enthusiastically for Hillary Clinton", then your statement is correct, but it exemplifies the "No true Scotsman" fallacy.



Recommendations

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hear! hear! Madam45for2923 Sep 2017 #1
Hey, I got remembered! Yes! How welcome just to read friendly descriptions, Hortensis Sep 2017 #2
I tried to paste one of the word diagrams in the article to my OP but it would not take. Madam45for2923 Sep 2017 #4
It's near the top of the article, under "Most Qualified" heading, but Hortensis Oct 2017 #26
Yep, down the memory hole in record time. ucrdem Sep 2017 #3
Yep! Also funny how we were not able to compare notes on election day b/c DU got hacked! Madam45for2923 Sep 2017 #6
"Disappearing" the majority of voters- delisen Sep 2017 #5
They wished we disappeared. But we got lots of stamina. Madam45for2923 Sep 2017 #7
An Excellent Slice Of Truth Me. Sep 2017 #8
And the worst might have been hearing Democrats dismiss her popular vote victory, pnwmom Sep 2017 #9
which was a form of gaslighting us. Madam45for2923 Sep 2017 #13
I mourn what could have been as a woman. But it also reminds me of Al Gore, John Kerry who also kerry-is-my-prez Sep 2017 #10
Hillary is good. Jim Beard Sep 2017 #11
k&r DesertRat Sep 2017 #12
K&R Scurrilous Sep 2017 #14
K&R. lunamagica Sep 2017 #15
Let's just note that this was not a random survey of the 65.8 million Jim Lane Sep 2017 #16
What's the matter? Control-Z Oct 2017 #18
Important distinction: "like the message" and "credit the message" are two different concepts. Jim Lane Oct 2017 #19
But your "distinctions" aren't important. R B Garr Oct 2017 #20
My post was not dissing Hillary. Where'd you get that? Jim Lane Oct 2017 #21
No, it looks like you picked that random 2016 poll as a way to promote the third party R B Garr Oct 2017 #23
I'm sorry, but I find your post essentially incomprehensible. Jim Lane Oct 2017 #24
Luckily, I was able to read your incomprehensible wall of words enough to see R B Garr Oct 2017 #30
She was the most qualified candidate In my lifetime! Tavarious Jackson Oct 2017 #22
Oh, well, if it's a FACT not an opinion, then that settles that. (n/t) Jim Lane Oct 2017 #25
It's rather ironic that you of all people say that. LanternWaste Oct 2017 #34
"this was not a random survey of the 65.8 million" Weekend Warrior Oct 2017 #32
It's not merely obvious from the link, it's fucking written into the headline and the story LanternWaste Oct 2017 #33
Why isn't this at the top of the greatest threads page? Control-Z Oct 2017 #17
It got lost because lots were happening at the same time. Madam45for2923 Oct 2017 #27
Truer words were never spoken. scarletlib Oct 2017 #28
And in the majority too! treestar Oct 2017 #29
K&R Gothmog Oct 2017 #31
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