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TomSlick

(12,973 posts)
28. Glib responses only work when they're accurate.
Sat Oct 21, 2017, 12:53 AM
Oct 2017

The State cannot - for want of a better word - trump the US Constitution. The Constitution gives the President - even one that is mentally incompetent - essentially unchecked pardon powers. Any legal disabilities arising from a federal conviction are removed by a presidential pardon. A state cannot impose disabilities for a federal conviction that has been the subject of a presidential pardon.

A pardon does not extend prospectively for crimes committed after the date of the pardon. So, for instance, a pardoned felon is obliged, in the appropriate circumstances to truthfully answer an official inquiry whether s/he has been convicted of a felony.

Nevertheless, a presidential pardon removes any legal disabilities from the federal conviction - any deprivation of rights that occurs as a matter of law as a result of being a felon - e.g. the right to vote, right to possess weapons, run for pubic office, etc.

As the judge rightly ruled in this case, a pardon does not change the facts - the pardoned person nevertheless committed the crime. The effect of a pardon is to remove the penalties of the crime.

There are posts in this string concerning whether a pardon would have any consequence in later civil lawsuits for the actions resulting in the conviction. That may be a matter of state law. I have - so far - been unable to find any precedent on the question. If a pardoned person pled guilty to the crime, that would be an admission against interest and presumably admissible in a subsequent civil case. If a pardon person had pled not guilty but was convicted contrary to plea, the question is murkier. I could argue either side of the case and would be happy to do so at a reasonable hourly fee.

There. Wasn't the glib answer better?

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

Sigh, well O.K. We are reduced to small victories. UTUSN Oct 2017 #1
Not so small if it prevents him from challenging Flake for Senate. Amimnoch Oct 2017 #4
Point taken in that sphere. But the substitute for ARPAIO against FLAKE will be around much longer. UTUSN Oct 2017 #5
Why in the world would that stop him from challenging Flake? former9thward Oct 2017 #21
As Horace Rumpole would have said, TomSlick Oct 2017 #2
Here, here. peequod Oct 2017 #6
Rumpole is my hero TomSlick Oct 2017 #9
Mine as well; nice quote! peequod Oct 2017 #12
This is a great thing. It means he has less of a defense when he is sued. bitterross Oct 2017 #3
Excellent point! Dustlawyer Oct 2017 #7
He is not getting sued. former9thward Oct 2017 #22
Good! SergeStorms Oct 2017 #8
Does he lose his right to vote, or to carry a firearm? EarnestPutz Oct 2017 #10
Doesn't matter whether the contempt is a felony. TomSlick Oct 2017 #11
I'm not sure about that. Jim Lane Oct 2017 #14
A federal pardon removes any disability from a federal conviction. TomSlick Oct 2017 #17
Has the issue of disabilities imposed by state law ever been litigated? Jim Lane Oct 2017 #20
It was a misdemeanor. former9thward Oct 2017 #23
As I'm fond of telling Arkansas lawyers (and judges) this issue was resolved in the 1860s. TomSlick Oct 2017 #25
Yes, I've heard of pre-emption. No, that glib response doesn't answer my question. (n/t) Jim Lane Oct 2017 #27
Glib responses only work when they're accurate. TomSlick Oct 2017 #28
Long or short, it's still all just assertions. Jim Lane Oct 2017 #30
I think I agree about the effect of the conviction and pardon in civil litigation. TomSlick Oct 2017 #32
I'm not getting that from the article. Amimnoch Oct 2017 #15
See Reply #17. TomSlick Oct 2017 #18
No, no and no. former9thward Oct 2017 #24
I haven't researched TomSlick Oct 2017 #26
The judge did not toss it from his record. He's still got a conviction. kcr Oct 2017 #29
Nope. former9thward Oct 2017 #31
The article you cite is loosely (and inaccurately) worded Jim Lane Oct 2017 #33
I agree with your summary. former9thward Oct 2017 #34
You raise a good question about why Arpaio cares. Jim Lane Oct 2017 #35
STFU and sit your tired ass down, ex-sherriff. oasis Oct 2017 #13
Sheriff Joe is a crook Gothmog Oct 2017 #16
You can't be pardoned for nothing, Sheriff Dumbfuck. Iggo Oct 2017 #19
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