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Tom Rinaldo

(23,179 posts)
54. Here is what I actually wrote
Mon Nov 6, 2017, 10:50 PM
Nov 2017

"I predict that if the Democratic Party fails to find a way of weaning itself from the teets of well heeled donors for political sustenance - it will continue to be viewed with suspicion, if not actual hostility, by an increasing plurality of Americans."

Here is what you wrote:

"Your suggestion to eliminate contributions from rich contributors because enforcing regulations is too difficult penalizes honest contributors because they will be eliminated while dishonest people like the Koch brothers and Wilbur Ross will simply find new avenues of subterfuge.

While there is a basis for regulating and making contributions more transparent there is no constitutionally acceptable way of eliminating it as you wish so its really a waste of time to discuss it."

Nowhere did I suggest seeking unconstitutional measures to eliminate the ability of rich contributors from making political contributions. I did suggest that if the Democratic Party becomes associated with, in the eyes of large sections of the public mind, being overly solicitous to the concerns of the wealthiest sector of our society - that it would ultimately be detrimental to our electoral prospects.

In fact I am puzzled by your choice of words here:

"...because enforcing regulations is too difficult penalizes honest contributors because they will be eliminated while dishonest people like the Koch brothers and Wilbur Ross will simply find new avenues of subterfuge."

Where did I write that enforcing regulations should not be attempted due to excessive difficulty doing so? Your comment sounds like an argument made by the NRA regarding "gun control" - there's nothing wrong with our regulations about guns - we don't need to tighten anything - just enforce the laws on the books and everything will be fine. If guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns etc.

And it is the platform of the Democratic Party to seek a constitutional amendment to over ride Citizens United. That would be a constitutional remedy to the Citizens United ruling that four SC Justices and many legal observers believe was contrary to our Constitution. But even leaving all of that aside. I posited a problem that will soon be inflamed in the realm of politics when the public becomes more familiar with the contents of the Paradise Papers. There are political ways to respond to that potential problem. One is to attempt to position the Democratic Party so as to be less dependent of mega donors for survival. That can be pursued in many ways, most of which would not involve having to forbid anything, just reorienting our efforts, close associations and priorities.

You have taken what I wrote and spun it into a political thriller beyond recognition. It's almost like you suppose that my next post will likely propose mandatory political reeducation camps for everyone with wealth exceeding six figures. I see a problem on the horizon, yes I do. I think we need to look at ways to address it, that is true. That is what I proposed discussing. There are many options potentially available to mitigate against what I was warning about. They include options as non threatening to the rights of progressive wealthy donors as finding and expanding other funding streams that make it easier for Democrats to pick and choose more carefully who we seek to aggressively court for major contributions.

If you don't see any risk associated with the status quo for Democrats it makes sense to me that you see no need to explore how it can be altered to reduce that political risk. If you do, however, then that is a topic I hoped to calmly explore by posting the above piece.




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Post removed Post removed Nov 2017 #1
Agreed. Regardless of whether one thinks it's a good or bad idea for him to run for President again Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #4
Why do you think that he refuses? (nt) ehrnst Nov 2017 #39
I guess the removed post asked why Bernie hasn't released his tax returns. yardwork Nov 2017 #51
I am fairly certain of it.. disillusioned73 Nov 2017 #68
Actually, I think that it's weird that he refuses to release his tax returns. yardwork Nov 2017 #70
Well.. disillusioned73 Nov 2017 #71
If it's income tax returns being spoken about, many trusted that he'd do so in the last campaign.... George II Nov 2017 #86
Right. He couldn't make an issue of DT's unwillingness since he wasn't doing it either. n/t pnwmom Nov 2017 #11
This is a good post RhodeIslandOne Nov 2017 #2
Ditto iluvtennis Nov 2017 #23
The dems are partly responsible for the fact that the GOP has their boot on our neck. CrispyQ Nov 2017 #73
excellent piece MaryMagdaline Nov 2017 #3
The first step is always reaching a consensus about the need to do so. Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #5
And in the meantime, how do we replace the union dollars that sustained us in the past? ehrnst Nov 2017 #40
Just some thoughts Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #42
So why aren't these organizations a source of $$ for the DNC now? ehrnst Nov 2017 #44
Well, I'm a straight white male working in the Democratic Party Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #46
I believe the number of people identifying with a party has fallen ehrnst Nov 2017 #48
For the record - you have changed the conversation from what I wrote about in the OP Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #50
Not likely to happen, but marylandblue Nov 2017 #6
When you say dark money ehrnst Nov 2017 #45
Also, in addition to what marylandblue wrote... Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #7
It's not always easy to tell what is grassroots and what is propaganda anymore. ehrnst Nov 2017 #41
Great narrative. Thanks. n/t SpankMe Nov 2017 #8
The share of Millennials who identify as independent is up eight points since 2008. progressoid Nov 2017 #9
Independents in primaries MaryMagdaline Nov 2017 #24
I chair our local Democratic Committee, and that is my experience also Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #25
Same here. progressoid Nov 2017 #28
I don't think that's unusual historically... llmart Nov 2017 #64
The movement away from Party identification toward Independent status perhaps... Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #77
I know several Independents. All they want to do is vote when it is time. They don't want to work coolsandy Nov 2017 #80
Don't they need progress in the future? treestar Nov 2017 #60
A well thought out post. Thank you. GoneOffShore Nov 2017 #10
Post removed Post removed Nov 2017 #12
I guess that's partial vindication for the subject line anyway Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #15
Sanders was good as a diagnostician grantcart Nov 2017 #13
I love true public service from the ranks of the well connected Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #16
Actually it used to be that clever and earnest people strove to wealth so they could give their time grantcart Nov 2017 #38
There is never a shortage of ways in which those with wealth can use it for social good. Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #43
Your suggestion to eliminate contributions from rich contributors because enforcing regulations is grantcart Nov 2017 #53
Here is what I actually wrote Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #54
Bad analogy.. whathehell Nov 2017 #63
"turn up the heat in the hotel light bulbs"? Really. How did they do that? George II Nov 2017 #84
You would have to ask The Chicago Tribune.. whathehell Nov 2017 #89
I agree. When someone outside our party joet67 Nov 2017 #14
money is power Hamlette Nov 2017 #17
The only thing I will say... Adrahil Nov 2017 #18
Our brand name is the forest Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #19
"I thought maybe I could get most everyone here upset with me" B2G Nov 2017 #20
LOL Clearly this wasn't my most productive exercise in my regard Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #22
great post bluestarone Nov 2017 #21
I enjoyed reading this but don't think your last paragraph.... NCTraveler Nov 2017 #26
True Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #31
Again, proven appearances. NCTraveler Nov 2017 #35
Marta & I.... Omaha Steve Nov 2017 #27
World's 8 richest men are worth as much as 3.6 billion people. jalan48 Nov 2017 #29
Maybe the answer is NOT to wean the policital parties off big money. Instead... Binkie The Clown Nov 2017 #30
Under centrism perhaps, as compared to hard right wing policies Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #32
Money corrupts hueymahl Nov 2017 #33
Wash, rinse, repeat, wash, rinse, repeat. Yup -- the Dems' policies bail the country out and then Ukapau Nov 2017 #37
That is at least an idea treestar Nov 2017 #62
This is a good post. Of course, I'm the quintessential idealist. PatrickforO Nov 2017 #34
We have to get rid of Citizens United first. LisaM Nov 2017 #36
Unilateral disarmament is not a winning strategy Progressive dog Nov 2017 #47
Well we simply disagree then Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #49
If the "weaning" is unilateral Progressive dog Nov 2017 #88
The fix is to shorten the political season to just the election year. Persondem Nov 2017 #52
I wholeheartedly agree with you in principle blue-wave Nov 2017 #55
Thank you and couldn't agree more Boomer Nov 2017 #56
I don't think it's news, or new, that money controls things in a country. Any country. Honeycombe8 Nov 2017 #57
Had the Dems not sat back while they saw unions dying & jobs being offshored whathehell Nov 2017 #58
How come the Republican party can do it? treestar Nov 2017 #59
Well Said! jimlup Nov 2017 #61
Bernie and Trump talked about similar things, which is why I kept saying Trump would win adigal Nov 2017 #65
Yes but this cuts to the core of everything we buy bucolic_frolic Nov 2017 #66
You wrote as though Trusts never form to distort pure market forces Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #74
Once again, this clip sums it up BumRushDaShow Nov 2017 #67
K&R.. great post disillusioned73 Nov 2017 #69
Just heard Van Jones zentrum Nov 2017 #72
Then Bernie should start in his own state of Vermont frazzled Nov 2017 #75
I don't believe in sacred cows when it comes to politics Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #76
I thought the issue was the Paradise Papers and the hiding of wealth frazzled Nov 2017 #78
It transcends individual political leaders and whatever shortcomings they might have. Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #79
I think you did frazzled Nov 2017 #81
Readers, like everything else, vary Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #82
For what its worth, to me the OP's purpose was not to deify Sanders. LiberalLovinLug Nov 2017 #87
With the Koch brothers and other deep pocketed contributors pouring hundreds of millions... George II Nov 2017 #83
Read through the replies, it has already been subject to a fair amount of discussion. n/t Tom Rinaldo Nov 2017 #85
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