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still_one

(98,883 posts)

139. Intellecually I agree with you, but that is going to be up to the accusers, and if they don't come

Wed Nov 22, 2017, 10:13 PM

Nov 2017

forward, then there will be some who will call for Franken to resign, and for the reasons I stated, I hope he doesn't, until at least 2018, and hopefully 2020, to at least give us a chance to take back the Senate and prevent another Gorsuch disaster.

The other thing that would be nice is for Franken to come out and say something to these charges. Yes, I know he called for an ethics investigation from Congress, but that isn't going to happen, because I suspect there are too many Congress people worried about opening that bag of worms, so it would be nice and addressed it, and if he engaged in such behavior I still don't want him to resign unless it can be guaranteed that a Democrat can fill that seat, and I am not sure that can be guaranteed if there are calls for a special election in Minnesota

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Franken: Accusers 3 and 4. [View all] VermontKevin Nov 2017 OP

Franken is in trouble BeyondGeography Nov 2017 #1

Yeah. I would say that. One accuser performs in a feminist choir. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #4

Sorry...you either say who you are or you shut the fuck up...righties no doubt...I don't believe it Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #76

I guess the feminist choir member is a rightie? VermontKevin Nov 2017 #87

I have no interest in anonymous sourced period end of story...come forward or shut up. Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #112

This hadEnuf Nov 2017 #151

The right to face your accuser leftynyc Nov 2017 #157

Well, Franken can sue. He will lose, but he can sue. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #164

I'm making no judgement leftynyc Nov 2017 #172

Does that really matter? pscot Nov 2017 #246

Yes most likely and the staring at the chest comments sound like 7th grade. We can't Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #196

Im with you. cwydro Nov 2017 #180

I am sure you apply that standard to anonymous whistleblowers, too. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #187

I don't believe anonymous whistle blowers unless it is backed up in someway. Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #194

Well, here you have backup. Someone did go on record. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #198

You apparently are heavily invested in Franken resigning, Denzil_DC Nov 2017 #200

I think it's true. And I think there will be more women. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #202

You "think" and you "think". Denzil_DC Nov 2017 #204

No, it's entirely possible there will not be an ethics investigation because of the Senate rules. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #206

You declared at least twice downthread that there wouldn't be, among your frantic posts on this. Denzil_DC Nov 2017 #212

Like I said, we have to see how the Senate investigation plays out. But I don't think there will be VermontKevin Nov 2017 #226

Then wait! Denzil_DC Nov 2017 #228

Please, let the star chamber know I'm eager to greet them. I assume it includes the VermontKevin Nov 2017 #229

Oh that would be telling ... Denzil_DC Nov 2017 #230

Fortunately, this story isn't about what you think. L. Coyote Nov 2017 #223

There is an agenda here on this board, you see it, I see it, but I bet if we point Eliot Rosewater Nov 2017 #254

You are correct. Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #265

What is a feminist choir? cwydro Nov 2017 #184

I assume they are talking about a choir like these ones: VermontKevin Nov 2017 #186

Not good, that's for sure... Trump should be made to resign first though. InAbLuEsTaTe Nov 2017 #233

Read the whole article standingtall Nov 2017 #2

One performs in a feminist choir. The other was a 21 year old WOC. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #6

Not good... ugghhh. InAbLuEsTaTe Nov 2017 #89

They are anonymous accusers? If so they can not be credible by definition. Fred Sanders Nov 2017 #8

Yes they are annonymous standingtall Nov 2017 #13

Anonymous accusers can be very credible. One accuser told the reporter contemporaneously. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #21

Odd that the reporter didn't report it. brush Nov 2017 #34

At the time the accuser did not wish him to. He apparently respected the wishes of VermontKevin Nov 2017 #39

They can at least have the reported come out to verify te story without having them be identified. still_one Nov 2017 #62

In law, anonymous information by an uncorroborated previously untested source is inadmissible. Fred Sanders Nov 2017 #36

Funny how Roy Moore supporters say the same thing brooklynite Nov 2017 #48

Hubris. John Edwards helped get Bush elected. So few want to VermontKevin Nov 2017 #57

How did John Edwards help get Bush elected? eom Control-Z Nov 2017 #85

Uhm, what?. Raine1967 Nov 2017 #146

None of Moore's 6 accusers is anonymous. Their accounts can at least be checked out and Fred Sanders Nov 2017 #59

Absolutely right. There is no reason for them not to come out. They would be supported, especially still_one Nov 2017 #98

Take a look at this thread. You think they would be supported here? VermontKevin Nov 2017 #165

yeah I do. Their anonymity is the motive behind the skepticism by some in this thread. still_one Nov 2017 #174

I am sure that every poster expressing concern about assault victims wishing to remain anonymous VermontKevin Nov 2017 #175

Don't we know who all the Trump accusers are? It doesn't doc03 Nov 2017 #107

Not true. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #49

I do not know the public trial standards of evidence. Fred Sanders Nov 2017 #61

There are no actual standards for a public trial. LisaL Nov 2017 #72

Well, apply Moore and Trump to our side. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #73

You didnt need to, because several Moore accusers declared publicly spooky3 Nov 2017 #138

The sixth amendment applies leftynyc Nov 2017 #159

Actually, you're not. Ms. Toad Nov 2017 #252

I don't believe it for even a minute...anonymous righties. Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #80

Who sing in a feminist choir? A 21 year old WOC who told a reporter of the piece at the time? VermontKevin Nov 2017 #83

What kind of choir is she singing in now 10 years later is more relevant. Fred Sanders Nov 2017 #95

Thank you...anonymous for a reason...righties. Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #115

Indeed! ChubbyStar Nov 2017 #122

Sound like bullshit to me...and 'he stared at the chest' stuff is junior high. Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #264

It is simple for me, if Franken says he did it, he did it. If he says no, then no it is. Eliot Rosewater Nov 2017 #257

If legit I can't blame them for not revealing their identity madville Nov 2017 #22

In this climate I don't Brainstormy Nov 2017 #38

You want to put your butt on the line and ruin the reputation of a public figure then say so Fred Sanders Nov 2017 #51

Why didn't he just say I never grabbed a women's ass? njhoneybadger Nov 2017 #103

Because Dems are concerned that women are dismissed as spooky3 Nov 2017 #142

Any women alive could make that claim anonymously even if she never was doc03 Nov 2017 #104

Exactly right or if they are being paid as well. Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #86

That's bad. Very disappointing. Vinca Nov 2017 #3

It should all be part of the investigation JI7 Nov 2017 #5

There isn't going to be one. My prediction. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #11

Nothing good will come of this. TheCowsCameHome Nov 2017 #7

So democrats pay the price. LisaL Nov 2017 #10

We probably will. nycbos Nov 2017 #19

We will be better. LisaL Nov 2017 #37

How can we as Democrats claim to be advocates for woman... nycbos Nov 2017 #94

How can we take anything back if we are going to demand people resign LisaL Nov 2017 #105

Lisa, Blue_true Nov 2017 #109

And in 2018, that person would have to run for re-election. LisaL Nov 2017 #128

With in inside track advantage. If Franken stays, we lose that advantage. nt Blue_true Nov 2017 #133

Governor Dayton is up for election in 2018 FBaggins Nov 2017 #236

And then one more vote for their ruinous tax plan. alarimer Nov 2017 #131

And we can bask in our moral superiority while the GOP controls the government. The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2017 #91

How can we claim to advocates to women if we tolerate sexual harassment. nycbos Nov 2017 #96

Depends on what you mean by "tolerate." The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2017 #102

👏🏾. + a zillion. n/t BlancheSplanchnik Nov 2017 #153

Couldn't agree MORE with you on your comment. LenaBaby61 Nov 2017 #163

First-- I don't think he should resign... dawg day Nov 2017 #249

OH yeah thatll do the trick BannonsLiver Nov 2017 #154

Yes, if Moore wins, think of the 2018 and 2020 campaign ads!! InAbLuEsTaTe Nov 2017 #237

That's the way is usually works these days, TheCowsCameHome Nov 2017 #25

I don't care... FarPoint Nov 2017 #9

If it was your daughters butt you would care BeyondGeography Nov 2017 #15

Not the issue... FarPoint Nov 2017 #29

For Roy Moore and Donald Trump too ClarendonDem Nov 2017 #35

Both of them will stay on their mark. FarPoint Nov 2017 #42

Fair enough ClarendonDem Nov 2017 #52

What we believe or don't believe isn't changing anything. LisaL Nov 2017 #119

Moore is entitled to represent his constituency if he wins. Loki Liesmith Nov 2017 #137

He/she True Dough Nov 2017 #30

I don't believe any of it...and anonymous...sorry that is bullshit. Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #78

I would say:take your hand off my butt. delisen Nov 2017 #79

Awesome BeyondGeography Nov 2017 #82

Actually my intent would be to help him delisen Nov 2017 #100

If it was *my own* butt I'd be annoyed and creeped out, but The Velveteen Ocelot Nov 2017 #92

Right highmindedhavi Nov 2017 #136

If we start talking about the political identity of the accuser... nycbos Nov 2017 #12

I agree. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #17

anonymoust accusations have no value or credibility nt msongs Nov 2017 #20

If an anonymous accuser said that a Republican Senator assaulted her... nycbos Nov 2017 #24

We might believe her, but Republicans would still vote for him. LisaL Nov 2017 #31

If I'm going to accuse someone of something that can affect blueinredohio Nov 2017 #40

"The balls?" Wow. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #75

If it was butt fondling 10 years ago and you say so anonymously, no, that is not credible Fred Sanders Nov 2017 #45

I do not accept anonymous accusers of anything, and not during a heated political atmosphere. Fred Sanders Nov 2017 #23

I totally agree. FarPoint Nov 2017 #44

Ive said that over and over and been attacked for it Lee-Lee Nov 2017 #231

Im still in his corner. Eom BootinUp Nov 2017 #14

Anonymous accusers...of butt fondling...because they are incapable of ignoring online chatter Fred Sanders Nov 2017 #26

I also factor in my observations of his BootinUp Nov 2017 #33

Me too. nt greyl Nov 2017 #90

again i'll bluestarone Nov 2017 #16

I'm with you. I'll wait for the investigation. It's too easy to say and anonymous accuser said... brush Nov 2017 #43

Shit. Just shit. trof Nov 2017 #18

Each woman spoke about different standards then delisen Nov 2017 #27

I don't think there will be one. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #32

Why do you think there won't be one? delisen Nov 2017 #60

One, two, three, four...time to show Franken the door. 4139 Nov 2017 #28

I was prepared for this from accuser #1 True Dough Nov 2017 #41

Iceberg effect on some behavior. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #53

Yes, he never denied it. pintobean Nov 2017 #106

There are a number of problems here. Eyeball_Kid Nov 2017 #221

Let's add to that list of problems True Dough Nov 2017 #242

This message was self-deleted by its author applegrove Nov 2017 #46

Anon accusers? Fuck that shit. This is nothing more than a witchhunt Ferrets are Cool Nov 2017 #47

Let this be a lesson to all men. saidsimplesimon Nov 2017 #50

Franken called for an ethics investigation. Let's hope this puts us closer to that, or he will be... Tarheel_Dem Nov 2017 #54

Al knows if he has been groping women BeyondGeography Nov 2017 #67

This message was self-deleted by its author njhoneybadger Nov 2017 #108

Politics is rough u may have to suffer BootinUp Nov 2017 #113

U r so wise BeyondGeography Nov 2017 #121

I will believe the accusations of a Democrat or a progressive on this, but DAMIT, I want them still_one Nov 2017 #55

Roth corroborated it. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #58

Who? What? BootinUp Nov 2017 #63

1 of the reporters on the story corroborated that 1 of the accusers told him at the time. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #69

Dont know him from Adam. Nt BootinUp Nov 2017 #74

He has no credibility with me....the accusers come forward or he shuts up and so do they...ten years Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #117

If you say so? Fred Sanders Nov 2017 #64

I can't make you read the article. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #65

People can read the article, but may not NOTICE that Roth is one of the authors. You need to point still_one Nov 2017 #68

Ah. I see. Thank you. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #71

I just saw that Roth is one of the contributors to the HuffintonPost article. still_one Nov 2017 #66

But anonymous accusations? LisaL Nov 2017 #70

I don't like that either. If they are Democrats or liberals as they maintain, with all the still_one Nov 2017 #77

This isn't some right-wing clickbait crap madville Nov 2017 #81

I never said they were right wing. I do think they should come out, and forget about the still_one Nov 2017 #93

Sorry I didn't phrase it right madville Nov 2017 #99

Roth is a progressive journalist, and that definitely gives credibility to the incident. Franken is still_one Nov 2017 #110

No it doesn't...the accusers come forward or they don't...why should I believe Roth who maybe has Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #118

Intellecually I agree with you, but that is going to be up to the accusers, and if they don't come still_one Nov 2017 #139

Well he shouldn't resign ...because giving the GOP a win on this will make them double Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #177

We are essentially on the same page Demsrule86, and in my view that is regardless of whether the still_one Nov 2017 #213

I agree...and the accusations are nothing...I can't even believe anyone would take them Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #266

Damn it.......was just thinking its been two days since the last woman came forward...... a kennedy Nov 2017 #56

A big who cares... I would not allow the Gop to lead me around by the nose. Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #84

and seriously, how many women can they pay off to keep saying this stuff??? a kennedy Nov 2017 #155

They have lots of money and will stop at nothing to retain power. Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #176

Oh fuck! potone Nov 2017 #88

This makes me so sad and so disappointed. MerryBlooms Nov 2017 #97

Why do people feel that they have a right to touch or say inappropriate stuff to Blue_true Nov 2017 #101

I think of them pretend the person isn't unwilling. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #111

Could be. Still Franken is always going to be a special case. ucrdem Nov 2017 #116

You suggested following someone into the bathroom? VermontKevin Nov 2017 #120

That sounds like it was meant to be a joke. ucrdem Nov 2017 #123

Read the article more carefully. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #125

Will do. ucrdem Nov 2017 #127

I noticed that "both women have been telling them privately for years." ucrdem Nov 2017 #141

Two things might be true at the same time: VermontKevin Nov 2017 #168

It sounds like somebody searched FB for scandal on Franken ucrdem Nov 2017 #207

Except that the reporter is stating the 4th accuser told him about the incident long ago. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #208

Sounds like a pro with a rolodex. And Huffpo is not exactly the gold standard of journalism. ucrdem Nov 2017 #210

Be gentle with him. Denzil_DC Nov 2017 #216

LOL. ucrdem Nov 2017 #217

Yes, at this stage, you have to laugh, don't you! Denzil_DC Nov 2017 #218

Please take your own advice. He denied saying that. spooky3 Nov 2017 #158

Well, yeah. I don't expect someone to own up to such behavior. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #166

Especially if he didnt do it. spooky3 Nov 2017 #170

I think Franken is toast Raine Nov 2017 #114

If we do this than we are stupid...the GOP will keep coming...if they see we hit back hard and Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #124

That's what I am thinking. LisaL Nov 2017 #129

No one will be safe...and the GOP can't be brought down with accusations of pedophilia so how is Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #178

Anonymous liars alarimer Nov 2017 #126

If he resigns riverwalker Nov 2017 #130

I guess it will have to be someone who doesn't dare trip up Jeff Sessions RhodeIslandOne Nov 2017 #134

Franken: "I can categorically say that I did not proposition anyone to join me in any bathroom." moriah Nov 2017 #132

Well a Vermont person can't vote in Minnesota. So your opinion doesn't count for much. Thor_MN Nov 2017 #135

My posts on Trump and Moore are easily accessible. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #140

Funny, "VermontKevin Trump resign" should bring up one of those easily accessible posts Thor_MN Nov 2017 #145

Oh lordy, why would you think I voted for Trump? I voted HRC, primary and general. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #147

I didn't say you did, but I assume, if you are a US citizen, that you are old enough to have voted Thor_MN Nov 2017 #148

Thank you. cwydro Nov 2017 #240

The "easily accessible" posts are non-existent... Thor_MN Nov 2017 #244

I am going to suggest a very thoughtful article to you: VermontKevin Nov 2017 #248

Wasn't talking to you. Your opinions are have no bearing on Franken's office. Thor_MN Nov 2017 #253

I searched too. cwydro Nov 2017 #256

Here's a bombshell for you: Kingofalldems Nov 2017 #150

Thor just dropped a VIKING hammer ChubbyStar Nov 2017 #143

Bang! Zoom! Kingofalldems Nov 2017 #149

Its interesting.... Docreed2003 Nov 2017 #160

With currents events, Thor_MN Nov 2017 #211

These "Scandals" sourced/fueled by Kremlin / alt-right american_ideals Nov 2017 #144

THEY are among us. Reading through this thread makes it clear. BannonsLiver Nov 2017 #156

No shit right?? Docreed2003 Nov 2017 #161

While we run around worrying about this liberal_patriot_md Nov 2017 #152

Such utter unprovable tripe from anonymous accusers. Can't OnDoutside Nov 2017 #162

Jeremy Piven runtel Nov 2017 #167

He could sue Huffpo. We will have to see what happens. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #169

Why are you so determined to argue with anyone spooky3 Nov 2017 #171

Not believing this round of accusers indicates textbook actual malice at play: VermontKevin Nov 2017 #173

Believing this round of accusers without evidence indicates textbook actual malice at play. Denzil_DC Nov 2017 #220

The point of my post went over your head. If Franken knows this story to be false, he's got a VermontKevin Nov 2017 #243

You seem very, VERY keen to tie Franken up in knots for the foreseeable future. Denzil_DC Nov 2017 #247

You never answered my question upthread. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #250

Dude. Denzil_DC Nov 2017 #251

You keep replying to my posts. And I don't owe you any answers. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #255

You keep replying to mine. You keep asking questions. Denzil_DC Nov 2017 #258

A cat can look at a king. You are free to do as you wish. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #260

Now, that's weak. Denzil_DC Nov 2017 #261

A butt grab? An invite to a bathroom? underthematrix Nov 2017 #179

It was a butt pat riverwalker Nov 2017 #181

I agree about the severity of the offense. The pattern is more troubling. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #189

You seem to have it in for Franken. cwydro Nov 2017 #182

You forgot 'annonymous'....and probably will eventually need to add ...the term 'not Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #183

I refer you to this: VermontKevin Nov 2017 #185

Nice apple and oranges...but those anonymous sources were eventually corroborated... Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #197

And this is corroborated. Your theory rests on the assertion that this guy is lying: VermontKevin Nov 2017 #201

That's not "corroboration", no matter how often you post it. Denzil_DC Nov 2017 #203

I'm applying Occam's Razor to this: VermontKevin Nov 2017 #205

I'd put that razor down. Denzil_DC Nov 2017 #215

It has not been corroborated...and I would be careful if I were you about attacking a Demsrule86 Nov 2017 #268

Heres my problem with all of this... TCJ70 Nov 2017 #188

I agree. But in this case, the reporter himself would have to be outright lying, as one of the VermontKevin Nov 2017 #190

OK. Every time an anonymous person alleges Franken touched their butt, Denzil_DC Nov 2017 #222

Well, show me where Franken denied the butt touching. As another poster pointed out, VermontKevin Nov 2017 #225

See my post you replied to. Denzil_DC Nov 2017 #227

Again, can you quote Franken where he denied the physical contact? VermontKevin Nov 2017 #232

Why do I need to? Denzil_DC Nov 2017 #245

"Its also a little odd to me that Franken apparently waits for a photos to do something. bagelsforbreakfast Nov 2017 #209

Seriously, what better way to hide your... TCJ70 Nov 2017 #219

The man's an evil genius! Denzil_DC Nov 2017 #224

First Trump resigns... then we talk about this. Not before. (n/t) FreepFryer Nov 2017 #191

Well, I think we can multitask. There's no reason justice should depend on Trump, is there? VermontKevin Nov 2017 #192

Multitask but triage. Trump is first, then Franken. FreepFryer Nov 2017 #193

Well, I don't agree. The Senate investigation will proceed. But in the meantime, the Senator VermontKevin Nov 2017 #195

Great. For Americans, these are more important: North Korea, Russiagate, Cultivated Racism FreepFryer Nov 2017 #199

There will be an investigation. aintitfunny Nov 2017 #214

I remember what the (GOP) did to John Kerry a Purple Heart veteran katmondoo Nov 2017 #234

That does it. No more defenses of Sen Franken from me. nt stevenleser Nov 2017 #235

Steve, you are on Twitter. Some audio was released last night. I won't link it. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #238

Too disappointed to even look into this further. On a brighter note, I am in Vermont for stevenleser Nov 2017 #239

Oh, we already went South for the winter. I feel the cold too much in my bones. VermontKevin Nov 2017 #241

This message was self-deleted by its author kcr Nov 2017 #269

This is a Republican hit job ollie10 Nov 2017 #259

Guess we need Priests as candidates to ensure no impropriety . . . . Oh wait, that won't work. Hoyt Nov 2017 #262

No one should resign until the head OhZone Nov 2017 #263

Well I suggest that you suggest that Groper Don the Con resign first malaise Nov 2017 #267