General Discussion

kooljerk666

(776 posts)

70. I used to be NRA also........

Sat Jul 21, 2012, 02:11 PM

Jul 2012

In The Gravest Extrememe, by Massad Ayoob was the definitive guide to combat hand gunning. In the 80's the average gun battle was less than 3 shots.

My understanding was after glock & other large ammo capacity pistol gained popularity cops switched from .357 mag revolvers to 9mm 18 shot glock & others.

9mm proved so weak look what happened..........

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1986_FBI_Miami_shootout

If cops/FBI had existing 1911 .45 acp or 357 revolver they would not have had so many killed.

Large capacity pistols more than 7 shot .45 are useless unless u are attacked by a pack of bunnies. The 10mm & 40 cal are not as powerful as the .45 & 9mm is good for stuff 5 pounds or less.

I am about 30 years out of date, but an m1 garand rifle & and .45 acp is all the fire power any one needs.

The .357 magnum revolver, over 80% fatal w/ 1 shot.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.357_Magnum#Performance
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M1_Garand
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colt_.45_Pistol

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As a gun owner and a former member of the NRA I have arrived at the opinion that there should be [View all] doc03 Jul 2012 OP

Well JeepJK556 Jul 2012 #1

The police have reason to carry a larger capacity magazine nobody else doc03 Jul 2012 #3

They do? obxhead Jul 2012 #9

Do me a favor nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #11

And you've just made the case that >5 round mags are reasonable for self-defense purposes aikoaiko Jul 2012 #65

Yes, and nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #67

and....? aikoaiko Jul 2012 #84

Bingo! We have a winner! A COP should be able to take a perp out with 5 rounds but doc03 Jul 2012 #100

Did you see the greater symbol? aikoaiko Jul 2012 #102

Cops have backup. Private citizens do not. Kennah Jul 2012 #122

Wow as a gun owner and former NRA memeber you should know Trunk Monkey Jul 2012 #127

Maximum of 10-15 round magazines for handguns. Five ought to be the limit for long guns. Kaleva Jul 2012 #134

So in most cases, brandishing a convincing replica of a gun would suffice to repel an assailant -- klook Jul 2012 #152

History. You should learn some. jeff47 Jul 2012 #135

You make my point obxhead Jul 2012 #137

You should actually read this time jeff47 Jul 2012 #138

yeah I read that. obxhead Jul 2012 #140

Yes, it was only the money. It's not like there were already several victims jeff47 Jul 2012 #141

My precious guns? obxhead Jul 2012 #142

The police carry standard capacity mags for self-defense and defense of others... aikoaiko Jul 2012 #64

Hmm you realize a 19 rounder nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #69

yes, I do. The 10 round limit is not standard -- it is a reduce capacity for most full size handguns aikoaiko Jul 2012 #82

Police officers were exempted, but you knew that nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #6

Thank you for your concern. nt valerief Jul 2012 #10

no, not the police...way to pounce with the straw men! CreekDog Jul 2012 #18

Hurry!!! Hurry!!! Look over here!!! n/t A Simple Game Jul 2012 #43

That is asinine. Heck, police have to arm up and be more cautious with all the gunners carrying. Hoyt Jul 2012 #53

I used to be NRA also........ kooljerk666 Jul 2012 #70

So the goal is to outgun the police? Spitfire of ATJ Jul 2012 #90

No. JeepJK556 Jul 2012 #104

So which is it, are you a really bad shot or do you figure on being rushed by a bakers dozen? Spitfire of ATJ Jul 2012 #107

People like this dream of ATF shootouts Scootaloo Jul 2012 #126

Bigoted much? rl6214 Jul 2012 #128

Yes, gun nuts generally are. Scootaloo Jul 2012 #132

Ruby Ridge Revenge using Micheal Savage's head shots. Spitfire of ATJ Jul 2012 #131

As soon as you convince the criminals to obey permatex Jul 2012 #2

Holmes wasn't a criminal he purchased everything legally n/t doc03 Jul 2012 #4

So by that standard permatex Jul 2012 #5

Question, very seriously... nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #8

I've been wrestling with that one permatex Jul 2012 #12

Seriously, what is it's use? nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #15

I can name one permatex Jul 2012 #22

Noise pollution? Zoeisright Jul 2012 #28

Then why does Norway require them for hunting? permatex Jul 2012 #33

Read that wiki article - nowhere does it say that Norway requires GoneOffShore Jul 2012 #98

Whers's the proof that my statement was absurd? permatex Jul 2012 #59

you need the flash suppressor for light pollution too dionysus Jul 2012 #92

No I am not nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #31

Norway, Finland, France all use them for hunting permatex Jul 2012 #34

You are confusing a long arm? nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #36

They can be used for handgun hunting also permatex Jul 2012 #40

Actually those stats matter nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #44

I'm confused permatex Jul 2012 #52

It is part of the culture nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #54

We can agree to diagree and still be civil about it. permatex Jul 2012 #56

Yup nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #58

The suppressor thingy was something injected in the doc03 Jul 2012 #103

"There is a direct correlation between how strict or not gun ownership laws are, and death rates" EX500rider Jul 2012 #124

Can't find a particular reference to using suppressors for hunting in those countries. GoneOffShore Jul 2012 #99

I stand corrected permatex Jul 2012 #123

Your reason for allowing 100 shot mags would A Simple Game Jul 2012 #48

Bullseye course of fire - 5 rounds in twenty seconds and 5 rounds in ten seconds. geckosfeet Jul 2012 #62

1 round per second? Electric Monk Jul 2012 #119

Are you aware that this is an NFA weapon Trunk Monkey Jul 2012 #130

Silencers protect the hearing of the shooter and other shooters around them rl6214 Jul 2012 #129

Another serious question: How many crimes are committed with 100-round magazines? Atypical Liberal Jul 2012 #13

So you are seriously suggesting nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #17

Where did I suggest that a 100-round magazine belongs everywhere? Atypical Liberal Jul 2012 #29

Actually this is bringing how unreasonable nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #32

I think banning things that are hardly ever used in crimes is unreasonable. Atypical Liberal Jul 2012 #76

Actually they do nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #77

I'm sure you can provide some data to back up your assertion. Atypical Liberal Jul 2012 #88

Pay attention, that MCI incidents nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #89

What is an MCI incident? Atypical Liberal Jul 2012 #91

Mass Casualty Incident nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #93

The poster you are replying to never sees the need to back up their assertions. zappaman Jul 2012 #139

I see that. Atypical Liberal Jul 2012 #147

After just a quick search I could not find a number for how A Simple Game Jul 2012 #50

Check the FBI UCR Atypical Liberal Jul 2012 #78

I can name one, it just happened two days ago a nut case was capable of gunning doc03 Jul 2012 #105

Why don't we ask people struck by lightning what they think about it? Atypical Liberal Jul 2012 #144

I asked that question to a gun owner (my SO) azurnoir Jul 2012 #21

For fun target shooting. nt Mojorabbit Jul 2012 #63

Damn that's a bad shot in my opinion nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #66

I am a great shot. It is for fun. Mojorabbit Jul 2012 #71

Glad you do, and glad it would not bother you. nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #73

I too am a gun owner evilhime Jul 2012 #14

if they need a 100 round mag for hunting, they are a danger to everyone CreekDog Jul 2012 #19

Yeah permatex Jul 2012 #25

When I was a kid my dad gave me a single shot rifle and that taought me to make the first doc03 Jul 2012 #109

Excuse me ... bayareaboy Jul 2012 #16

You have it all backward Motown_Johnny Jul 2012 #24

W did not allow the AWB to expire permatex Jul 2012 #30

it banned high capacity magazines like the 100 round one the shooter used Motown_Johnny Jul 2012 #85

Wrong permatex Jul 2012 #86

It banned the manufacture of these, yes. Motown_Johnny Jul 2012 #95

During the "ban" both AR-15 rifles and high capacity magazines were available ... spin Jul 2012 #113

So there can be no reason to oppose reinstating the ban Motown_Johnny Jul 2012 #117

Actually there are at least two ... spin Jul 2012 #120

So banning weapons increases their sales.. and tax cuts increase revenues too! Motown_Johnny Jul 2012 #121

You are ignoring the fact that many Democrats own firearms and support RKBA ... spin Jul 2012 #125

I'm not ignoring it, I just don't think they are one issue voters Motown_Johnny Jul 2012 #148

Actually, Permatex, those into guns obsessively should pay price. Without them, gun manufacturers Hoyt Jul 2012 #57

Whatever Hoyt permatex Jul 2012 #60

You already pay the price of having these types of shootings treestar Jul 2012 #106

By your logic we don't need laws against theft or murder, either... ljm2002 Jul 2012 #39

Nice strawman you built there permatex Jul 2012 #41

"Laws are enacted to deter not prevent"... ljm2002 Jul 2012 #96

Maybe you should ask yourself why gun violence is so dramatically different in the US. HuckleB Jul 2012 #45

I do support gun laws permatex Jul 2012 #55

Newsflash. HuckleB Jul 2012 #116

Show me how my statement is wrong? permatex Jul 2012 #118

Welcome to the club nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #7

thank you for the thoughtful post CreekDog Jul 2012 #20

As I understand it Orrex Jul 2012 #23

at what point does an assult rifle become the equivalent of an automatic weapon ? azurnoir Jul 2012 #26

How do you propose taking them out if circulation? Atypical Liberal Jul 2012 #27

It's because of people like you that we will continue see massacres like this.. TNLib Jul 2012 #47

Public safety can't trump essential liberty. Atypical Liberal Jul 2012 #81

I don't think a CCW would take a gun to a movie but maybe I'm wrong. TNLib Jul 2012 #35

I get my CCP in about a week permatex Jul 2012 #37

Those with CCWs take them everywhere.......... Smilo Jul 2012 #42

Yeah, lucky there weren't any LEO's in there. Tejas Jul 2012 #38

I'm old enough to remember when the NRA was an environmental group Spitfire of ATJ Jul 2012 #46

Remember those days unc70 Jul 2012 #83

It was about the time of Tricky Dick. Spitfire of ATJ Jul 2012 #87

How about keep it all legal but require references and a psych eval for the big stuff? harun Jul 2012 #49

As a former hunter that still keeps a shotgun and rifle in the house even though I no appleannie1 Jul 2012 #51

Even if some one tried to shoot him he had on bulletproof armor. Kablooie Jul 2012 #75

America is under attack from within-greed of the American gun industry. ErikJ Jul 2012 #61

I see no reason for anyone to have an assault weapon. ananda Jul 2012 #68

yes Rosa Luxemburg Jul 2012 #101

I rarely wish I could rec more than once, JoeyT Jul 2012 #72

How about just storing all guns in armories? Want to play with them? Check 'em out. Tierra_y_Libertad Jul 2012 #74

That's how they handle guns in South Korea. agentS Jul 2012 #133

You said it yourself - you have 16-round magazines derby378 Jul 2012 #79

They shouldn't allow people to easily acquire a semi-automatic weapon like a glock.... AntiFascist Jul 2012 #97

The clip in my 20 gauge shotgun holds two cartridges. That's plenty for most situations. HopeHoops Jul 2012 #80

I can beat that. Spitfire of ATJ Jul 2012 #94

"skeet shooting those old AOL disks" - LOL! I've got a 2.0 floppy right next to me!!! HopeHoops Jul 2012 #143

Pull!!! Spitfire of ATJ Jul 2012 #145

Actually, I'm going to sell it on eBay. HopeHoops Jul 2012 #146

Are people that desperate to remember this? Spitfire of ATJ Jul 2012 #149

I've sold a shitload of the CDs. They went through a period of making really cool ones. HopeHoops Jul 2012 #156

Ron Reagan was subbing for Chris Matthews on Friday riverbendviewgal Jul 2012 #108

irrelevant discussion legoman69 Jul 2012 #110

Your shooting out blindly in a darkened, smoke-filled and overwhelmingly LOUD theater hlthe2b Jul 2012 #111

Not to mention the shooter was covered from DURHAM D Jul 2012 #112

Are you a trained tactical shooter nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #114

We should not base gun laws on your heroic delusions jeff47 Jul 2012 #136

Well hi there, just stopping by, or should we say driving by DainBramaged Jul 2012 #150

Another delusional gun nut with a paranoid violent fantasy _ed_ Jul 2012 #155

You're more of a gun expert than me. mwooldri Jul 2012 #115

AGREED, and let's stop the silling dancing and Iggy Jul 2012 #151

This point is outstanding: CrispyQ Jul 2012 #153

They are called 'assault' weapons for a reason ninehippies Jul 2012 #154