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calimary

(88,877 posts)
129. I. LOVE. THIS. POST.!!!!!
Sun Jul 22, 2012, 02:25 PM
Jul 2012

You nailed it, grantcart. And you definitely speak for me!

I am just sick to death of the gun apologists who nitpick whine and say "oh it ISN'T an assault weapon" because of some fine print they can fall back on. I'm sick of the excuses falling back on the Second Amendment. I'm sick of the rationales and justifications and fancy rhetoric that always wind up proving that the attacker's rights outweigh and override the victims' rights. Because THAT is what it comes down to here. In Aurora CO. In Columbine. At Virginia Tech. At too too too many other places where one bullet didn't kill one person - a BARRAGE of bullets mowed down dozens.

This keeps happening. And somehow America's okay with it. Well I AM NOT OKAY WITH IT. I just saw a "Meet the Press" segment where they all agreed this is a settled issue and can't be revisited. A woman's right to choose somehow doesn't get that. Hell, even the right to vote doesn't merit that anymore! Why are THOSE not settled issues, while the "sanctity" of gun ownership seems to be an absolute???

I actually wound up putting someone on full ignore here because of the relentlessness and the refusal in his arguments that guns are our right and guns must not be touched and - we have to blame something else, someone else, and when I argued - the Second Amendment was found necessary and drawn up when MUSKETS were the coin of the realm, and if all you gun folks are willing to go back to muskets again then I'm fine with it in the spirit in which it was intended. And he comes back with some smart-ass remark about how those of us who think as I do should then resort to quill pens. ASSHOLE!!!! Well, I don't care WHAT kind of smart remark, I don't care WHAT kind of statistics, I don't care WHAT kind of definition or loophole people like that jump through and cling to for the sake of justifying their right to own murderous objects. I don't care WHAT the reason or rationale or excuse or hair-splitting or justification is. I STILL believe, and I'll believe it till I die, that these guns and weapons and ammo clips and hundreds-of-rounds magazines HAVE NO PLACE in civilian society. Because the uncompromising insistence of those who insist on owning them tells me something exceedingly dark about their souls.

THOSE KINDS OF WEAPONS are designed for nothing else than killing. Killing PEOPLE. Killing people in MASS QUANTITIES IN A VERY SHORT SPAN OF TIME. That's all they're meant for. That's all they do. And NO amount of justifying or hair-splitting definitions or rationales or excuse-making or hiding behind the skirts of the Second Amendment (and always, as THEY define it, of course - always ignoring the "WELL-REGULATED MILITIA" part of it) will change that.

And no argument (please, don't even try. You're wasting your breath and your posting fingers, at least with me) will convince me that your point of view is valid. I don't care if you throw a hundred Constitutional Amendments at me and they all say it's okay to possess neutron bombs for personal use, freedom-freedom-freedom! You will not convince me. I want guns gone. ESPECIALLY these kinds of guns. If they're supposedly so illegal, as some here have argued - then why did this guy in Aurora Colorado get one? How did this guy get one. And if on the other hand these nightmare instruments of death are legal (by whatever hair-splitting technicality you can somehow excuse them) are legal, for God's Sake WHY??????

And again, please just save your breath. Don't try to convince me there's any good reason or flimsy rationale for any of this, or any good reason why we shouldn't keep trying to eradicate these weapons from ANYONE's use. Just don't. Yes. I said flimsy. Because that's all these are. Flimsy rationales. They don't stand up, at least with me. I don't care of spineless Dems are reluctant even to bring up the subject anymore because they lost the House in 1994 for having done so. I don't care if the NRA is jus too powerful. I'm sorry. NOTHING should be that powerful. That only makes me want to figure out how, someday, somehow, to make them UNpowerful.

You gun-lovers and gun-nuts and gun-excusers Will. Not. Move. Me. You can argue and filibuster about the blessings of any kind of gun ownership til every last one of you has passed out, breathless and exhausted. It won't work with me. It will NEVER work with me. I will never be okay with just giving in and accepting that these wretched Satan instruments are alive and well and allowed to exist and to fall into the hands of any Tom-Dick-and-Harry that has an axe to grind with society and feels its their right and their divine vengance to go wantonly wiping out a crowd of innocent people today - and that there's nothing we can do about getting them off the face of the earth.

And until you can tell me how many of these massacres is finally enough.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

Used for hunting... IF your prey is armed... Cooley Hurd Jul 2012 #1
I think we need MORE assault weapons...for the prey :) pinboy3niner Jul 2012 #3
think they made a game for that PatrynXX Jul 2012 #123
"I am ready to wreak some havoc," lol pinboy3niner Jul 2012 #128
Nothing scarier than meeting a band pscot Jul 2012 #132
I hope that's not something you encounter often pinboy3niner Jul 2012 #139
And you want a high body count lunatica Jul 2012 #13
I know quite a few hunters xmas74 Jul 2012 #51
well yeah PatrynXX Jul 2012 #131
Nothing compares with planting an arrow pscot Jul 2012 #135
Most of my friends who are serious about hunting are strictly bow, xmas74 Jul 2012 #148
But paint it camo, and.. X_Digger Jul 2012 #210
Nah. xmas74 Jul 2012 #211
Why in Gods name would you need either one for hunting...I believe movonne Jul 2012 #119
yup samsingh Jul 2012 #203
seems pretty obvous why gunners would prefer the second . . . doesn't it DrDan Jul 2012 #2
+1,000,000,000,000 Odin2005 Jul 2012 #4
Here's the thing. You are being fooled by cosmetics. Both guns perform the same. Edweird Jul 2012 #5
The problem with your comment is grantcart Jul 2012 #17
There is no 'assault weapon' in the OP or my post. Edweird Jul 2012 #30
I am not arguing for any political action. It is counter productive. grantcart Jul 2012 #90
Great post that should be an OP. Thank you. (n/t) klook Jul 2012 #114
I think I have found a flaw in your argument. quakerboy Jul 2012 #118
I don't think that individual gun rights are tied to the 2nd Ammendment. grantcart Jul 2012 #125
Really? Llewlladdwr Jul 2012 #167
In the context of the complete sentence it means grantcart Jul 2012 #169
Every member of the present Supreme Court disagrees with you slackmaster Jul 2012 #190
+1 million drm604 Jul 2012 #120
I am, too, drm604. calimary Jul 2012 #130
Thank you, Grantcart, for this well-thought-out post... Surya Gayatri Jul 2012 #127
I. LOVE. THIS. POST.!!!!! calimary Jul 2012 #129
I posted it in GD, you may want to add your thoughtful comment there. grantcart Jul 2012 #133
Done. Happy to kick it. calimary Jul 2012 #165
+1000000 nt laundry_queen Jul 2012 #192
This post is required reading for all DUers. DCBob Jul 2012 #158
Washington, DC > by law, a 9mm handgun is a machinegun. Tejas Jul 2012 #202
this is a great post. thank you. samsingh Jul 2012 #204
Groundhog Hunting? Jeff In Milwaukee Jul 2012 #172
This message was self-deleted by its author Edweird Jul 2012 #41
"Simply because hunting rifles can be converted to assault rifles doesn't mean that it should be leg rl6214 Jul 2012 #194
One funny thing about the well-worn "meaningless cosmetics" DirkGently Jul 2012 #54
You forgot to mention that the men and women that own the 200 miilion guns in the US Edweird Jul 2012 #184
So, you have no rational response. But have penises on your mind? DirkGently Jul 2012 #188
The "lethality" of a weapon is solely determined by the HUMAN operating it. Edweird Jul 2012 #191
You forgot to include that most of these "assault weapons" are ergonomically superior to hunting rif rl6214 Jul 2012 #195
Incorrect, they are very different weapons. As well "assault rifle" is VERY real and not made up pasto76 Jul 2012 #58
Really? You believe semi-auto is "more firepower" than 3 shot burst or full auto? Edweird Jul 2012 #69
Dude, do you even know why there is 3 round burst? SEMI AUTO is the MOST LETHAL pasto76 Jul 2012 #149
I think you are giving accessories way too much credit and your training and experience too little. Edweird Jul 2012 #163
Rifle caliber, Yes. Pistol caliber, No. OneTenthofOnePercent Jul 2012 #186
The Va Tech shooter fired 170 rounds killing 32 and injuring 17 rl6214 Jul 2012 #196
Bravo TroglodyteScholar Jul 2012 #71
Im a democrat. Im also a soldier. I also want people to be able to watch a goddamn movie pasto76 Jul 2012 #151
If semi-automatics with lots of accessories confer more fire-power than machine guns 4th law of robotics Jul 2012 #103
"accessory" to the untrained. Important features to soldiers. pasto76 Jul 2012 #150
You kind of argued against your own point 4th law of robotics Jul 2012 #154
wtf are you talking about pasto76 Jul 2012 #160
Perhaps the military then is unaware of what it is doing 4th law of robotics Jul 2012 #162
"Assault weapon" is the new, fashionable term. Igel Jul 2012 #79
Yeah, swapped them by accident. Edweird Jul 2012 #87
The black paint makes the bullet faster 4th law of robotics Jul 2012 #101
You're The One Being Fooled By Cosmetics, Pal. Paladin Jul 2012 #109
I don't own one black or plastic stocked rifle. You fail - as usual. Edweird Jul 2012 #138
Great point. Outlaw both. Outlaw all semi-automatic rifles. A good hunter doesnt rhett o rick Jul 2012 #112
Yeah, ok. Edweird Jul 2012 #140
I see your point, but it seems like it must be more than *just* cosmetics... phantom power Jul 2012 #121
Nope. Wooden stocks are expensive, heavy and require much more maintenance. The military developed Egalitarian Thug Jul 2012 #137
So, if I understand then, the performance differences are... phantom power Jul 2012 #206
Yep, that about sums it up. The .223 can be used for something deer sized if you are Egalitarian Thug Jul 2012 #208
Interesting, You say they are the same - they're not intaglio Jul 2012 #136
Ok Edweird Jul 2012 #143
With a maximum effective range of 100m intaglio Jul 2012 #168
It's a completely different firearm. It's a bolt action. Edweird Jul 2012 #170
LOL! liberalmuse Jul 2012 #152
AR=30rd mag. Mini 30 sporter or a woodsmaster has a 5-10 rd. mag. Also, an assault rifle takes an Erose999 Jul 2012 #178
A little knowledge is a dangerous thing. Edweird Jul 2012 #183
The phrase "well regulated militia" preceeds "keep and bear arms" and "shall not be finfringed". So Erose999 Jul 2012 #185
The Virginia Tech shooter killed 32 with 10 rd magazines. Edweird Jul 2012 #187
"The shooter might have been shot". It would have been a bad idea to pull on the shooter. several Erose999 Jul 2012 #197
You do realize that purpose of CCW is personal defense, right? Edweird Jul 2012 #198
I'm just saying its not the best idea to challenge a shooter in a situation where he has all the Erose999 Jul 2012 #201
That, right there, is what I see at the heart of the gun control advocates Edweird Jul 2012 #205
Put a 5 round magazine on it as many states require for hunting hack89 Jul 2012 #6
You are allowing yourself to be seduced by the military appearance of the AR-15. Put a scope on it, slackmaster Jul 2012 #7
why is this something to be proud of . . . . he is just beaming with pride DrDan Jul 2012 #16
why not be proud he relentlessly laid around until the beast was close enuff then blamo leftyohiolib Jul 2012 #22
to compound it, all his buddies are pounding him on the back and buying him rounds DrDan Jul 2012 #23
You may be my new favorite DUer. I laughed hysterically upon reading this post. LonePirate Jul 2012 #38
Because it tastes good slackmaster Jul 2012 #48
is steroid and hormone and antibiotic free range lean meat. Tuesday Afternoon Jul 2012 #56
it seems obvious to me that the trophy is the goal here - not the food. DrDan Jul 2012 #73
A trophy or recognition for a long-distance shot might have been the main goal slackmaster Jul 2012 #75
he's not proud of the kill Skittles Jul 2012 #116
probably the only way he can attain one DrDan Jul 2012 #146
Good question, DrDan. I don't find anything appealing in photos like that. calimary Jul 2012 #141
I have done a couple of photo safaris to Kenya - it is remarkable to see these animals in the wild DrDan Jul 2012 #145
Indeed. I bet it made him feel virile as ALL HELL! calimary Jul 2012 #147
Because for all we know... jmowreader Jul 2012 #156
FINALLY got to kill something . . . ok - got it - I understand now DrDan Jul 2012 #159
if he ate that, i wouldn't mind. if he did that just for a trophy head he'd be a sick bastard. dionysus Jul 2012 #175
completely agree - the picture, suggests to me the latter DrDan Jul 2012 #177
some "sport". lucky for us this d.b. was there to take down the man eating terror that's been leftyohiolib Jul 2012 #18
That's what they call hunting these days, huh? Starboard Tack Jul 2012 #57
A scoped rifle has been a standard weapon for hunting for well over 100 years slackmaster Jul 2012 #60
The scope is half the size as the deer. Starboard Tack Jul 2012 #70
Antelope slackmaster Jul 2012 #72
Sorry, my bad. Starboard Tack Jul 2012 #76
I've seen a heard of them running. They're amazingly fast, and you can't get close to them. slackmaster Jul 2012 #77
CORRECT! the magazine capacity is a -KEY- feature of an assualt rifle. pasto76 Jul 2012 #61
The fact that the AR-15 can accept different types of magazines makes it more useful slackmaster Jul 2012 #65
The AR-15 is actually not a rifle at all by most normal definitions. A Simple Game Jul 2012 #142
This message was self-deleted by its author pasto76 Jul 2012 #161
It can be configured with a long barrel and a fixed stock slackmaster Jul 2012 #173
There are carbine versions of the AR-15 Kaleva Jul 2012 #181
try and twist it some more pasto76 Jul 2012 #153
Placing limits on magazine capacity is a legitimate topic for discussion slackmaster Jul 2012 #155
This message was self-deleted by its author Kaleva Jul 2012 #80
True. Not terribly relevant. Igel Jul 2012 #82
funny which one of us is a combat vet? pasto76 Jul 2012 #157
Not a bad looking pronghorn...notice he invested more in the scope ileus Jul 2012 #63
This photo tell it all this bonniebgood Jul 2012 #124
He doesn't look like a terrorist to me slackmaster Jul 2012 #126
That looks like a different rifle to me muriel_volestrangler Jul 2012 #164
That's another nice feature of the AR-15 platform - Interchangeable parts slackmaster Jul 2012 #171
But the point is, combat weapons should be banned muriel_volestrangler Jul 2012 #180
I believe the distinction between combat weapons and sporting weapons was drawn correctly in 1934 slackmaster Jul 2012 #182
What particular detail makes the 2nd one more dangerous? 4th law of robotics Jul 2012 #8
Well, it's painted black and has a pistol grip, you see. Posteritatis Jul 2012 #20
The NRA nuts get off on feeling smug and superior... ellisonz Jul 2012 #9
It appears you have more of an issue with magazine capacity then with the gun itself Kaleva Jul 2012 #10
At longer ranges, the upper gun would be more dangerous in the hands of a bad guy. Kaleva Jul 2012 #11
Jesus, if it's a .30-06 it's no slouch close up either. Edweird Jul 2012 #12
No but for close range shooting, I'd choose the 2nd gun. Kaleva Jul 2012 #19
For close range, a shotgun is more deadly HooptieWagon Jul 2012 #35
And our movie theater shooter had both. Hmm! Starboard Tack Jul 2012 #66
And that... Igel Jul 2012 #83
They want to confuse you, because they have no real arguments frazzled Jul 2012 #14
No, we like knowing what we're talking about. Igel Jul 2012 #86
Sorry, we're not buying that crap anymore frazzled Jul 2012 #95
Which crap is it you aren't buying because it appears as if you have no idea. TheKentuckian Jul 2012 #144
Then they start the bullshit Gman Jul 2012 #15
It isn't an assault rifle obamanut2012 Jul 2012 #21
Those look more like "murder rifles" to me n/t Generic Brad Jul 2012 #24
Hard to ban objects by reference to function. Igel Jul 2012 #89
I suspect... HooptieWagon Jul 2012 #25
I ahve mentioned .22 bolt actions with skeleton stocks at gun shows obamanut2012 Jul 2012 #27
So the NRA crowd is ... 99Forever Jul 2012 #26
It's used for hunting 'The most dangerous game" TeamPooka Jul 2012 #28
This message was self-deleted by its author wandy Jul 2012 #29
You show how to commit Federal crimes? Tejas Jul 2012 #36
I don't even own a gun! I'm pointing out how Fing easy it is to turn this thing auto...... wandy Jul 2012 #40
Guarantee you won't after .gov gets through with your little stunt. Tejas Jul 2012 #49
Laws prohibit the manufacture or importation of guns that can be easily converted to full auto. Kaleva Jul 2012 #55
You need to do your research better then. -..__... Jul 2012 #68
They used to make gadgets that stripped out DVD anticopy signals. Igel Jul 2012 #104
Relevance? Igel Jul 2012 #93
You seem to be another who has more of an issue with the magazine capacity then with the gun itself Kaleva Jul 2012 #37
I'm just unnerved at how easy it is to convert one of these things........ wandy Jul 2012 #46
The machine work needed to do a proper conversion requires special equipment and is not simple. slackmaster Jul 2012 #53
It's not that easy on post 1986 rifles. Kaleva Jul 2012 #62
Methods 1 and 2 require precision machine work, and are no longer available to private citizens slackmaster Jul 2012 #52
No gun shop would do that -- and you should delete your post obamanut2012 Jul 2012 #67
I'll go with that. Even if ithe infor is out there. wandy Jul 2012 #85
Make them work for it obamanut2012 Jul 2012 #98
bottom rifle is an AK-47, fires child-seeking bullets Tejas Jul 2012 #31
I've seen numerous articles where it was reported that the weapon was an AK-47 Kaleva Jul 2012 #44
Yes. A banana, perhaps. n/t Igel Jul 2012 #105
Me, Too Iggy Jul 2012 #32
He could have changed standard magazines a few times HooptieWagon Jul 2012 #39
Yes. I read his drum magazine jammed. Kaleva Jul 2012 #43
Then argue for a ban on high capacity magazines. Kaleva Jul 2012 #42
Banning of anything Iggy Jul 2012 #166
Ah, the "RKBA is about hunting, not self-defense" mantra. Tejas Jul 2012 #47
The best defense is an insult. Igel Jul 2012 #110
'Assault rifle' means an automatic or select-fire rifle - i.e., more than one round petronius Jul 2012 #33
That's not the actual argument, though. Lizzie Poppet Jul 2012 #34
In the 1980's you may have been right. ileus Jul 2012 #45
Have you ever seen large spoilers attached to front wheel drive economy cars? JVS Jul 2012 #50
This obamanut2012 Jul 2012 #74
which cowards need a semi-automatic gun to hunt? samsingh Jul 2012 #59
I'd post a link to a set of photos taken by a guy in Georgia who used a spear to hunt wild pigs slackmaster Jul 2012 #64
Many people hunt with semi-auto pistols Kaleva Jul 2012 #81
Really? Why? obamanut2012 Jul 2012 #100
This is for the more populated areas Kaleva Jul 2012 #106
Gotcha -- that makes sense obamanut2012 Jul 2012 #111
Iowa has the same rules harun Jul 2012 #107
That all makes sense -- thanks! obamanut2012 Jul 2012 #113
rifled bullets, as opposed to a shotgun slug, travel vast distances (up to a mile) dionysus Jul 2012 #174
Some hunters prefer a semi-auto. Ready4Change Jul 2012 #91
I would probably go with a semiauto if I were to hunt slackmaster Jul 2012 #94
So many misconceptions in there 4th law of robotics Jul 2012 #97
Language. It's a problem. Igel Jul 2012 #134
The kind of cowards that hunt pissed-off man-eating predators jmowreader Jul 2012 #189
The overwhelming majority of U.S. gun owners are nonhunters (>80%). benEzra Jul 2012 #209
C'mon, you're saying policy should be based on the visual design of a gun? Schema Thing Jul 2012 #78
It is a semi-auto assault weapon, don't let anyone kid you. Rex Jul 2012 #84
I strongly agree. avaistheone1 Jul 2012 #88
No automatic assault guns were used in this tragedy. Kaleva Jul 2012 #92
Because it needs to be repeated: no automatics were used in CO. 4th law of robotics Jul 2012 #99
It is not an automatic weapon obamanut2012 Jul 2012 #102
As far as I am concerned.. ananda Jul 2012 #96
There are two distinct definitions for "assault rifle" MineralMan Jul 2012 #108
No, an assault rifle is an automatic weapon obamanut2012 Jul 2012 #115
to the OP: Raine1967 Jul 2012 #117
The dead don't care about the trivial technical minutiae of firearms design. baldguy Jul 2012 #122
I tell you the problem nadinbrzezinski Jul 2012 #176
Personally, I think anyone attracted to the second gun should be prohibited from owning guns. Hoyt Jul 2012 #179
What does that scary black gun do differently? rl6214 Jul 2012 #193
I think it's too scared to tell you... MrMickeysMom Jul 2012 #200
Assault rifles are select fire (full auto/semi auto); AR-15s (civilian model) are semi-auto only REP Jul 2012 #199
Thanks to those who provided some answers to my questions... phantom power Jul 2012 #207
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»I am sincerely perplexed ...»Reply #129