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GliderGuider

(21,088 posts)

39. A country isn't a single person.

Thu Jul 16, 2015, 07:18 AM

Jul 2015

We must find ways to punish those responsible without condemning the innocent. We must learn to separate the question of the culpability of politicians from that of the welfare of the citizens. The Greek "agreement" takes a shotgun to the guilty and innocent alike. That amounts to collective punishment, which is banned under the Geneva Conventions.

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Clashes break out at Athens anti-austerity march [View all] Bosonic Jul 2015 OP

I kind of figured the action would move to the streets. KamaAina Jul 2015 #1

I surprised it took this long. Elmer S. E. Dump Jul 2015 #2

me too J_J_ Jul 2015 #22

Protests in Athens turn violent Baclava Jul 2015 #3

I don't know if I'd want to run a German business in Greece right now. Comrade Grumpy Jul 2015 #4

You think folks would blame the schnitzel salesman for Merkel's loan conditions? Nye Bevan Jul 2015 #30

Tsipras facing eurozone deal revolt Baclava Jul 2015 #5

I just don't see how that is going to change anythin, but dig a deeper hole. Nobody wants austerity. Hoyt Jul 2015 #6

The quickest way out of this mess is debt relief and a repayment moratorium GliderGuider Jul 2015 #10

I agree 100% with the repayment moratorium but what do you do to get cstanleytech Jul 2015 #11

they have instituted the required austerity, which is what crushed their economy magical thyme Jul 2015 #17

No, what crushed them is their economy is a tourist based one similar to Puerto Rico. cstanleytech Jul 2015 #32

wrong on many counts. Sorry, but I'll take Krugman over an anonymous poster any day. magical thyme Jul 2015 #34

The US model in your example is a poor one to use unless the EU was setup to do that. cstanleytech Jul 2015 #35

That is my point. (And you're confusing the European Union with the Eurozone) magical thyme Jul 2015 #38

Yes nothing build with "now" but if they get an extension on that debt so that they do not cstanleytech Jul 2015 #40

Which is what the Troika flatly refuses to do. magical thyme Jul 2015 #43

Oh they are going kick scream over it but I dont believe they have a realistic choice but to do so cstanleytech Jul 2015 #44

Greece did the prior reforms. The Troika refused to give any debt relief all along, magical thyme Jul 2015 #45

"Greece did the prior reforms." Not according to the IMF. cstanleytech Jul 2015 #48

ok, everything I've seen now says they did. But then, there is also this from the IMF: magical thyme Jul 2015 #49

Ya they messed up somewhat but so did Greece as the IMF did say that if Greece had complied cstanleytech Jul 2015 #50

and the IMF said the Greeks were in uncharted territory with the extent of tax increases & austerity magical thyme Jul 2015 #51

Except Greece forgave that and they cannot take it back. cstanleytech Jul 2015 #52

no. the war reparations and the forgiven reconstruction loans are 2 different things. magical thyme Jul 2015 #53

Your second sentence hits on one of their core problems metalbot Jul 2015 #54

you raised the question...you answer it. magical thyme Jul 2015 #55

The ports are helpful metalbot Jul 2015 #56

and why did the Troika choose cover private bank losses with public debt? nt magical thyme Jul 2015 #57

Completely different issue metalbot Jul 2015 #58

you don't know that taxing the shipping industry would kill it (although I'm sure the 1% shippers magical thyme Jul 2015 #59

Well, they've had time to make government and economic reforms. They failed. Hoyt Jul 2015 #13

So, we let them die? nt GliderGuider Jul 2015 #15

Who is going to let them die? Probably is time for a special election or somethin? Hoyt Jul 2015 #16

Everything dies, stars, planets, animals, people. Everything ends eventually even the universe. nt cstanleytech Jul 2015 #18

Well, I don't want the Troika to turn off the sun either... nt GliderGuider Jul 2015 #20

Well they cant do that nor can they really save Greece either, only the Greek people can. cstanleytech Jul 2015 #24

They can keep from making the Greeks' recovery more difficult. GliderGuider Jul 2015 #25

Yes they could but they also have helped before dont forget and Greece failed to follow through on cstanleytech Jul 2015 #27

A country isn't a single person. GliderGuider Jul 2015 #39

Debt is debt though regardless of if its a person or a country. cstanleytech Jul 2015 #41

they instituted the required reforms. The austerity without debt relief failed, as the IMF magical thyme Jul 2015 #46

Forgive all of Greece's debt tomorrow and their economy still can't sustain a Euro peg Recursion Jul 2015 #36

makeing a bad situation worse--but i can not say i blame them or am surpised dembotoz Jul 2015 #7

It's what some always do. Igel Jul 2015 #9

This message was self-deleted by its author 1000words Jul 2015 #8

There will be more people on the street if parliament votes to accept the terms Ilios Meows Jul 2015 #12

"Austerity" is of the 1% crushing the rest of us bread_and_roses Jul 2015 #14

Its not always about the 1%. cstanleytech Jul 2015 #28

Yes, it is always about the 1% when it comes to $$ bread_and_roses Jul 2015 #29

Thanks, its nice to know we can jettison math so easy. cstanleytech Jul 2015 #31

Parliament voting now; BBC link UPDATE PASSED Yo_Mama Jul 2015 #19

Of course they approved the bailout - will the rebellion spread outside Athens though? Baclava Jul 2015 #33

Did anyone see Yanis Varoufakis' recent interview? cemaphonic Jul 2015 #21

I wonder how many of the same protesters would be complaining about exiting the EU? FLPanhandle Jul 2015 #23

Exactly. There are going to be protests no matter what. And protests aren't Hoyt Jul 2015 #26

But an exit offers them more control Recursion Jul 2015 #37

EU taxpayers are not footing their deficit. They are bailing out the French, German magical thyme Jul 2015 #47

Hmmm ... that'll help bring in those tourist Euros ... Nihil Jul 2015 #42