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Judi Lynn

(164,155 posts)
62. Whoever said the paramilitaries were 18 years old? Some of them were former Colombian soldiers.
Sun Jun 10, 2012, 10:20 PM
Jun 2012

It's so perplexing you pull ideas like that from outta somewhere, but it doesn't connect to anything I've ever heard.


The Venezuelan elite imports soldiers
by Marta Harnecker
May 23, 2004

If anything has become clear following the discovery of an incursion of a significantly large paramilitary group into the country, it is that the 'anti-Bolivarian and anti-Venezuelan oligarchy and its masters in the north' have not been able to recruit Venezuelan soldiers for their subversive objectives and 'have been forced to recruit them in another country,' as expressed President Chavez in front of tens of thousands of people, who gathered in Caracas this past Sunday, May 16th, to demonstrate their rejection of paramilitary activity and to express their support for peace.
(snip)

A week earlier, on the 9th of May, on the outskirts of Caracas, a paramilitary force was discovered, dressed in field uniforms. Later, more were found, raising the total to 130, leaving open the possibility that there are still more in the country. The three Colombian paramilitary leaders of the group are members of the Autonomous Self-Defense Forces (AUC) in Northern Santander state in Colombia.

Some of the captured Colombian fighters have a long history as members of paramilitary forces. Others are reservists of the Colombian army and yet others were specifically recruited for the task in Venezuela and were surely tricked. Among these there are several who are minors.

A colonel of the Venezuelan air force was also detained, as well as seven officers of the National Guard. Among those implicated in the plot is a group of civilians headed by the Cuban Roberto Alonso, creator of the 'guarimbas,'<1> and Gustavo Quintero Machado, a Venezuelan, both who are currently wanted by the Venezuelan justice system.
(snip/...)

http://www.zmag.org/content/showarticle.cfm?ItemID=5579


[center]~ ~ ~[/center]
VENEZUELA: 130 detained in paramilitary plot
Wednesday, November 17, 1993 - 11:00

CARACAS — According to Venezuelan vice-president Jose Vicente Rangel, 130 individuals have been detained after a group of 70 Colombian paramilitary on May 9. Several dozen people have been presented before military judges, including 13 men captured last Thursday.

The paramilitary group was concentrated at a farm belonging to opposition activist Robert Alonso in the outskirts of Caracas. According to testimonies by some of the detainees, the paramilitary group was training in preparation for attacks on Venezuelan military bases and for a coup d'etat against the government of President Hugo Chavez.

While oppositionist Robert Alonso is being sought by authorities, retired army general Uson Ramirez was detained yesterday morning. Ramirez is thought to have provided help to the paramilitary group. The general was part of a group of high ranking officers who rebelled against the Chavez government during the coup d'etat in April 2002. Seven military officers have been detained in connection with the paramilitaries.

~snip~
Even though Venezuela has signed all international anti-terrorism treaties, no anti-terror law exists in the country. A draft for a local anti-terrorism law was introduced last year by the executive for discussion and approval at the National Assembly. Lawmakers from political parties that support the government have accused the opposition of blocking the discussion, as several opposition activists have been charged with crimes that might be classified as terrorism, including the bombing of the Colombian Consulate and Spanish Embassy offices in Caracas last year.

More:
http://www.greenleft.org.au/node/29940

[center]~ ~ ~[/center]
War on Hugo Chávez
An outlaw and former spook takes on the Venezuelan dictator
By Janine Zeitlin
Published on October 10, 2007 at 10:41am

~snip~
Robert dubs the plan that caused him to flee his homeland La Guarimba, and says it's nonviolent. But the last time he made his pitch for revolt — in 2004 — at least 13 people were killed and more than 100 were wounded in clashes. "If you don't follow the instructions, it's not my fault.... When you commit yourself to something, you have to quemar los barcos, burn the ships. There's no way out," says the 57-year-old with a shock of white hair and an ample belly. "We're at war"

~snip~
At some point in April 2004, he met with other activists calling themselves the "Brigade Daktari." (A Venezuelan flag hangs on his home office wall with about 50 signatures from this mysterious meeting.) Then he left for Colombia. Carrying a GPS, Alonso says, he navigated the jungle between the two countries and then hopped a bus to Bogotá. He took a plane to Miami in late April ...

Alonso looks like a retiree who stopped by for an afternoon cafecito. He's wearing blue sweatpants, tan sandals, and a turquoise T-shirt. Clamor from the espresso machine and blenders fills the room as a man in a button-down shirt carrying a briefcase strides through the bakery doors and beelines for the table. He silently drops a manila folder before Alonso.

The mystery man is Marlon Gutiérrez, a 45-year-old former Nicaraguan Contra. Alonso takes some papers from the folder and looks them over. They are bylaws for their new group, Fundación Interamericana por la Democracia, which will organize Guarimba resistance movements in Nicaragua, Cuba, and Venezuela ...

http://www.miaminewtimes.com/2007-10-11/news/war-on-hugo-ch-aacute-vez/
Also posted: http://journals.democraticunderground.com/struggle4progress/60

[center]

Colombian paramilitary barracks on Alonso's ranch

[/center]
Published on Monday, May 17,
by the Agence France Presse
Thousands Protest Colombian Paramilitary Presence in Venezuela
Chavez to Set up 'People's Militia'

President Hugo Chavez announced his government would establish "people's militias" to counter what he called foreign interference after an alleged coup plot by Colombian paramilitaries Caracas claims was financed by Washington.

Chavez also said he would boost the strength of Venezuela's armed forces as part of a new "anti-imperialist" phase for his government.

"Each and every Venezuelan man and woman must consider themselves a soldier," said Chavez.

"Let the organization of a popular and military orientation begin from today."

The president's announcement came a week after authorities arrested 88 people described as Colombian paramilitaries holed up on property belonging to a key opposition figure.

More:
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0517-04.htm

[center][/center]

12.30pm update
Colombian paramilitaries arrested in Venezuela
Jeremy Lennard and agencies
Monday May 10, 2004

Venezuelan police have arrested more than 70 Colombian paramilitary fighters who were allegedly plotting to strike against the government in Caracas, according to the country's president, Hugo Chávez.
Opposition leaders, however, were quick to dismiss the president's claim, calling the raids on a farm less than 10 miles from the capital a ruse to divert attention from their efforts to oust Mr Chávez in a recall vote.

During his weekly radio and TV broadcast, Hello Mr President, Mr Chávez said that 53 paramilitary fighters were arrested at the farm early on Sunday and another 24 were picked up after fleeing into the countryside.
The country's security forces were uncovering additional clues and searching for more suspects, he said, adding that the arrests were proof of a conspiracy against his government involving Cuban and Venezuelan exiles in Florida and neighbouring Colombia.

More:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2004/may/10/venezuela.jeremylennard

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

The rumor is that Chavez is on strong opiates to control bone pain. MADem Jun 2012 #1
Eh, you have to admit though the deathwatch isn't nearly as interesting as the electoral stuff. joshcryer Jun 2012 #3
Screenshot: joshcryer Jun 2012 #2
Beautiful. At least the people, I hope unreadierLizard Jun 2012 #4
LOL, welcome to DU. And, uh, nah, he'll keep the power. joshcryer Jun 2012 #6
You mean the dictator who is running for re-election? Comrade Grumpy Jun 2012 #11
LOL pmorlan1 Jun 2012 #131
It's nice that we wear our post count on our sleeves. Gregorian Jun 2012 #17
Get a fucking clue. (nt) harmonicon Jun 2012 #23
dictators typically allow the opposition to hold large public demonstrations, don't they? frylock Jun 2012 #46
Try that in North Korea, China, Syria, Iran, kemah Jun 2012 #121
"Dictator"... You keep using that word tkmorris Jun 2012 #60
so Chavez didn't win internationally monitored elections? yurbud Jun 2012 #96
So did Saddam Hussein. boppers Jun 2012 #101
so you pretty much have no idea what you're talking about. yurbud Jun 2012 #112
Let me ask you a serious question. sabrina 1 Jun 2012 #115
Here's the choices: boppers Jun 2012 #135
I could not agree more!! SkyDaddy7 Jun 2012 #122
Fascist blackshirts. Odin2005 Jun 2012 #5
Why? Because they're against media censorship, unreadierLizard Jun 2012 #7
Lmao -- yes, thousands of people in the street EFerrari Jun 2012 #32
When you aren't allowed to run a TV station, or a newspaper, you have to take to the streets. boppers Jun 2012 #63
"That's kind of how it works." unkachuck Jun 2012 #66
It doesn't work like that in NYC, as we have seen lately EFerrari Jun 2012 #68
If you can control the media, *and* the streets, you have succeeded in gaining total control. boppers Jun 2012 #79
Really, this is now just embarrassing. EFerrari Jun 2012 #89
"brutal coupsters in Honduras" boppers Jun 2012 #98
There are DU'ers who post here who live there NOW, who most clearly don't agree with you. Judi Lynn Jun 2012 #91
Interesting link. boppers Jun 2012 #94
Oh, baloney. If one of our tv outlets staged a coup in their studios EFerrari Jun 2012 #67
Well, a fake "coup" might trigger a congressional investigation. boppers Jun 2012 #77
Red herring. RCTV wasn't shut down even after they facilitated the coup. EFerrari Jun 2012 #85
Oh, so they were allowed to continue broadcasting then? boppers Jun 2012 #86
boppers, they broadcast for five more years, lol, until their license expired. EFerrari Jun 2012 #90
So, they got shut down. boppers Jun 2012 #92
Coup Co-Conspirators as Free-Speech Martyrs EFerrari Jun 2012 #93
If you do not support speech which seeks to undermine your government, you are a tyrant. boppers Jun 2012 #95
Love the last paragraph from this journalists' organization: Judi Lynn Jun 2012 #97
"allowed to broadcast" boppers Jun 2012 #99
Venevisión hosted the coupsters! They still have their license! joshcryer Jun 2012 #87
You owe it to yourself to keep up on this information by doing your own reading. Judi Lynn Jun 2012 #69
Show me where any TV station could broadcast anything they wanted, and not carry official programs. boppers Jun 2012 #75
No, get off your ass and do your own work. I'll wait. n/t Judi Lynn Jun 2012 #78
Alo Presidente! boppers Jun 2012 #80
Show me a station in the US that hosts anyone who led or participated in an attempt to take down sabrina 1 Jun 2012 #114
No. We would also let them off in the name of unity. ieoeja Jun 2012 #127
Yes, we let powerful people off. Reagan was a President, Nixon was a president. sabrina 1 Jun 2012 #140
Chavez participated in a coup, so obviously he is a traitor too correct? Bacchus4.0 Jun 2012 #128
Our Founding Fathers engaged in a coup. Sometimes a revolution is justified. Sometimes it is not. sabrina 1 Jun 2012 #133
G Gordon Liddy gets air time all the time. boppers Jun 2012 #134
None of them was involved in a coup against a sitting president, were they? sabrina 1 Jun 2012 #139
Venevision engineered the coup, they hosted the coupsters, they had them denouncing... joshcryer Jun 2012 #149
Lol, I think you better look into the background of this guy. sabrina 1 Jun 2012 #125
Yes, we know, Capriles is a "fag", a zionist, a fascist, etc. ChangoLoa Jun 2012 #145
Not a fan of Capriles I see. joshcryer Jun 2012 #8
LOL... you're kidding ChangoLoa Jun 2012 #12
Don't trouble the Saint Hugo Fan Club with facts - it just makes them cranky. n/t. apocalypsehow Jun 2012 #15
"the first people in the world with Haiti to rise up against imperialism" boppers Jun 2012 #64
It sure does... but I don't see that date the way you see it. ChangoLoa Jun 2012 #147
When would you date them becoming an "imperialist power"? boppers Jun 2012 #150
All of them? naaman fletcher Jun 2012 #28
When you repeat corporatist talking points, then... bitchkitty Jun 2012 #137
What do you mean? naaman fletcher Jun 2012 #138
Beautiful picture of brave men and women standing up to tyranny. May their cause triumph. n/t. apocalypsehow Jun 2012 #9
They're going to "stand up to tyranny" by voting. Comrade Grumpy Jun 2012 #13
Yes, they are - if Chavez allows a fair vote. Every election to date he's been in he's stolen votes, apocalypsehow Jun 2012 #16
The people who actually monitored elections there don't agree with you. Comrade Grumpy Jun 2012 #18
Oh yes they do - and you well know it. But nice try. n/t. apocalypsehow Jun 2012 #19
You provide no evidence. And I don't know who "Hannah" is. Comrade Grumpy Jun 2012 #21
Evidence was provided at your OWN LINK - which you apparently failed to examine before posting. apocalypsehow Jun 2012 #70
And BTW, Hannah, welcome back. apocalypsehow Jun 2012 #20
I guess that craptastic post was enough to shame even you. Comrade Grumpy Jun 2012 #41
Well, wrong again Hannah. But it's nice to see you back on the site, even if you are predictably a apocalypsehow Jun 2012 #73
Come back when you grow up. Comrade Grumpy Jun 2012 #107
Nor do the people at the National Lawyers Guild Judi Lynn Jun 2012 #22
Now, I do think Chavez was legitimatley elected and reelected, naaman fletcher Jun 2012 #29
Now you've done it. pa28 Jun 2012 #25
Don't worry, facts never interfere with a good Venezuela hate fest! sabrina 1 Jun 2012 #49
Venezuela's elections are the cleanest in the hemisphere. It's the pre-vote purges that... joshcryer Jun 2012 #84
The elections in Venezuela are Transparent, Verifiable, and monitored by Internatioonal agencies, bvar22 Jun 2012 #39
The elections in Venezuela have been stolen since Chavz first "won" - this is proven fact, period. apocalypsehow Jun 2012 #103
There are excellent sources already linked at D.U. regarding statements by international monitors, Judi Lynn Jun 2012 #108
The elections in Venezuela have been stolen since Chavz first "won" - this is proven fact, period. bvar22 Jun 2012 #126
yet somehow you can't even manage to pull a link outta your ass to prove your assertions.. frylock Jun 2012 #129
?? sabrina 1 Jun 2012 #48
Once the names are on the ballots, the elections have been fair by all accounts I've read. boppers Jun 2012 #65
They must be brave because tyrants smash the opposition with tanks and guns. pa28 Jun 2012 #27
Is that the new definition of tyrant? naaman fletcher Jun 2012 #30
Calling Chavez a dictator and tyrant is an extraordinary claim. pa28 Jun 2012 #43
yes I agree naaman fletcher Jun 2012 #45
If he'd been a tyrant, he would have zapped them when they started violent protests, Judi Lynn Jun 2012 #35
A 100 18 year olds were going to kill Chavez? ChangoLoa Jun 2012 #47
Whoever said the paramilitaries were 18 years old? Some of them were former Colombian soldiers. Judi Lynn Jun 2012 #62
Right, there were like 2 or 3 adults with them... LOL. Why were they sent back to their homes... ChangoLoa Jun 2012 #146
Yes, given the Tascón List it is very brave of these people to show support for Capriles. joshcryer Jun 2012 #82
It will. joshcryer Jun 2012 #81
This message was self-deleted by its author devilgrrl Jun 2012 #132
I see the Regime Change Booster Club is in session today. leveymg Jun 2012 #10
Caracus?! We surely can trust your opinion on Vunuzuela, right? ChangoLoa Jun 2012 #14
shriners? Triloon Jun 2012 #24
For a good time see a pro-Chavez demonstration. It'll make your day. Judi Lynn Jun 2012 #26
How do you know its a good time? naaman fletcher Jun 2012 #31
Do you have anything to add to this thread EFerrari Jun 2012 #33
yes naaman fletcher Jun 2012 #37
Really? You're challenging her assertion that it was "a good time?" Comrade Grumpy Jun 2012 #40
If you read the thread naaman fletcher Jun 2012 #42
I don't understand why people think that is an argument for anything. EFerrari Jun 2012 #58
It's an argument that direct personal experience may be better qualified and more insightful Zorro Jun 2012 #59
You mean like the OP. But I thought you didn't have to be there to sabrina 1 Jun 2012 #142
So, naaman fletcher Jun 2012 #120
No, I didn't say that travel isn't educative. EFerrari Jun 2012 #123
Perhaps, naaman fletcher Jun 2012 #124
You're confusing History with current affairs ChangoLoa Jun 2012 #143
Not really. I'm in San Jose and keep up with Cairo very nicely EFerrari Jun 2012 #148
Shhhh, you're ruining the thread, Judy Lynn! Lol! sabrina 1 Jun 2012 #51
They loved things just as they were when Vene. Pres. Carlos Andres Perez ordered his military, Judi Lynn Jun 2012 #76
So much ignorance of the history of South America in this country and of the role of the US in sabrina 1 Jun 2012 #100
Chavez already went to prison once for a murderous conspiracy. boppers Jun 2012 #104
Well then I guess you don't support the Founding Fathers of this country either. They would have sabrina 1 Jun 2012 #116
The US founding fathers tried a military coup? boppers Jun 2012 #136
That's not the way the Venezuelan people viewed that coup attempt. Judi Lynn Jun 2012 #151
I'm glad they all have only one opinion, that makes things easier. boppers Jun 2012 #152
Uniformed followers freak me the fuck out. boppers Jun 2012 #102
Oh, yeah. For sure. They're just the worst. Go, Chiefs! Judi Lynn Jun 2012 #110
Good for Chavez for allowing that. If it were to happen here in the land of the free sabrina 1 Jun 2012 #50
Don't forget those dandy wooden dowels they sometimes like to use on U.S. citizens. Judi Lynn Jun 2012 #83
The cops tend to crack down on anti-political movement here. joshcryer Jun 2012 #88
I always thought it was a little creepy that people register here EFerrari Jun 2012 #34
Its to keep themselves occupied dipsydoodle Jun 2012 #36
Who has registered here to bash chavez? naaman fletcher Jun 2012 #38
Actually, I was flashing on the last referendum EFerrari Jun 2012 #55
Thanks naaman fletcher Jun 2012 #118
Oh, good catch! Odin2005 Jun 2012 #44
True, but as you say, to each their own. sabrina 1 Jun 2012 #52
You want to support the view that anyone disagreeing with Chavez is a fascist and a tool of imperial ChangoLoa Jun 2012 #53
He won't naaman fletcher Jun 2012 #54
That's "she". EFerrari Jun 2012 #57
I apologize naaman fletcher Jun 2012 #119
Chavez is pretty popular in Venezuela. I don't see him being ousted. AJTheMan Jun 2012 #56
Losing an election isn't being "ousted". boppers Jun 2012 #72
This message was self-deleted by its author AJTheMan Jun 2012 #74
This kind of stuff always happens under dictatorships. nt killbotfactory Jun 2012 #61
:) EFerrari Jun 2012 #71
China, Egypt, Syria, United States..... boppers Jun 2012 #105
And the difference is... killbotfactory Jun 2012 #106
If I was to concoct a subject state... boppers Jun 2012 #109
Marcos, the Shah of Iran and we never learn PossumSqueezins Jun 2012 #111
Thank you, and welcome to DU. sabrina 1 Jun 2012 #113
I applaud you pmorlan1 Jun 2012 #141
Yes -welcome to DU dipsydoodle Jun 2012 #117
Perfectly clean elections... except for the blacklisting BY THE GOVT of 30% of the voters ChangoLoa Jun 2012 #144
You won't get far with stating the facts to some people. But thanks for trying? nanabugg Jun 2012 #153
This message was self-deleted by its author devilgrrl Jun 2012 #130
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