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RiverNoord

(1,150 posts)
23. I'll talk about Palestinian terrorism.
Mon May 16, 2016, 10:43 AM
May 2016

It exists. It has existed. Some Israelis have been violently killed by Palestinian terrorism. Some Israelis have been killed by organizations or nations that have engaged in terrorism ostensibly on behalf of Palestinians living under Israeli occupation.

Hostages have been taken, and some have been killed.

Another phrase for terrorism conducted by people under military occupation is 'asymmetrical warfare.' This is historically extraordinarily common when occupied parties have no means to engage in direct armed resistance against the military forces of the occupiers.

The French resistance during WWII, for example, engaged in some acts of extreme terrorism, killing a lot of civilians in the process. And the French resistance to the Nazis and, even to a greater extent, French collaborators, killed way more people than all acts of terrorism directed against the modern state of Israel, ever. And we heavily backed them with military resources.

The French had allies. They broke the German occupation, eradicated the German war machine, and forced an unconditional surrender of Germany. Would you argue that we should have stayed out of WWII in Europe and assumed the formal position that all problems between Nazi Germany and the large number of European nations it had conquered could only be resolved by each of them separately sitting down and negotiating things out?

You think the analog is deeply flawed. You're wrong. It's exactly on point. The only thing that differentiates the scenarios is the question of whether you support one occupying power versus another. That's it. Which means that the argument you make is absurdly hypocritical if you are approaching it from a moral perspective. If you begin with the assumption that there is something morally acceptable about the Israeli occupation of stateless Palestinian civilians, while there wasn't anything morally acceptable about the German occupation of France and French civilians, then make your argument as to why this is the case.

But don't pretend that a militarily occupied people can possibly achieve anything out of exclusively direct negotiations with the occupying power, if there isn't any potential for any kind of pressure brought to bear by others. It's patently absurd.

Do we talk about French terrorism under the German occupation during WWII or do we talk about the French Resistance? You know that answer.

You know who else were considered terrorists around 240 years ago? Rebellious, ungrateful colonists living under British rule on the east coast of the North American continent...

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...saying they prefer direct negotiations without preconditions oberliner May 2016 #1
Depends what the preconditions are Sejon May 2016 #2
.... followed by saying that now is not the time for negotiating with the Palestinians karynnj May 2016 #4
Saying "without preconditions" is a joke. Xolodno May 2016 #9
Um... yeah, that's pretty much evil. RiverNoord May 2016 #11
Direct negotiations are evil? oberliner May 2016 #15
That's no 'version' of reality. RiverNoord May 2016 #19
This post is off the charts oberliner May 2016 #22
The analogy is precisely correct. RiverNoord May 2016 #24
Christian Arabs murdered Muslim Arabs in the Sabra and shatilla refugee camps Mosby May 2016 #31
Oh for Christ's sake. RiverNoord May 2016 #38
Your posts in this thread are outrageous and very revealing of yourself King_David May 2016 #39
Um... look fella. RiverNoord May 2016 #42
Palestinians in the West Bank are analogous to Jews in Nazi death camps? oberliner May 2016 #41
I will, probably tomorrow - I'm exhausted... RiverNoord May 2016 #44
Fair enough oberliner May 2016 #45
No - it's not but leftynyc May 2016 #16
I'll talk about Palestinian terrorism. RiverNoord May 2016 #23
Were the French leftynyc May 2016 #25
You have a strange idea what constitutes "offer". cpwm17 May 2016 #26
I assume you refer to the November 29, 1947 RiverNoord May 2016 #27
I couldn't possibly disagree more leftynyc May 2016 #29
It's clear that nothing whatsoever would sway you from RiverNoord May 2016 #32
What tangible benefit? leftynyc May 2016 #33
So Israel cannot afford to lose 'ANY' war? RiverNoord May 2016 #36
Are you freeking kidding me leftynyc May 2016 #48
Dude. RiverNoord May 2016 #56
That's Dudette leftynyc May 2016 #57
Sorry about the gender presumption. I apologize. RiverNoord May 2016 #59
Oh, and yes, most French offered citizenship in the RiverNoord May 2016 #28
Uh - no leftynyc May 2016 #30
OK. RiverNoord May 2016 #34
YOU calling Leftnyc a fanatic , is the most absurd thing you've written here. King_David May 2016 #40
What is wrong with you? RiverNoord May 2016 #46
Thanks, KD leftynyc May 2016 #50
A fanatic? leftynyc May 2016 #49
One sign of a fanatic is the expression of positions in extremes. RiverNoord May 2016 #52
Yawn leftynyc May 2016 #53
No, I guess I can't expect you to read anything at all. RiverNoord May 2016 #55
it should be obvious by now WHEN CRABS ROAR May 2016 #3
This is it.... Delver Rootnose May 2016 #5
True. Unfortunately this seems to be the US position going forward as well. EndElectoral May 2016 #6
It's so painfully obvious RiverNoord May 2016 #35
Israel has no.... Delver Rootnose May 2016 #7
They don't want peace no matter who mediates; they only want to steal others' land. forest444 May 2016 #8
Israel needs to be brought to heal... StoneCarver May 2016 #10
Bibi: "Paris lacks objectivity." moondust May 2016 #12
I assumed it is a given that Israel is opposed to peace- being silvershadow May 2016 #13
I'm Shocked! Hairy Harry Potlover May 2016 #14
After France voted for that leftynyc May 2016 #17
Israel is not interested in peace, period. Odin2005 May 2016 #18
you're demonizing all Israelis with that statement Mosby May 2016 #20
No, he's not. RiverNoord May 2016 #47
It either references the people or the government Mosby May 2016 #54
Yes, it's the government. RiverNoord May 2016 #58
And just which Palestinians leftynyc May 2016 #21
Bibi, losing support abroad and with the Israeli military. Xolodno May 2016 #37
Its good for all those leaders to discuss without the two 'sides' present at the first 'meeting'. Sunlei May 2016 #43
nutty yahoo will not play unless the game is fixed dembotoz May 2016 #51
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