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Bragi

(7,650 posts)

68. An important distinction

Tue Sep 18, 2012, 05:29 PM

Sep 2012

The right of Americans to engage in offensive blasphemy is not just "a law" that needs to be considered, it is a *constitutional right* that cannot be infringed.

Unless the US were to repeal the First Amendment, and then pass a law outlawing blasphemy, (hello, anyone still there?), no-one can/will ever be extradited from the US to anywhere for offending someone's religious sensitivities.

I think that's the point.

Maybe what we're seeing here is a deal between Egypt and the US. Egypt gets to lay a charge, the US refuses to extradite, the Egyptians then get to run a mock blasphemy trial, the US ignores it and moves on.

Not sure how the filmmakers will fare in the end, but I imagine they will at minimum be subjected to a fatwa, and have to disappear.

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Egyptian Warrants Issued For Terry Jones, Coptic Filmmaker [View all] Purveyor Sep 2012 OP

No way. No extradition for "blasphemy". I hope the State Department makes LeftinOH Sep 2012 #1

Agreed! Blasphemy is not illegal in the US /nt Bragi Sep 2012 #5

And if they TRY to impose religious law on us, we will shoot them with guns that jtuck004 Sep 2012 #17

Why would they do that, though? Scootaloo Sep 2012 #18

I never thought I would be defending Jones, but I absolutely agree with you. nt silvershadow Sep 2012 #27

I doubt anyone actually thinks the guy will be extradited. octothorpe Sep 2012 #69

I have to agree Canuckistanian Sep 2012 #86

I guess if the US can arrest Swedish nationals outside of this country dixiegrrrrl Sep 2012 #2

Who was that? nt hack89 Sep 2012 #23

Assange dixiegrrrrl Sep 2012 #26

America hasn't arrested Assange hack89 Sep 2012 #28

That's what they've got the UK for. nichomachus Sep 2012 #52

The UK has had Assange for two years hack89 Sep 2012 #57

Assange is not a Swedish National King_David Sep 2012 #54

Sigh. PavePusher Sep 2012 #72

"we" are? fascisthunter Sep 2012 #87

egypt has every right to kill them with drones.. frylock Sep 2012 #79

So, by that "logic" al Qaeda is free to send a team of operatives after Obama. Nuclear Unicorn Sep 2012 #92

take it up with whoever it was that wrote the policy frylock Sep 2012 #93

I'm guessing that would be the Commander in Chief of the Armed Forces of the United States Nuclear Unicorn Sep 2012 #95

Let's hope that he thought far enough ahead before he signed it then. Nihil Sep 2012 #96

It seems to me Frances Sep 2012 #3

What if the person shouting thought there was a fire? Bragi Sep 2012 #4

I imagine there are ways to alert people to a perceived fire-danger LanternWaste Sep 2012 #6

Hate speech, not blasphemy. Don't try to minimize it. Ash_F Sep 2012 #61

A truly American value Bragi Sep 2012 #62

It makes you wonder if every other first world country is wrong... Ash_F Sep 2012 #76

S do I understand you correctly? Bragi Sep 2012 #82

No you didn't Ash_F Sep 2012 #89

Blasphemy is not legal obviously in other countries. We generally don't consider sabrina 1 Sep 2012 #63

An important distinction Bragi Sep 2012 #68

I wasn't referring to America's laws. I was referring to Egypt's laws. sabrina 1 Sep 2012 #85

Seems to me your are wrong ProgressiveProfessor Sep 2012 #7

Yes, but they've not been debunked in this thread Bragi Sep 2012 #8

And of course there are new embellishments on each thread ProgressiveProfessor Sep 2012 #10

If the film makers made the movie with the intetnion of causing riots and... Agnosticsherbet Sep 2012 #13

Not quite so... Bragi Sep 2012 #15

My point was not their state of mind. Agnosticsherbet Sep 2012 #58

You might want to review some of the other posts on the USCS before you make that claim ProgressiveProfessor Sep 2012 #21

he did not break a U. S. law. We can't help what fanatics in other countries deem a crime . I hate demosincebirth Sep 2012 #32

If they burned our bibles would we be fanatics...the movonne Sep 2012 #55

I don't think so. Fundies might get their shorts in a knot...a guy might throw a brick at mosque, demosincebirth Sep 2012 #60

It's not even mumbling fire in an open field with almost no one around. hughee99 Sep 2012 #33

Really? Mocking someone's Sky Elf equals "Fire!" in a crowded room with limited exits? PavePusher Sep 2012 #73

Except that makes the other attendees very much afraid for their lives 4th law of robotics Sep 2012 #75

Even bigots have free speech rights. iandhr Sep 2012 #9

Unfortunately... SoapBox Sep 2012 #11

Short of calling for violence Missycim Sep 2012 #36

This is like the Assange case cpwm17 Sep 2012 #12

bullies of Islam doing what they do best nt msongs Sep 2012 #14

I'm personally more concerned with the bullies of Christ right here at home. Comrade Grumpy Sep 2012 #16

The risks are no where near the same ProgressiveProfessor Sep 2012 #20

Not necessarily true... rexcat Sep 2012 #30

That is why I focus my weekend firearms classes on GLBTs and women ProgressiveProfessor Sep 2012 #39

Not at the hands of the State. Risk from criminals and haters is universal. Bluenorthwest Sep 2012 #78

And... rexcat Sep 2012 #83

Inorite! JoeyT Sep 2012 #48

There is a world of difference and quantifiable risk between Government laws and illegal actions ProgressiveProfessor Sep 2012 #50

Filing for an arrest warrant in accordance with the laws of their own nation? Scootaloo Sep 2012 #19

It's fine as Kabuki theatre Bragi Sep 2012 #37

I think it's more of an "arrest these guys if they visit" thing Scootaloo Sep 2012 #38

It also shows the "only the radical fringe are upset" meme is a lie ProgressiveProfessor Sep 2012 #40

A similar situation exists in germany, Professor Scootaloo Sep 2012 #43

Germany is considering banning it, not arrest warrants from what I have read ProgressiveProfessor Sep 2012 #53

Terry Jones will not be allowed into the country, from what I understand Scootaloo Sep 2012 #64

I have not read that, but even if true, it is still not a rioting mob ProgressiveProfessor Sep 2012 #65

What's your point? Bragi Sep 2012 #70

You said Germany would arrest them if they tried to enter the country glacierbay Sep 2012 #97

I would love to see a Red Notice from Interpol on Jones Panasonic Sep 2012 #22

How would that help anything? Bragi Sep 2012 #24

I highly doubt Terry Jones wants to go to the Middle East. dkf Sep 2012 #31

I am waiting for the Obama administration to react ProgressiveProfessor Sep 2012 #25

I'm waiting for the administration to even say the words "free speech" Bragi Sep 2012 #29

I think that SEC of STATE Clinton addressed the matter. julian09 Sep 2012 #34

I don't think she did Bragi Sep 2012 #35

Here you go: karynnj Sep 2012 #44

Thanks Bragi Sep 2012 #56

Not the ones I have read ProgressiveProfessor Sep 2012 #41

Funny thing... Scootaloo Sep 2012 #42

I'm not sure the muslim rioters would listen or care Marrah_G Sep 2012 #46

That's a good point... Bragi Sep 2012 #49

If you did explain to them they would not understand "free speech." They live by the Koran demosincebirth Sep 2012 #59

Why the hell would the president need to "react" to a completely symbolic gesture? Blue_Tires Sep 2012 #47

Because it is a real threat to US citizens. ProgressiveProfessor Sep 2012 #51

What "threat" is this? Is Egypt demanding extradition, or else a declaration of war? Blue_Tires Sep 2012 #66

The warrants did not happen without the concurrence of the highest level of the Egyptian gov ProgressiveProfessor Sep 2012 #67

But ultimately harmless...Not worth the paper it's printed on... Blue_Tires Sep 2012 #71

I think you conclusion about harmless is premature ProgressiveProfessor Sep 2012 #81

fatwa =/= arrest warrant Blue_Tires Sep 2012 #90

It is still a price on his head/death threat ordered by the then Iranian head of state ProgressiveProfessor Sep 2012 #91

LOL good luck with that Marrah_G Sep 2012 #45

If your religion requires that you arrest people for blasphemy then 4th law of robotics Sep 2012 #74

I'd forgotten about the Florida Terry Jones Ken Burch Sep 2012 #77

Was the film maker an American citizen or was he still an Egyptian citizen? smirkymonkey Sep 2012 #80

Egypt has no jurisdiction davidn3600 Sep 2012 #84

stupid... if your belief is that strong, no ridicule should incite you... fascisthunter Sep 2012 #88

This is why the US has the 1st Amendment sakabatou Sep 2012 #94

Maybe Egypt is planning an Eichmann Extradition for these clowns Tom Ripley Sep 2012 #98