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kiva

(4,373 posts)

107. I wasn't trying to be rude, I was trying to make the point

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 07:04 PM

Dec 2012

that you were not reading the articles but instead responding with your general opinion about the topic.

The articles have minor differences, but all agree on the major issues, which I paraphrased in my post. It really does not matter if the mother "felt abandoned", all of the articles agree she was not abandoned - the father went out of state to work and mom chose to stay near family; she and baby were supposed to join dad after the birth - in no way, shape, or form is this abandonment.

Do you think the baby is the 'property' of the woman? Do you think motherhood should be earned, as you said fatherhood should be in your other post below? You seem convinced that somehow women should have all rights regarding children and be allowed to dole out privileges to fathers as they see fit, which is neither legal nor ethical.

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Father will be reunited with baby adopted without his knowledge, judge rules [View all] closeupready Dec 2012 OP

the Utah grubs who illegally adopted the kid think they have a god given to right to keep her nt msongs Dec 2012 #1

In Utah, "God Given" really does have something to do with it. Xithras Dec 2012 #24

Fascinating. Thanks for the info. Hekate Dec 2012 #87

Oh, I doubt it was a vengeful thing. Xithras Dec 2012 #88

Oh. My. God. Hekate Dec 2012 #92

what's a grub dlwickham Dec 2012 #63

Web page vanished notadmblnd Dec 2012 #2

Try here dbackjon Dec 2012 #7

Why would marriage status be any determination? dbackjon Dec 2012 #3

Tell that to the LDS Utah legislature. JimDandy Dec 2012 #5

I can think of a number of reasons Lionessa Dec 2012 #8

So the man has no rights? dbackjon Dec 2012 #11

Amen! +1000 DippyDem Dec 2012 #17

Not so black n white as you want things to be. Lionessa Dec 2012 #20

Hmm davidthegnome Dec 2012 #36

No, in THIS case I started with and continue to support the father's position, Lionessa Dec 2012 #39

Thankfully, the law gives all fathers this right Chemisse Dec 2012 #47

In that case we agree davidthegnome Dec 2012 #52

The adoption agency and the adoptive parents were innocent avebury Dec 2012 #95

So prove he's an abusive prick and get a judge to void his parental... TheMadMonk Dec 2012 #46

Interesting. Ordinarily the adoptive parents would be as responsible as birth parents. Chemisse Dec 2012 #48

Normally yes. But also like birth parents, adoptive parents... TheMadMonk Dec 2012 #55

The father was in the military. I thought that avebury Dec 2012 #94

A whole bunch of that applies to fathers as well. Why is it so hard to respect jtuck004 Dec 2012 #18

WTF are you talking about? Lionessa Dec 2012 #21

Leaving people out is as disrespectuful as dissing them. Ask the people who chose all the white jtuck004 Dec 2012 #28

In no way have I said that men should be excluded, Lionessa Dec 2012 #40

You obviously want to live with your own interpretation. Enjoy! n/t jtuck004 Dec 2012 #44

Wrong about the underaged pregnant girls Samurai_Writer Dec 2012 #90

If known and the father is there, as opposed to a one night stand... TheMadMonk Dec 2012 #38

Good point, since the mother's apparently not talking, but Lionessa Dec 2012 #41

Of course then they would have to get permission from the milkman. Chemisse Dec 2012 #49

side question d_r Dec 2012 #51

My number comes from a genetic survey conducted in QLD,... TheMadMonk Dec 2012 #57

If the biological mother consented, I don't think it's human trafficking, Lionessa Dec 2012 #4

It's human trafficking. JimDandy Dec 2012 #12

Adoption = Human trafficking ???!!! So you think all adoption should end, Lionessa Dec 2012 #14

Selling children for money JimDandy Dec 2012 #19

Most adopted children were not unwanted by their bio family me b zola Dec 2012 #60

I sort of doubt that's still the case. Lionessa Dec 2012 #73

Right, the numbers declined in the 1980's me b zola Dec 2012 #81

You seem to lack the understanding Lionessa Dec 2012 #84

You can refuse to read the links provided to you me b zola Dec 2012 #85

Not wanted? Samurai_Writer Dec 2012 #91

The article linked is not there anymore Tumbulu Dec 2012 #6

They KNEW THE FATHER didn't consent dbackjon Dec 2012 #9

An acceptable reason was offered by the mother, Lionessa Dec 2012 #15

Nope. The adoption agency flat-out broke the law. Xithras Dec 2012 #25

Please prove it is illegal in Utah. Lionessa Dec 2012 #27

Uh...how about the fact that the UTAH judge said it was illegal. Xithras Dec 2012 #34

I do not read anywhere that the judge said it was illegal, Lionessa Dec 2012 #42

Under Utah law, it was illegal. Xithras Dec 2012 #70

IF what the agency, adoptive parents, and mother did was illegal, there'd Lionessa Dec 2012 #74

The mother who produced this child Tumbulu Dec 2012 #45

Wow. So you think that soldiers make unfit fathers? Xithras Dec 2012 #56

This article is different than the one in the OP Tumbulu Dec 2012 #69

But it was her own choice! Xithras Dec 2012 #71

Srikes me, you believe ALL DADS ARE DEADBEAT DADS, unless... TheMadMonk Dec 2012 #58

The law gives dad's equal rights with the mom's Tumbulu Dec 2012 #68

Why not read the article yourself? kiva Dec 2012 #78

This message was self-deleted by its author Tumbulu Dec 2012 #86

During the course of this discussion numerous articles have been posted Tumbulu Dec 2012 #102

Children are not property - neither mother nor father owns them. closeupready Dec 2012 #105

They seem to be treated by our legal system as property, though Tumbulu Dec 2012 #106

I wasn't trying to be rude, I was trying to make the point kiva Dec 2012 #107

The articles posted at the bottom of this thread Tumbulu Dec 2012 #110

You errected the first "strawdad". TheMadMonk Dec 2012 #83

So, just because your neighbor was able to sleep through her labors Tumbulu Dec 2012 #103

That mother in all likelihood will come to deeply regret her actions n/t me b zola Dec 2012 #61

The father/husband did not abandon his wife. He was deployed avebury Dec 2012 #96

You are right, when I wrote my comments it was before the articles making this point were posted Tumbulu Dec 2012 #97

I don't want to diminish the many, many cases of abuse that happens dbackjon Dec 2012 #30

I have too. It is disgusting and does a horrible disservice to the parent. Chemisse Dec 2012 #32

Wait one second, are you SERIOUSLY suggesting that an INDIVIDUALS legal rights be determined kelly1mm Dec 2012 #35

But they had God's blessings, according to their statements. DollarBillHines Dec 2012 #16

You win the thread me b zola Dec 2012 #62

Going thru the front page and searching I found this link Lionessa Dec 2012 #10

Yes on reading the whole thing, there seems to be more to the story... Lionessa Dec 2012 #13

The adoption agency and the adoptive parents CLEARLY share blame dbackjon Dec 2012 #31

It is against the law to give away a baby without both parents' consent. Chemisse Dec 2012 #33

It's sad for the child, but the adoptive parents should not have fought it for two years Chemisse Dec 2012 #50

Stanley v. Illinois HeiressofBickworth Dec 2012 #22

Men's rights when it comes to family courts, is the last great civil rights battle. nt aaaaaa5a Dec 2012 #23

If she herself didn't want the baby, HockeyMom Dec 2012 #26

If she herself didn't want the baby JimDandy Dec 2012 #29

Why should she have done that? davidthegnome Dec 2012 #37

Because as you point out, it is the only straight up legal way Lionessa Dec 2012 #43

But it isn't clear. davidthegnome Dec 2012 #53

It makes no sense under ANY circumstances, since, as you said, Chemisse Dec 2012 #59

You say it isn't clear, and then list no other alternatives hoboken123 Dec 2012 #67

Actually, I did mention alternatives. davidthegnome Dec 2012 #77

Adoption is not harmless to the children victimized by it n/t me b zola Dec 2012 #64

that depends.... actslikeacarrot Dec 2012 #65

No it doesn't. me b zola Dec 2012 #66

While that may be true, it's also irrelevant. Xithras Dec 2012 #72

It is completely relevant for this reason: me b zola Dec 2012 #79

I've known many young women who adopted children out. That's true for NONE of them. Xithras Dec 2012 #89

So you support the idea that abortion should be chosen over adoption. Lionessa Dec 2012 #75

I support a woman's right to make an informed choice. n/t me b zola Dec 2012 #80

Post removed Post removed Dec 2012 #82

I am one of four... actslikeacarrot Dec 2012 #104

I am one of many me b zola Dec 2012 #109

Why should she be an incubator, HockeyMom Dec 2012 #101

I think it's great that we live in a country where people can make that kind of choice slackmaster Dec 2012 #54

Actually, it appears no one broke the law, Lionessa Dec 2012 #76

It's called pro-choice for a reason. LisaL Dec 2012 #98

She was 7 months pregnant when she decided Nikia Dec 2012 #100

The article really lacks much of the story behind what happened davidpdx Dec 2012 #93

A lot more information in these articles Tumbulu Dec 2012 #99

I wonder if legal charges could be made avebury Dec 2012 #108