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In reply to the discussion: Armslist Lawsuit Seeks to Punish Online Gun Seller, Narrow Loophoole in Law [View all]
petronius
(26,696 posts)68. You need to go back and reread what X-Digger said in post 37:
There is no claim there that firearms and ammunition can not be taxed, obviously there is a wide range of permissible taxes and fees already applied to firearms-related paraphernalia.
What is likely to be found unconstitutional is the intentional use of taxation as a tool to restrict, limit, infringe on, or de facto ban a civil right or liberty - which is why your proposed $100/round tax would never fly, although general sales taxes and so on are perfectly OK.
What worries me most about these discussions - for example, the ammo-tax proposal in Chicago - is not that they would ever pass, but rather that the battle over a proposal like this would endanger the Pittman-Robertson Act, a tax which I support (although I fear that as shooting sports become less centered on hunting and the outdoors, general support among firearms owners might wane)...
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Armslist Lawsuit Seeks to Punish Online Gun Seller, Narrow Loophoole in Law [View all]
Judi Lynn
Dec 2012
OP
Re: prosecute the assholes that knowingly sell guns to people they shouldn't
Trunk Monkey
Dec 2012
#28
Private citizens CANNOT legally access the BATF instant-background check system
NickB79
Dec 2012
#30
This is not true. You can ship to someone IN YOUR STATE without a background check.
Atypical Liberal
Dec 2012
#6
This article is misleading. There is nothing special about what Armslist is doing.
Atypical Liberal
Dec 2012
#7
I do but the topic has been discussed so often over the last 11 years that I've become weary of
jody
Dec 2012
#22
We agree on those points. DoJ has the most credible data but even that depends on reports submitted
jody
Dec 2012
#24
Who knew?! Apparently public support of a position is a 'right wing talking point'! *snort* n/t
X_Digger
Dec 2012
#213
The same Yellow Dogs who wrecked havoc four years ago who are now out of office
DainBramaged
Dec 2012
#219
You claimed Democrats support was 60-70%. So now you are engaged in bullshit.
Warren Stupidity
Dec 2012
#272
Your view of the right thing and the views of others on what is the right thing diverge to the
ProgressiveProfessor
Dec 2012
#58
Like I said, you need those lines because the gun culture will push it to satisfy their needs.
Hoyt
Dec 2012
#70
Sad that you can't support Obama and the Democratic Party because they both support
jody
Dec 2012
#12
And there are ways to avoid that which have been discussed here numerous times.
PavePusher
Dec 2012
#205
If you really care when you sell a weapon, go through FFL. It's really that simple.
Hoyt
Dec 2012
#206
We'll eventually get meaningful gun control because the country is turning Blue, Democratic.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#37
Baloney - there is a federal excise tax on ammo right now, as well as state taxes.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#43
Now comes the subject-changing: no on is talking about McDonald. We are talking about
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#60
No: you just ignore the fact that Congress has power to tax ammunition. When it was pointed out
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#65
"You realize you're promoting an unconstitutional measure, right?" <--X_Digger's words.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#101
Congress could raise the tax on ammo to whatever it wanted regardless of motive, and it would pass
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#107
I've addressed the "right now" portion, repeatedly. (presumptively constitutional before challenge,)
X_Digger
Dec 2012
#96
"You realize you're promoting an unconstitutional measure, right?" <--X_Digger's words.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#100
"You realize you're promoting an unconstitutional measure, right?" <--Full quote, un-chopped. Link:
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#112
No need: unlike you, I stand by my words and posts. But keep dodging: the link ain't going away:
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#116
So, is the Congressional tax on ammo constitutional, or not? Answer the straight question. n/t.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#165
Then why were poll taxes ruled unconstitutional in some places before the 24th amendment?
X_Digger
Dec 2012
#77
Non responsive. We are talking about Congress's power to tax ammunition, not "poll" taxes.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#78
We're talking about congress' power to tax. Which you keep falling back on, as though it's absolute.
X_Digger
Dec 2012
#80
You are the one that said Congress could not tax ammo; I pointed out it could and does. You keep
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#83
"You realize you're promoting an unconstitutional measure, right?" <--X_Digger's words.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#88
No, you can't restrict a fundamental right by taxation *just because you don't like it. * also mine.
X_Digger
Dec 2012
#90
Congress could raise the tax on ammo to whatever it wanted regardless of motive, and it would pass
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#94
"You realize you're promoting an unconstitutional measure, right?" <--X_Digger's words.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#106
No, you can't restrict a fundamental right by taxation *just because you don't like it. * also mine.
X_Digger
Dec 2012
#121
Congress could raise the tax on ammo to whatever it wanted, and the courts would affirm it.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#125
Congress could raise the tax on ammo to whatever it wanted, and the courts would affirm it.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#132
Is the Congressional tax on ammo constitutional, or not? Answer the straight question. n/t.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#166
Congress could raise the tax on ammo to whatever it wanted, and the courts would affirm it.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#222
The discussion is not about poll taxes; quit trying to change the subject. I am telling you again:
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#225
I posted before the shooting was announced. You replied 3 hours later - after the shooting.
hack89
Dec 2012
#226
I answered YOUR question; you could have used JUDGEMENT and thought "today, I'm not going
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#229
Why in the face of such tragedy was my question that important that you couldn't ignore it?
hack89
Dec 2012
#230
I answered YOUR question; you could have used JUDGEMENT and thought "today, I'm not going
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#231
I answered your unsolicited question; you chose to keep the argument going. And are continuing to do
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#235
You INITIATED the conversation; hell, my post above wasn't addressed to you! But keep
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#232
NO: I answered your unsolicited question. You could have chosen decency and discretion, and simply
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#236
"Now I am merely curious just how long I can string you along" - it's all a game to you, isn't it?
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#245
Once again: I answered YOUR question; you could have used JUDGEMENT and thought
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#241
NO: I answered your unsolicited question. You could have chosen decency and discretion, and simply
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#247
No one was "thinking about" you: I answered your unsolicited question. You chose at that time
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#252
NO: I answered your unsolicited question. You could have chosen decency and discretion, and simply
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#258
"Now I am merely curious just how long I can string you along" - hack89, having fun on a tragic day.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#264
You INITIATED the conversation; my post above wasn't even addressed to you.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#243
Before the shooting. You came back 3 hours after the shooting to pick a fight. nt
hack89
Dec 2012
#246
But go right ahead and keep peddling those pro-NRA talking points: the rest of DU is getting
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#254
You wanting to continue an argument about taxes on ammo from the NRA point of view
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#259
I answered your unsolicited question; you are still here at it, peddling NRA talking points. n/t
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#266
"Now I am merely curious just how long I can string you along" - hack89, on why he continues to
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#267
"this is my last post on the matter" <--hack89, Post #230. Too eager to keep the NRA talking points
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#268
"Now I am merely curious just how long I can string you along" - it's all a game to our Gungeoneers,
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#262
"Now I am merely curious just how long I can string you along" - hack89, having fun on a tragic day.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#263
Wrong: YOU take the tax that is imposed on ammo RIGHT NOW to court, and try to
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#63
Congress could raise the tax on ammo to whatever it wanted, and the courts would affirm it.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#223
Interesting, you didn't post a link to summary of the case - but, then, not really:
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#49
And where's the part about how they can't tax ammunition? Oooooh, that's right:
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#59
We're not talking about "discrimination": we're talking about Congress's power to impose a tax
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#64
I say Congress has the constitutional authority to tax ammo, you say they don't. Go get you a
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#71
Again trying to change the subject; not gonna happen. Again, Congress has the power to tax
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#82
"You realize you're promoting an unconstitutional measure, right?" <--X_Digger's words.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#87
No, you can't restrict a fundamental right by taxation *just because you don't like it. * also mine.
X_Digger
Dec 2012
#92
Congress could raise the tax on ammo to whatever it wanted regardless of motive, and it would pass
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#98
Congress could raise the tax on AMMO to whatever it wanted regardless of motive, and it would pass
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#104
So, is the Congressional tax on ammo constitutional, or not? Answer the straight question. n/t.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#164
So, what's stopping you? Get you a lawyer and sue the Feds! If you are so confident that
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#66
Hey, you're the one who made the claim that such a tax is unconstitutional. It's not, of course:
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#73
Let's not. You claim Congress has no power to tax ammunition, Congress claims it does, and taxes
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#79
"You realize you're promoting an unconstitutional measure, right?" <--X_Digger's words.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#86
Ahhh, the old "I didn't mean what I typed" defense. Sure. There's time to edit your post on DU3,
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#91
I plainly quoted your own words back to you un-edited and un-"choppped": there's still time to edit
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#95
Nope: quoted you directly, YOUR words. Either own them or edit them. n/t.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#99
"You realize you're promoting an unconstitutional measure, right?" <--X_Digger's words.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#103
"You realize you're promoting an unconstitutional measure, right?" <--X_Digger's words.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#111
Are you seriously saying you didn't read the body of the post you're regurgitating?
X_Digger
Dec 2012
#113
Trying to change the subject again: I would too, were I you. Own your words or edit them. n/t.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#114
BTW, Congress could raise the tax on ammo to whatever it wanted, and the courts would affirm it.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#122
You've been "out of material" since your opening reply was proven false. Link:
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#134
No need: unlike you, I stand by my words and posts. But keep dodging: the link ain't going away:
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#136
Congress could raise the tax on ammo to whatever it wanted, and the courts would affirm it.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#140
No, it's because Congress has the right to tax ammo to its heart's content, and there's not a court
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#143
So, if Congress did raise to $100 a box you'd be okay with it because of the "PR Act"? Great!
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#144
Good: at least you now concede Congress CAN tax ammunition, after all those posts to the contrary
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#151
Not a bit of it: you declared such taxes "unconstitutional" in this reply:
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#160
"You realize you're promoting an unconstitutional measure, right?" <--X_Digger's words.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#175
Of course, if Congress raised it to a $100 a round you'd have to be "fine with it," too, or find
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#153
No, congress would have to justify such an increase to meet the burden of strict scrutiny.
X_Digger
Dec 2012
#155
No, it wouldn't. Congress could raise it to a MILLION dollars a round, and the courts
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#169
Also, this post, where X_Digger claims Congress can't tax ammo, even though Congress does:
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#145
"You realize you're promoting an unconstitutional measure, right?" <--X_Digger's words.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#152
Congress could raise the tax on ammo to whatever it wanted, and the courts would affirm it.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#158
I am quoting the complete sentence from your subject line; you can quit pretending anything is being
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#163
You initiated this entire sub-thread by claiming that my tax proposal was "unconstitutional": when
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#156
All laws / taxes / regs are constitutional until they aren't. That's not semantics, that's history.
X_Digger
Dec 2012
#159
So, is the Congressional tax on ammo constitutional, or not? Answer the straight question. n/t.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#161
All legislative acts are presumed to be constitutional until they're ruled as not. (procedure aside)
X_Digger
Dec 2012
#177
BTW, you did declare such taxes "unconstitutional" (link below with money quote):
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#176
No, actually, I didn't declare such taxes unconstitutional.. just your proposal..
X_Digger
Dec 2012
#179
My "proposal" is already constitutional because ammo is already taxed: my proposal would
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#182
Circular reasoning- by that *cough* logic, no law would ever be unconstitutional because it passed.
X_Digger
Dec 2012
#186
No, it is not "circular reasoning": I don't think you understand what "circular reasoning" is.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#199
"is already constitutional because ammo is already taxed" -- therefore, any law that is implemented
X_Digger
Dec 2012
#207
NO, it is not: again, you simply do not grasp the concept of what it means to engage in "circular
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#221
Is the Congressional tax on ammo constitutional, or not? Answer the question put to you.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#174
The law taxing ammo - no matter how high the rate was increased - would never be found
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#178
Congress's taxing power isn't absolute. What gives you the notion that it is? n/t
X_Digger
Dec 2012
#180
Is the Congressional tax on ammo constitutional, or not? Answer the question put to you.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#181
Quit dodging: is the tax on ammo constitutional, or nay? It's not a hard question,
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#185
"It is constitutional until it isn't" - Pretty much sums it up your bizarre pretzel-logic throughout
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#194
But this entire sub-thread was started by your insistence that such taxation was "unconstitutional":
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#187
"You realize you're promoting an unconstitutional measure, right?" <--X_Digger's words.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#195
"And with that, I'm done." - You were done a long time ago, as the facts are on my side.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#196
We certainly wouldn't want "undesirables" to be able to afford to buy dangerous weapons
slackmaster
Dec 2012
#40
I see now why you quietly self-deleted that reply where you promised to ignore my posts.
apocalypsehow
Dec 2012
#45
Everyone knows that you are a master baiter, and I'm not going to fall for it.
slackmaster
Dec 2012
#127