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silverweb

(16,410 posts)

42. Talk about turning the truth on its head!

Mon Jan 30, 2012, 02:44 PM

Jan 2012

[font color="navy" face="Verdana"]"...it forced employers at church-linked organizations to violate their conscience."

Nooooooo, it would force employers to violate their conscience if it was mandated that they personally or members of their immediate family had to purchase or take some form of birth control.

This is the same bullshit argument that the fundies use to claim it is their "religious liberty" at stake when they are told they're not allowed to harass, abuse, and discriminate against gays.

Bottom line
(1) If you don't believe in contraception, then don't use it; that's your religious freedom.
(2) Every other person has exactly the same freedom as you to make their own choice; that's their religious freedom, which you have no right to dictate.

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Highlight:

Catholics hear anti-Obama letter in church [View all] IDemo Jan 2012 OP

Why I had to quit going to mass Lifelong Protester Jan 2012 #1

We should do the same thing. pamela Jan 2012 #16

The religious need to take these arguments to their ministers and their church's board of directors saras Jan 2012 #41

Exactly...........but TEF Jan 2012 #56

The Church of Satan Galraedia Jan 2012 #96

Please don't associate the GOP with satanism. boppers Jan 2012 #150

What is a "right-wing" church? AlbertCat Jan 2012 #168

Tax em right out of existence liberalnationalist Feb 2012 #203

2006: Sen Obama’s “Call to Renewal” speech at Sojourners’ Conference in DC Tx4obama Jan 2012 #108

Thanks for the link! pamela Jan 2012 #147

I didn't hear that Sunday - but then my parish is pretty much Vatican II! hedgehog Jan 2012 #2

Don't confuse a bit of good prejudice with inconvenient facts gratuitous Jan 2012 #17

I couldn't agree more! CountAllVotes Jan 2012 #37

So, then, he's not Catholic... brooklynite Jan 2012 #72

wtf? CountAllVotes Jan 2012 #101

98 percent of Catholic women use or have used birth control including abortions Guy Montag Jan 2012 #82

I don't believe abortion is viewed by most women as a form of "birth control". n/t whathehell Jan 2012 #116

How else would you classify it? PassingFair Jan 2012 #119

A "last resort" form of it, maybe whathehell Jan 2012 #157

Four out of ten women who get involved with an accidental pregnancy get abortions. Guy Montag Jan 2012 #176

As has been stated, 98% of Catholic women in America already PRACTICE birth control, whathehell Feb 2012 #190

The poster said "including abortions"... PassingFair Jan 2012 #177

You read it again.. whathehell Jan 2012 #188

I did read it again. PassingFair Feb 2012 #191

Then read this as many times as needed: whathehell Feb 2012 #193

Well at least THAT'S over. PassingFair Feb 2012 #199

I was ready for it to be over awhile ago! whathehell Feb 2012 #204

Couldn"t agree with you more.... Tippy Jan 2012 #174

To me, it doesn't matter if your own particular church/priest is liberal Arugula Latte Feb 2012 #195

How do you know that I give them money? CountAllVotes Feb 2012 #196

Because the leadership of the Catholic Church is malevolent, and imposes itself Arugula Latte Feb 2012 #200

I agree liberalnationalist Feb 2012 #202

How do you know that I give them money? CountAllVotes Feb 2012 #205

I didn't hear any letter read emilyg Jan 2012 #134

This is the first I've heard of it. Brigid Jan 2012 #21

Same here.... TEF Jan 2012 #57

There Is A Separation DallasNE Jan 2012 #55

Religion and common sense are immiscible n/t VWolf Jan 2012 #3

I was told Obama was gonna cave on this, on this very website. nt msanthrope Jan 2012 #4

Tax churches. Zoeisright Jan 2012 #5

+++! I bet many of the attendees oppose welfare for po' folk yet have no problem with church welfare alp227 Jan 2012 #14

No I don't think that is so at all. Many catholics support birth control medications. We don't southernyankeebelle Jan 2012 #19

Many women take birth control to correct gynecological problems. The Wielding Truth Jan 2012 #53

Yes that is true also. southernyankeebelle Jan 2012 #64

Those are called "hormones". boppers Jan 2012 #151

True. southernyankeebelle Jan 2012 #152

aren't they disallowed from practicing politics? barbtries Jan 2012 #6

Only if it's in the form of not demonizing a Democrat/liberal ... zbdent Jan 2012 #11

Funny stuff! TEF Jan 2012 #86

They didn't say one word about it in our church Gman Jan 2012 #7

If Catholics don't agree with the birth control benefits, then don't use them. bulloney Jan 2012 #8

Tax exempt status? Rambis Jan 2012 #9

If they don't comply, then tax them. thecrow Jan 2012 #24

They are not even close to jeopardizing their tax exempt status hack89 Jan 2012 #51

Last time I was there they passed a special plate for Dan Quayle Rambis Jan 2012 #58

I don't get it. Are they afraid if they provided the coverage.... Bonhomme Richard Jan 2012 #10

So ... they're okay with saying how the government spends their money ... zbdent Jan 2012 #12

religion is all about hypocrisy Skittles Jan 2012 #70

'around the country,' huh? I talked to three Catholics from three churches and none heard it. nt onehandle Jan 2012 #13

This is the 21st Century. Health care should be focused on creating best practices via science. HuckleB Jan 2012 #15

WENT TO MASS FOR THE FIRST TIME IN A YEAR YESTERDAY Beer Snob-50 Jan 2012 #18

The solution to these groups problems - TAXATION! liberal N proud Jan 2012 #20

+1,000,000,000,000 HuckleB Jan 2012 #23

Taxing churches would be a good start..... Magoo48 Jan 2012 #26

They already are taxed if they try to play in politics cstanleytech Jan 2012 #29

hen 501c3's lose their tax exempt status, they end up paying property taxes. Critters2 Jan 2012 #139

This message was self-deleted by its author cstanleytech Jan 2012 #155

Note: Never post on a forum when you wake up without first drinking a cup of coffee or two !!!! cstanleytech Jan 2012 #185

Curiosity officially piqued! Critters2 Jan 2012 #187

LOL cstanleytech Feb 2012 #189

Unrec. - broadbrush. emilyg Jan 2012 #135

One of the reasons why I stopped attending church richmwill Jan 2012 #22

I'm Catholic EC Jan 2012 #25

When religion collides with public health policy... ehrnst Jan 2012 #27

The church apparently considers WAR CRIMES to be less offensive. /nt iamtechus Jan 2012 #28

Well....considering alot of said war crimes were either commited in the name of a religion and or by cstanleytech Jan 2012 #31

Not "the church." The hierarchy. pnwmom Jan 2012 #111

Okay atreides1 Jan 2012 #115

The arrogance of the Bishops Heathen57 Jan 2012 #30

Remove their tax-exempt status NOW Hugabear Jan 2012 #32

They only have to be neutral concerning endorsements of specific candidates. ehrnst Jan 2012 #34

According to the OP, they are opposing President Obama. nt ZombieHorde Jan 2012 #71

They are opposing an action of the Obama administration ehrnst Jan 2012 #113

But if they talk about those issues & specific legislation in an extremely selective way, how are we patrice Jan 2012 #102

There is a difference between political and supporting a candidate ehrnst Jan 2012 #112

This crosses the line. They spoke against a candidate for elective office. Critters2 Jan 2012 #140

They said nothing about voting - only to petition against the legislation. ehrnst Jan 2012 #163

+1 onenote Jan 2012 #179

Then, I'm sure that all Catholics will decline the coverage for birth control. The law sinkingfeeling Jan 2012 #33

I was just reading the head of hhs's memo on the rules Beer Snob-50 Jan 2012 #35

Hey Catholics Politicalboi Jan 2012 #36

I find it disheartening that every time the Catholic church is mentioned in a post Beer Snob-50 Jan 2012 #39

Why distract from the actual issue with a red herring like that? HuckleB Jan 2012 #40

because ... CountAllVotes Jan 2012 #43

You make me laugh _ed_ Jan 2012 #156

My religion is not your concern CountAllVotes Jan 2012 #175

Well, I'll sleep well tonight _ed_ Feb 2012 #192

Quit talking about people you do not know CountAllVotes Feb 2012 #194

Nonsense _ed_ Feb 2012 #197

You know nothing about me CountAllVotes Feb 2012 #198

Hate. Others hope for HONEST reform and, ergo, the universal blessing of LIFE-giving freedom. nt patrice Jan 2012 #75

A lot of people don't know that a commission appointed by the Vatican had libinnyandia Jan 2012 #38

I hadn't heard that naaman fletcher Jan 2012 #133

Google pontifical commission on birth control libinnyandia Jan 2012 #165

thanks naaman fletcher Jan 2012 #166

Talk about turning the truth on its head! silverweb Jan 2012 #42

They don't understand what rights are: If you have right x, then I have it too; if I don't have patrice Jan 2012 #46

They understand it just fine. silverweb Jan 2012 #48

PRIVATE standards being FORCED upon the use of PUBLIC dollars! The use of birth-control is a CHOICE. patrice Jan 2012 #44

Bull! They are asking freedom to discriminate against taxpayers who don't adhere to their beliefs. freshwest Jan 2012 #45

Not here davidthegnome Jan 2012 #47

Not True TEF Jan 2012 #49

"Nice try DU"? IDemo Jan 2012 #54

No..... TEF Jan 2012 #65

Don't put words in my mouth IDemo Jan 2012 #117

This was reported on our local news, from Chicago, too. nt Critters2 Jan 2012 #142

Confirming ....Same place I first heard it too lunasun Jan 2012 #145

My experience is that it rarely comes from clergy, but often comes from lay leaders representing patrice Jan 2012 #66

That sucks.... TEF Jan 2012 #74

I phone-bank in most election years; people say all sorts of things, especially when they are patrice Jan 2012 #76

Also > Regarding lay Catholic political activism: patrice Jan 2012 #77

Also also: patrice Jan 2012 #79

. HuckleB Jan 2012 #130

Do you really attend Mass? HuckleB Jan 2012 #88

Yes. TEF Jan 2012 #95

I'm not buying what you're selling. HuckleB Jan 2012 #97

The word you want is "hear" mrs_p Jan 2012 #129

seriously? onenote Jan 2012 #180

And how is your post any different from the post you responded too? HuckleB Jan 2012 #183

Well, let's see onenote Jan 2012 #184

Actually, no. mrs_p Feb 2012 #201

tax exempt? evilhime Jan 2012 #50

I'd bet none of them authentically represent the other side of the issue, so it doesn't qualify as patrice Jan 2012 #69

Really...? TEF Jan 2012 #52

The story is from CBS News. You claim it is not true yet you offer no proof. Bluenorthwest Jan 2012 #59

The story is from Business Insider Renew Deal Jan 2012 #61

I still don't see any refutation of the reported facts... Bluenorthwest Jan 2012 #62

Reported "Facts"....? TEF Jan 2012 #68

"Catholics across the country were read...."p jberryhill Jan 2012 #141

the church i was at this past sunday did read the letter Beer Snob-50 Jan 2012 #60

I never..... TEF Jan 2012 #80

Unfortunately, the widespread press on this issue indicates otherwise. HuckleB Jan 2012 #132

You have no basis for refutation jberryhill Jan 2012 #143

It would be best for you not to make guesses. You're not very good at it. DisgustipatedinCA Jan 2012 #63

How so..? TEF Jan 2012 #84

See Post 18... HuckleB Jan 2012 #67

What..? TEF Jan 2012 #83

In other words, you didn't read any of the links. HuckleB Jan 2012 #85

Post removed Post removed Jan 2012 #91

Hmm. HuckleB Jan 2012 #93

Joined today, only posted in this thread, and ended up repeating a RW meme muriel_volestrangler Jan 2012 #105

+1 HuckleB Jan 2012 #121

The priest at our church read the letter. WIProgressive88 Jan 2012 #144

most catholics use birth control. DesertFlower Jan 2012 #73

Most of the Catholics I know who are/were on birth control don't/didn't bother to refuse communion. HuckleB Jan 2012 #87

i'm 70 years old. i used birth control and DesertFlower Jan 2012 #100

Oh, I get it. HuckleB Jan 2012 #120

What....?! TEF Jan 2012 #89

Are you joking? HuckleB Jan 2012 #94

i don't have statistics, but DesertFlower Jan 2012 #98

I quit going to church ellie Jan 2012 #78

AND sold it's soul for a chance to name a SCOTUS justice the price of which was WAR on innocent patrice Jan 2012 #81

Time to forget that tax-exempt status. Vinca Jan 2012 #90

Singled out TEF Jan 2012 #92

Except that the evidence that it did happen all across the country is clear. HuckleB Jan 2012 #99

Seems like your disagreement has to do with the meaning of 'around the country' Demit Jan 2012 #160

ESPECIALLY!!! since they are seeking CONTROL of TAX SUPPORTED services. nt patrice Jan 2012 #104

why didn't newt and callista have children? DesertFlower Jan 2012 #103

Wasn't Newt's face and physique enough? zbdent Jan 2012 #169

Yet the Church can keep you alive even when your Directive says not to. glinda Jan 2012 #106

Yeah I dont care what their hospitals offer becuz I try to stay very far away lunasun Jan 2012 #146

Here's an example of the letter. I don't agree with it, but I also don't have a problem with it onenote Jan 2012 #107

This is the main reason I quit the Catholic Church. TxVietVet Jan 2012 #109

The church is wrong LuckyTheDog Jan 2012 #110

I think there's a bit of oportunistic exaggerating going on eyewall Jan 2012 #114

Every single church that read that to their congregation Thumper79 Jan 2012 #118

In this case they arern't breaking the rules eyewall Jan 2012 #122

You wouldn't, I hope, say the same thing onenote Jan 2012 #137

Tax the Churches. Tax the Corporations owned by the Churches - F. Zappa Flagrante Jan 2012 #123

The problem with religion Pakid Jan 2012 #124

All of the world's problems are caused by Religion.... lib2DaBone Jan 2012 #125

As an ardent secularist, I still would not say that ALL of the world's problems are caused by any LeftishBrit Jan 2012 #154

Nonsense. n/t Johnson20 Jan 2012 #162

Sounds like time for them to pay taxes. n/t datadiva Jan 2012 #126

Tax them! They want to lobby their members, fine, but take their tax-exempt status away! Doremus Jan 2012 #127

Can you get a copy of that letter? sarcasmo Jan 2012 #159

Yes I can. Doremus Jan 2012 #181

Cool, it would be nice to get this out on the web, Thanks. sarcasmo Jan 2012 #182

Here it is. Doremus Jan 2012 #186

Dear Catholic ecclesiastical authorities: Deep13 Jan 2012 #128

At least in some areas of the country I think this kind of dogmatic BS from the Catholic church jimlup Jan 2012 #131

I quit going to mass in 2004 because of shit like this K8-EEE Jan 2012 #136

What percentage of American Catholics do you think would disapprove of birth control? JDPriestly Jan 2012 #138

I was at Mass yesterday and heard nothing about this. Harry Monroe Jan 2012 #148

Are Catholics less fertile these days? colddayinhell Jan 2012 #149

That is disgusting... LeftishBrit Jan 2012 #153

Tax exempt status should have been taken away years ago. sarcasmo Jan 2012 #158

For the same reason that UU churches and African American Churches and progressive churches onenote Jan 2012 #170

I heard that... GTurck Jan 2012 #161

an 8th gr. student mentioned this letter to me wordpix Jan 2012 #164

An acceptable method of Catholic birth control Zambero Jan 2012 #167

THe IRS needs to start taxing these bastards. ALL political churches. catbyte Jan 2012 #171

Including Unitarian Universalist? Including African American churches onenote Jan 2012 #178

That should lose them their tax exempt status. jwirr Jan 2012 #172

Time to start taxing churches. Jankyn Jan 2012 #173