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In reply to the discussion: Gun Violence Costs U.S. Health Care System, Taxpayers Billions Each Year [View all]hack89
(39,181 posts)80. Very seldom is a legal gun owner involve
Turns out that criminal acts of various sorts are how guns get into the hands of criminals
In fact, there are a number of sources that allow guns to fall into the wrong hands, with gun thefts at the bottom of the list. Wachtel says one of the most common ways criminals get guns is through straw purchase sales. A straw purchase occurs when someone who may not legally acquire a firearm, or who wants to do so anonymously, has a companion buy it on their behalf. According to a 1994 ATF study on "Sources of Crime Guns in Southern California," many straw purchases are conducted in an openly "suggestive" manner where two people walk into a gun store, one selects a firearm, and then the other uses identification for the purchase and pays for the gun. Or, several underage people walk into a store and an adult with them makes the purchases. Both of these are illegal activities.
The next biggest source of illegal gun transactions where criminals get guns are sales made by legally licensed but corrupt at-home and commercial gun dealers. Several recent reports back up Wachtel's own studies about this, and make the case that illegal activity by those licensed to sell guns, known as Federal Firearms Licensees (FFLs), is a huge source of crime guns and greatly surpasses the sale of guns stolen from John Q. Citizen. Like bank robbers, who are interested in banks, gun traffickers are interested in FFLs because that's where the guns are. This is why FFLs are a large source of illegal guns for traffickers, who ultimately wind up selling the guns on the street.
The report goes on to state that "over-the-counter purchases are not the only means by which guns reach the illegal market from FFLs" and reveals that 23,775 guns have been reported lost, missing or stolen from FFLs since September 13, 1994, when a new law took effect requiring dealers to report gun thefts within 48 hours. This makes the theft of 6,000 guns reported in the CIR/Frontline show "Hot Guns" only 25% of all cases reported to ATF in the past two and one-half years.
Another large source of guns used in crimes are unlicensed street dealers who either get their guns through illegal transactions with licensed dealers, straw purchases, or from gun thefts. These illegal dealers turn around and sell these illegally on the street. An additional way criminals gain access to guns is family and friends, either through sales, theft or as gifts.
The next biggest source of illegal gun transactions where criminals get guns are sales made by legally licensed but corrupt at-home and commercial gun dealers. Several recent reports back up Wachtel's own studies about this, and make the case that illegal activity by those licensed to sell guns, known as Federal Firearms Licensees (FFLs), is a huge source of crime guns and greatly surpasses the sale of guns stolen from John Q. Citizen. Like bank robbers, who are interested in banks, gun traffickers are interested in FFLs because that's where the guns are. This is why FFLs are a large source of illegal guns for traffickers, who ultimately wind up selling the guns on the street.
The report goes on to state that "over-the-counter purchases are not the only means by which guns reach the illegal market from FFLs" and reveals that 23,775 guns have been reported lost, missing or stolen from FFLs since September 13, 1994, when a new law took effect requiring dealers to report gun thefts within 48 hours. This makes the theft of 6,000 guns reported in the CIR/Frontline show "Hot Guns" only 25% of all cases reported to ATF in the past two and one-half years.
Another large source of guns used in crimes are unlicensed street dealers who either get their guns through illegal transactions with licensed dealers, straw purchases, or from gun thefts. These illegal dealers turn around and sell these illegally on the street. An additional way criminals gain access to guns is family and friends, either through sales, theft or as gifts.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/guns/procon/guns.html
So explain to me why I am responsible for the criminal actions of others? You don't really care do you - all gun owners are borderline criminals to you.
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Gun Violence Costs U.S. Health Care System, Taxpayers Billions Each Year [View all]
onehandle
Mar 2013
OP
No, you should take it as being the point. No insurance company is going to insure all the nut jobs
Hoyt
Mar 2013
#81
You don't have insurance that covers you if you shoot someone who doesn't deserve it.
Hoyt
Mar 2013
#86
We'll, you can be required to post a bond. Lots of ways to make gun cultists cover
Hoyt
Mar 2013
#90
It is an umbrella liability policy from the company I get all my insurance from.
hack89
Mar 2013
#125
Sounds like car or homeowners and not what I'm talking about. If it doesn't cover at the limits
freshwest
Mar 2013
#126
And how much of your premium goes to fund the medical costs of gun violence Americans pay for?
baldguy
Mar 2013
#104
But it won't work the way you want if insurance companies treat gun owners like other customers
hack89
Mar 2013
#75
There are significant Federal taxes on guns and ammo - it goes to environmental projects
hack89
Mar 2013
#16
I am constantly surprised how little many gun controllers know about our present gun laws.
hack89
Mar 2013
#27
I am asking you for a dollar figure for what you mean by "significant" and you resort to insults.
SunSeeker
Mar 2013
#33
No, I asked "How much, in actual dollar figures, do these "significant" taxes bring in?"
SunSeeker
Mar 2013
#43
You said, "There are significant Federal taxes on guns and ammo - it goes to environmental projects"
SunSeeker
Mar 2013
#53
Unless the criminals are going directly to the popgun factories and stealing them from there,
IveWornAHundredPants
Mar 2013
#76
No - a straw purchaser is a criminal too. And criminals do steal guns from homes.
hack89
Mar 2013
#77
Not some of the money, ALL of the money. Tax them enough to cover the costs to taxpayers. nt
SunSeeker
Mar 2013
#24
If you can get it though Congress and the Supreme court then I will willingly pay. nt
hack89
Mar 2013
#38
How many decades have repukes been expecting Scalia and his buds to overturn Roe v Wade?
hack89
Mar 2013
#42
I see you never miss an opportunity for an insult, even when your insult makes no sense.
SunSeeker
Mar 2013
#54
The point being that the composition of the court is no indication of what they will do.
hack89
Mar 2013
#57
Such small prices to pay for the joy, liberty, and freedom to pack heat and be able to blow others
indepat
Mar 2013
#59
If we're willing to confront the effect of bad diets, lack of exercise, smoking...
CBHagman
Mar 2013
#70