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rlegro

(342 posts)
8. Moment of zen
Thu Jun 6, 2013, 04:39 PM
Jun 2013

I'm not happy about the NSA program, although that's been true since well before Obama. And it's not because I am convinced they're actually cataloging the content of all those phone calls, rather than the data concerning the sources and destinations. It's a matter of principle and a slippery slope, after all.

But what would any president do with that power? Use it. It's US law, however bad the law. Absent Congress reversing itself or a Supreme Court ruling against the law (likely, huh?), few commanders in chief would want to voluntarily constrain themselves. Go back in time four years. Obama is under heavy fire and has barely gotten to the point where he could pass meaningful legislation. Meanwhile, the tea party and GOP are screaming that Obama is a tyrant and, gasp!, a secret Muslim and thus a proto-terrorist. So say he doesn't use the full measure of powers granted him, there's a terrorist incident, and, boom, he's impeached. Of course, it was THEIR law that, more than anything, enabled whatever tyranny advanced under Obama's watch.

Maybe there's a saint of a policymaker out there who would have said, "Screw this shit; it's unconstitutional." But those guys are sadly few and far between, especially in high politics. Obama was protecting his flanks and using the powers at his command. I disagree with just how aggressive he has turned out to be, but it may have been the only thing granting him and not Mitt Romney this term in the White House. Better the devil you know.

But, moreover, we knew about this program while Bush was still in office; the Fourth Estate got worked up then. too, and the progressive response was pretty much the same. The difference? No one was going to take on Bush in any legal sense. And maybe they won't take on Obama, either, since the other side would like to still have this law on the books whenever they regain command. Arguably, if you're Obama, the very best way to get the law reformed or repealed is to actually USE it.

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0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

So, he evolved? theaocp Jun 2013 #1
Devolution DJ13 Jun 2013 #5
Q: are we not men? frylock Jun 2013 #22
No! DJ13 Jun 2013 #30
Fierce Advocate blkmusclmachine Jun 2013 #23
Bush's biggest flaws (besides his ideology) was the way he surrounded himself with people who were Freddie Stubbs Jun 2013 #38
so what made him change his mind? OKNancy Jun 2013 #2
What makes you think he changed his mind? hugo_from_TN Jun 2013 #12
Political expediency. blkmusclmachine Jun 2013 #24
It's different when you're the one with the power! marshall Jun 2013 #13
Abolish the Patriot Act sulphurdunn Jun 2013 #3
But the spooks run the show. blkmusclmachine Jun 2013 #25
LOL! President Obama put Candidate Obama on ice once the nomination was assured: Poll_Blind Jun 2013 #4
. rhett o rick Jun 2013 #10
I believe an important part of being liberal is being more reflective on yourself and your beliefs DuaneBidoux Jun 2013 #6
With all due respect rlegro Jun 2013 #28
Obama - "No more Illegal Wire Tapping of American Citizens" Purveyor Jun 2013 #7
Billing records are different than recording call content Paulie Jun 2013 #9
PRISM kinda makes you sound quaint there. n/t Psephos Jun 2013 #35
How so? News is saying PRISM is targeted against foreign calls Paulie Jun 2013 #36
"the NSA routinely collects a great deal of American content...described as incidental..." Psephos Jun 2013 #37
Are there accusations of "wiretapping"? My understanding is that only phone numbers were..... Tarheel_Dem Jun 2013 #11
Yes DJ13 Jun 2013 #14
It would be lame if they weren't.. the NSA has to fill those yotabytes somehow jakeXT Jun 2013 #15
Hi Tarheel, Just FYI Obama Administration Defends NSA Collection Of Phone Record.. Cha Jun 2013 #17
"It relates exclusively to metadata, such as a telephone number or the length of a call". Tarheel_Dem Jun 2013 #18
Oh you just have to listen to Cha Jun 2013 #19
I guess he's still doing penance for that one! He's a Repuke poser! Tarheel_Dem Jun 2013 #20
+1 - Greenwald is a putz Politicub Jun 2013 #32
You make a lot of sense. appacom Jun 2013 #33
+1. Welcome to DU. Tarheel_Dem Jun 2013 #34
We should respect the distinction. However... rlegro Jun 2013 #29
Because of the Patriot Act, it's legal Politicub Jun 2013 #31
This was not a wire tap Freddie Stubbs Jun 2013 #39
Moment of zen rlegro Jun 2013 #8
Or he could have simply ordered the NSA not to pursue the court order. Nimajneb Nilknarf Jun 2013 #16
. blkmusclmachine Jun 2013 #26
Woulda, coulda, shoulda, blkmusclmachine Jun 2013 #21
Larry Craig took a wide stance on the SAFE Act markiv Jun 2013 #27
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