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DallasNE

(8,001 posts)
38. We Agree On Some Things And Have A Different View On Other Things.
Sat Jun 29, 2013, 01:03 AM
Jun 2013

One correction however. The prosecution has to prove that Martin died at Zimmerman's hand. That is a given since not even Zimmerman denies that he shot Martin. Zimmerman cannot simply declare self defense, he must prove it -- not the other way around where the prosecution has to prove it wasn't self defense. If Zimmerman does not prove self defense then he is guilty of manslaughter at the minimum.

Too much of what the defense is claiming is pure speculation. They are speculating that the rain washed the blood off of the sidewalk and off of Martin's hands (which were under his body) yet did not wash the blood off of Zimmerman's head. Excuse me. Zimmerman is claiming that Martin was pounding his head into the sidewalk while Good is saying the person on top was raining down blows MMA style. The prosecution asked if he saw Martin also slamming his head into the sidewalk and Good said "no". How does that help the defense since it is at odds with what they are claiming. Expect the prosecution to point out the likelihood of mistaken identity on who was on top since the description does not support self defense for Zimmerman getting his head pounded into the sidewalk (where there is no blood) and the nature of the blows being struck (MMA style) supports it being Zimmerman on top. This testimony actually helps support the girlfriends testimony more than Zimmerman's defense if you allow for the possibility of mistaken identity in the dark. What the guy saw was basically silhouettes -- did he say whether Martins hood was up or down, for instance. O'Mara appeared blindsided by the MMA revelation and objected when the prosecutor brought it up. That is when it came out that Zimmerman acknowledged aerobics and when the medical examiner asked what kind and how often Zimmerman told her MMA 3 times a week for 3 hours (not clear whether that was 3 one-hour sessions or 3 sessions that were each 3 hours). Could Zimmerman have been hiding this important fact from his defense team?

I would say that if a jury had to decide today they would probably convict on the lesser charge of manslaughter. So far these are all prosecution witnesses and next week we get a bunch of the physical evidence and the expert testimony on how that evidence can be interpreted. Only after that do we get the defense witnesses. I suspect the MMA instructor will be asked to evaluate Zimmerman's MMA skills -- I think they allow late additions as witnesses when new things are discovered during testimony.

Lastly, I don't think you directly challenge an eye-witness on what they think they saw but in closing you point out how a piece of testimony just doesn't fit in with all of the other evidence and explain it away due to the darkness. If I am wrong on this then the prosecution did fumble by not challenging more strongly some of Good's testimony. Keep in mind we did not yet know about the MMA classes Zimmerman had been taking. Nobody thinks the nicks on the back of Zimmerman's head reflect anything but the results of the struggle. The minor scrapes on both sides of Zimmerman's head don't fit the pounding on the sidewalk so I don't understand O'Mara hitting that so hard. They were so minor the medical examiner missed them the next day. Were they old or self-inflected? We just differ on the importance of some of the evidence. I have no special insight so I could very well be misreading things but I think the prosecution has done a fine job to date. You see it differently. I'm fine with that.

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0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

I keep wanting to hug her. I hope someone is. aquart Jun 2013 #1
I could understand her completely Duer 157099 Jun 2013 #3
I feel the same way! LeftofObama Jun 2013 #4
I keep hoping the jury realized it was bullying the witness, plain and simple and that it was appleannie1 Jun 2013 #24
Agreed. 1monster Jun 2013 #5
After the disastrous Rachel Jeantel testimony now my prediction swings from acquittal to Hung Jury. alp227 Jun 2013 #2
Disastrous? Not to my mind. aquart Jun 2013 #6
Only one side has presented witnesses dpibel Jun 2013 #8
In this trial, it feels like every witness has been a defense witness (nt) Nye Bevan Jun 2013 #30
In your mind, yes. Most people don't live there. nft. dpibel Jun 2013 #37
Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2013 #9
I want to know why since Zimmy was trained in MMA, he keeps assuming it was TM who was doing that uppityperson Jun 2013 #7
He could only see downward movement of arms from the guy on top (Martin) Vattel Jun 2013 #10
how could the guy see anything as dark as it was? Blue_Roses Jun 2013 #11
So how do you explain Zimmerman's injuries? hack89 Jun 2013 #12
If Trayvon didn't have Zimmerman's DNA on him FunkyLeprechaun Jun 2013 #16
Ok - I doubt the prosecutor is going to run with that theory. nt hack89 Jun 2013 #18
if zimmerman's story is to be accepted.. frylock Jun 2013 #17
Because Trayvon lay exposed in the pouring rain for a while? hack89 Jun 2013 #19
tree branches? riverwalker Jun 2013 #22
That's a very good question! arcane1 Jun 2013 #26
Maybe the recoil of the gun caused the gun to smack GZ in the nose notadmblnd Jun 2013 #34
It is interesting that the prosecution hasn't made an issue of his wounds hack89 Jun 2013 #42
I still don't understand how Zimmy can be innocent of anything... WI_DEM Jun 2013 #13
exactly. Voice for Peace Jun 2013 #15
If the shooter was black tblue Jun 2013 #28
Nope.....nt BronxBoy Jun 2013 #32
He's very articulate and precise. He is allowed to have discrepencies in his testimony. kelliekat44 Jun 2013 #14
Ouch. Sad but true. n/t VWolf Jun 2013 #20
Also, he's, you know... yardwork Jun 2013 #46
Defense now fighting medical reports riverwalker Jun 2013 #21
they were? gejohnston Jun 2013 #39
The medical records show that GZ took martial arts (MMA) for exercise!!! Sancho Jun 2013 #45
All defense needs to do Iliyah Jun 2013 #23
That would be true if the prosecution were trying to put doubt in the minds of jurors Bjorn Against Jun 2013 #27
It Seems Zimmerman Went To MMA Sessions 3 Days A Week DallasNE Jun 2013 #25
exactly riverwalker Jun 2013 #29
I don't think John2 Jun 2013 #31
We Agree On Some Things And Have A Different View On Other Things. DallasNE Jun 2013 #38
Actually no, Good said he saw who was who. gejohnston Jun 2013 #40
Mr. Good's testimony on the subject gejohnston Jun 2013 #33
OK, so the State has finished? how many witnesses quadrature Jun 2013 #35
I absolutely understand how she felt. elleng Jun 2013 #36
Message auto-removed Name removed Jun 2013 #41
If I start a fight in a bar, and the guy defends himself, and I kill him... mainer Jun 2013 #43
Residents of the condo association have a strong motivation to help Zimmerman's acquittal. yardwork Jun 2013 #44
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