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MADem

(135,425 posts)

178. Very telling when you try to use accusations of bigotry to defend child trafficking.

Mon Oct 21, 2013, 11:02 AM

Oct 2013

Try reading the report I've provided for you--your simplistic apologies for criminal behavior just don't cut it with me.

Roma are both victims and perpetrators of human trafficking and enslavement. I fail to understand how you can suggest an element of bigotry when the same "folks" (since when is that word verboten? Any straw to grasp, I suppose) are both the criminals and the victims.

It's not "cultural"--it is a CRIME. And your attempt to deflect from the situation by trying to make it about me ain't cutting it.

You're going to have to show me--with documentation--where you get that "rom" stuff. I don't buy it. I've lived in northern and southern Europe and never once heard it.

Not sure what your agenda is, here, but you don't seem to grasp that slavery is not a cute little cultural tradition, it's against the law.

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Greek police appeal over mystery blonde girl [View all] Turborama Oct 2013 OP

I want to hear from the Roma family before considering judgment. delrem Oct 2013 #1

What exactly is it that you want to hear? LisaL Oct 2013 #2

I want to know the history! delrem Oct 2013 #6

DNA testing in conjunction with lack of legal paperwork pnwmom Oct 2013 #10

what legal paperwork, you realise that adoption has been part of rom culture for centuries loli phabay Oct 2013 #15

They need documentation as much as anyone else. pnwmom Oct 2013 #22

no they dont, only if they want to walk amongst outsiders. you would be surprised at how loli phabay Oct 2013 #27

They are living among "outsiders" and filing paperwork pnwmom Oct 2013 #31

hence using fake names etc, its culturally unacceptable to reveal real names to outsiders loli phabay Oct 2013 #36

In their minds they are not. But to the "outsiders" they are. pnwmom Oct 2013 #39

unlike you i dont assume she is not rom, no idea how you can deduce that loli phabay Oct 2013 #51

The "parents" are liars. They've given at least three different accounts pnwmom Oct 2013 #54

they are not going to tell the authoriies the truth, it will need intervention by someone with loli phabay Oct 2013 #57

Then they can rot in jail, and I hope they do. n/t pnwmom Oct 2013 #59

Idunno. AtheistCrusader Oct 2013 #86

could be, but other societies use paperwork and the court system loli phabay Oct 2013 #99

They should go to jail then get the red out Oct 2013 #227

in some ways they dont, to drop a name without dispensation is worse than jail loli phabay Oct 2013 #229

They sound lawless get the red out Oct 2013 #231

no, just having to live within two sets of laws that are at odds sometimes loli phabay Oct 2013 #234

They have choices get the red out Oct 2013 #236

i guess that counts for most minority cultures that dont conform to the majority loli phabay Oct 2013 #240

Lawlessness is what is damaging get the red out Oct 2013 #242

and that is exactly what happens, when a law comes along that conflicts loli phabay Oct 2013 #244

This group needs to fucking grow up get the red out Oct 2013 #246

i guess native americans and other indigenous peoples could be said to be the same loli phabay Oct 2013 #249

Nope get the red out Oct 2013 #251

can you say for certainty that tjere are none in these communities loli phabay Oct 2013 #254

"the right to say nothing when suspected of a crime" jberryhill Oct 2013 #297

The "parents" are being charged in Greek court. MADem Oct 2013 #142

i would not trust a greek court, unfortunately there has been a bias in the system loli phabay Oct 2013 #153

Your comments on this thread have been pretty egregious. I say that with all the restraint I can MADem Oct 2013 #155

well tell the EU human rights commission that you are okay with the greek system loli phabay Oct 2013 #156

No need to reply twice to one post--but I am sure the EU human rights commission agrees that child MADem Oct 2013 #174

and yet there is nothing to say this child was trafficked or even abused loli phabay Oct 2013 #176

Her DNA says she was trafficked.Stop defending the indefensible. This isn't "culture" it is CRIME nt MADem Oct 2013 #182

wow, so dna says she was trafficked, is this from csi or something loli phabay Oct 2013 #193

It's basic science--no "CSI" needed. MADem Oct 2013 #195

well as you seem to be buried i am digging to help you out loli phabay Oct 2013 #199

They said they got the child as a newborn in 2009. However, the kid was one or two in 2009. MADem Oct 2013 #200

if she was being groomed then good shes out, problem is i dont trust the greek authorities loli phabay Oct 2013 #201

These people were thieves and criminals. MADem Oct 2013 #203

once again you are talking past me, i have said i hope the child gets resolution loli phabay Oct 2013 #205

The child was dumped or stolen or taken as payment for a debt. Pick one. MADem Oct 2013 #207

your lack of either understanding the adoption process or complete lack of learning loli phabay Oct 2013 #209

If you live in a country, abiding by their laws is not "optional." MADem Oct 2013 #217

Thank you get the red out Oct 2013 #230

You are very welcome. MADem Oct 2013 #233

I can't abide throwing children to the wolves get the red out Oct 2013 #238

and yet you say nothing about post saying eradicating rom culture. loli phabay Oct 2013 #158

Allowing criminals to run free is not "eradicating 'rom' culture." MADem Oct 2013 #169

very telling when the phrase those folks is used, also your use of them loli phabay Oct 2013 #170

Very telling when you try to use accusations of bigotry to defend child trafficking. MADem Oct 2013 #178

if you dont know how to use google then you need more than my help loli phabay Oct 2013 #179

It's a computer term on Google, not a way to describe a culture/ethnicity. Nice try--but fail. nt MADem Oct 2013 #181

try harder, its there, loli phabay Oct 2013 #192

You made the claim, you need to prove it. No one is going to do your homework for you. MADem Oct 2013 #196

lol, no you are the one with the extensive interaction from living in europe who makes a claim loli phabay Oct 2013 #197

And I am telling you--you made up that term. It's Roma, not 'rom'--you're trying to pretend MADem Oct 2013 #204

accuse all you want, if you have not the ability to do a simple search beyond the first google page loli phabay Oct 2013 #206

You have that ability--so exercise it, go on, I dare ya. If you won't do it, we know why. MADem Oct 2013 #208

onve again if you dont have the ability then admit it, i am sure someone will help you loli phabay Oct 2013 #210

I obviously do, but you made the claim with your use of the word. Now find a link or I will MADem Oct 2013 #211

lol. no you are the one who has a problem and accusations with the word loli phabay Oct 2013 #212

Sorry--you're the one that can't prove the point you made with your own words. MADem Oct 2013 #213

lol, yes you and others, in your dreams loli phabay Oct 2013 #214

It's not "my dreams." You can't prove the point you made. That's the bottom line. MADem Oct 2013 #215

really, are you this daft that you cant click on page two or pull up wiki or something loli phabay Oct 2013 #216

Now you resort to personal insult by calling me "daft." Clearly, since you're the "smart one" here MADem Oct 2013 #218

really, you seem to believe i made up a word, accuse me of it and then cant even loli phabay Oct 2013 #220

I don't "seem to believe" anything. You keep telling me this is a standard word, and I want you to MADem Oct 2013 #221

once again you speak of otjers, no doubt they have the wherewithal to look it up loli phabay Oct 2013 #222

No--I speak of YOU. You said it, now prove it is a real word. A simple link will do. nt MADem Oct 2013 #223

i am sorry but there something not right with you loli phabay Oct 2013 #224

More insults--and still you fail to prove your point. We know you by your works. nt MADem Oct 2013 #225

Traveler? bitchkitty Oct 2013 #301

well few use the term gypsy unless talking to gaje, traveler is much the same loli phabay Oct 2013 #302

FYI- "Rom" is a commonly used designation Eyerish Oct 2013 #294

Thank you for doing that, and for not calling me daft or other insults. nt MADem Oct 2013 #295

No confirmation that she was actually forced to beg. moriah Oct 2013 #171

How disgusting. Your apologies are indefensible. MADem Oct 2013 #175

I'm confused then, because an article said 14 children were registered.... moriah Oct 2013 #177

The arrested "parents" might also be "farmers." MADem Oct 2013 #180

Yes.... but social services scams are also very common. moriah Oct 2013 #185

Who in the USA is taught to lie like that? Who in USA doesn't have documents? MADem Oct 2013 #186

The closest I can think of is also very viscerally disturbing to me.... moriah Oct 2013 #187

Very similar--child traffickers. Slavers. Didn't they have some success with the children who had MADem Oct 2013 #189

I agree with you on them get the red out Oct 2013 #235

I do, too, but have you read many of the books by ex-members? moriah Oct 2013 #268

this thread on a progessive board just confirms the need to hold secrets loli phabay Oct 2013 #269

It looks like child trafficking to me Aerows Oct 2013 #188

Agree wholeheartedly....It does to me, too. MADem Oct 2013 #191

So it's ok if they don't obey laws get the red out Oct 2013 #226

you know why theres no participation in stuff like the census and paperwork loli phabay Oct 2013 #228

Then that needs to be changed get the red out Oct 2013 #232

what you are calling for is the death of the culture, i dont believe you mean loli phabay Oct 2013 #237

To obey the law is to give up identity? get the red out Oct 2013 #239

not if that law is engineered to destroy the culture, this has not all happened in a vacuum loli phabay Oct 2013 #243

We are talking NOW get the red out Oct 2013 #245

you do know that greece actually has laws that are set up to discriminate loli phabay Oct 2013 #248

While there might be plenty of "brown skinned" parents with blonde children, this girl is not LisaL Oct 2013 #11

adoption is a common practice and very common among the different families loli phabay Oct 2013 #12

Then the child is genetically linked to someone, which this child is not. pnwmom Oct 2013 #25

okay when i use the word family it is in the rom sense of the word loli phabay Oct 2013 #38

Why should they be any more exempt from the laws pnwmom Oct 2013 #42

makes sense Niceguy1 Oct 2013 #103

there are a lot of misconceptions and some downright bigoted lies about the culture loli phabay Oct 2013 #104

Why do you defend these criminals? Scairp Oct 2013 #143

once again the kinder face of bigotry is shown in a post loli phabay Oct 2013 #146

Whatever Scairp Oct 2013 #161

Glad you're such an expert philosslayer Oct 2013 #162

Post removed Post removed Oct 2013 #219

Bottom line get the red out Oct 2013 #241

in what way is being a rom not a full person, i agree with yoi if she was going to be loli phabay Oct 2013 #247

I should have said better opportunities get the red out Oct 2013 #250

like all cultires there is women and child abuse, but there is a misconception loli phabay Oct 2013 #253

It does prove that the child is not related to them Yo_Mama Oct 2013 #131

the cops should, but as i said in another post adoption within the community is different loli phabay Oct 2013 #148

Apparently they gave conflicting claims Scootaloo Oct 2013 #3

hoo boy. I'm finding the responses ... , well, you know. delrem Oct 2013 #13

The "parents" said they found the baby in blanket. Or that pnwmom Oct 2013 #66

You're very fast and furious in your judgment. I'm not. So we're different. delrem Oct 2013 #70

She wouldn't have been taken from them if it was a legal adoption pnwmom Oct 2013 #7

These are Roma. Think about it. delrem Oct 2013 #8

They're not being accused because they're Roma. pnwmom Oct 2013 #18

it could very well be a legal adoption, within the rules of the family loli phabay Oct 2013 #14

It is very unlikely a legal adoption. Here is the info from that article: pnwmom Oct 2013 #19

your definition of legal differs from the familys in rom culture, everything is done in house loli phabay Oct 2013 #23

Then these people can tell the police who the child is genetically pnwmom Oct 2013 #26

no idea in this case, but how exactly do you track down any individual family loli phabay Oct 2013 #30

I don't know. That's a risk they decided to take, assuming pnwmom Oct 2013 #34

thats the cultural difference, you need a signed document and courts behind you to do a deal loli phabay Oct 2013 #41

I'm saying that they no more deserve exemption from the laws pnwmom Oct 2013 #44

not disagreeing but when does laws collide with culture, what should win loli phabay Oct 2013 #47

The laws should win. Otherwise, we open the door to situations pnwmom Oct 2013 #49

and this the reason why you are an outsider, and the rom wander loli phabay Oct 2013 #53

Cults always want to be left alone, but that isn't a reason to allow them pnwmom Oct 2013 #61

seems that you believe that you are superior than the rom, kinda.sad to see this kind of bigotry loli phabay Oct 2013 #62

I believe in the rule of law and the protection of children. pnwmom Oct 2013 #65

Fucking ridiculous. bitchkitty Oct 2013 #74

you seem to have missed every post i made, also the one likening white supremacists loli phabay Oct 2013 #77

And you seem to have missed a very bitchkitty Oct 2013 #96

This artcle says they aren't sure on that one... moriah Oct 2013 #163

+1 nt MADem Oct 2013 #141

Thank you get the red out Oct 2013 #260

...the banning of use of language or being forced to learn stuff against a kids culture. delrem Oct 2013 #79

i honestly think its just ignorance of the real bigotry that goes on in many loli phabay Oct 2013 #82

A minority culture that permits Diego_Native 2012 Oct 2013 #106

you know who else called for the eradication, well you are known for the company you keep loli phabay Oct 2013 #107

And you are an apologist for child abuse. Nice company you keep, too. Ikonoklast Oct 2013 #120

not at all, as i said in another post they have to find where the child came from loli phabay Oct 2013 #121

Damn it, Godwin! n/t moriah Oct 2013 #151

not sure if it counts as a godwin when someone actually uses the same language loli phabay Oct 2013 #152

What makes them a cult is the insiders/outsiders view that pnwmom Oct 2013 #110

That is a double edged sword. delta17 Oct 2013 #277

What does that have to do with a case of possible kidnapping? pnwmom Oct 2013 #109

Just because a practice is part of a culture tabasco Oct 2013 #144

there are definetly darker sides to any culture, but the adoption rules in rom society are a good loli phabay Oct 2013 #149

To deny the protection of Greek laws to this child Yo_Mama Oct 2013 #134

greek laws dont protect rom children, the EU has major problems with many greek laws loli phabay Oct 2013 #136

Well, "rom culture" doesn't trump Greek law. The parents are abductors until they can cough up MADem Oct 2013 #140

problem is there will be no paperwork, there seldom is loli phabay Oct 2013 #147

No ticket, no laundry. They manage to record births to get child benefits. Funny how they can MADem Oct 2013 #183

ah guilty until proven innocent, now i get you loli phabay Oct 2013 #194

That's right--guilty until they can prove they have a right to that child, who isn't even the age MADem Oct 2013 #198

The Rom try to play both sides of the street ripcord Oct 2013 #165

broadbrushing, if one member of a minority does something does that mean all members do the same loli phabay Oct 2013 #166

Reminds me of Warren Jeffs Renew Deal Oct 2013 #284

no, he was a nut who abused people, unless you believe that every rom family loli phabay Oct 2013 #286

I'm going off of your description Renew Deal Oct 2013 #287

different reasons involved, you know why kids are adopted loli phabay Oct 2013 #289

Why would a natural parent dye a young childs hair? justice1 Oct 2013 #116

kids get it done all the time, in this case it could very well be to hide the child loli phabay Oct 2013 #118

"A DNA test on the two alleged abductors showed they were not the girl's biological parents." Turborama Oct 2013 #21

Well, then, let's just hang the fuckers. nt delrem Oct 2013 #24

Why is it so hard to believe they could have kidnapped her? pnwmom Oct 2013 #28

she could very well be a kidnap victim, problem is if she is rom then finding her family loli phabay Oct 2013 #32

That's why they're publicizing her picture across the world. pnwmom Oct 2013 #37

Then that will be a problem for the rom. The alternative is to say pnwmom Oct 2013 #46

well the law has never done much good for rom in the past, one of the reasons for not loli phabay Oct 2013 #48

True. The law doesn't do them any good if they want to be free pnwmom Oct 2013 #50

the same laws that have been used to persecute for centuries, yeah lets trust that. loli phabay Oct 2013 #56

All children deserve the protection of the law. They shouldn't pnwmom Oct 2013 #58

+100000 JustAnotherGen Oct 2013 #102

Who said anything about capital punishment? n/t Turborama Oct 2013 #29

Me. n/t delrem Oct 2013 #73

Yep, you're the only person who has. n/t Turborama Oct 2013 #78

so? what's your point in pushing this button, Turborama? delrem Oct 2013 #80

Why provide the button in the 1st place, delrem? Turborama Oct 2013 #83

I didn't. delrem Oct 2013 #85

Your sarcastic reply was a non-sequitur Turborama Oct 2013 #92

So you think they should be exexuted? Crunchy Frog Oct 2013 #94

much depends if she is from another family or an outsider loli phabay Oct 2013 #4

Well she certainly is from another family. LisaL Oct 2013 #5

i worded that wrong, i mean from another rom family, adoption etc is very common within nations loli phabay Oct 2013 #9

I don't think some people apply the same general civilized standard to the Roma. delrem Oct 2013 #16

i dont think they get that written contracts are not used, for to write yoir name is not done loli phabay Oct 2013 #20

I am curious... DURHAM D Oct 2013 #40

its just a different spelling, one i am more used to using, also i would use rrom as well. loli phabay Oct 2013 #45

Why did they dye this girl's hair, except to cover up the fact pnwmom Oct 2013 #69

Uh, culture, see? bitchkitty Oct 2013 #95

Then they should prove it. Get one of the "big men" to testify pnwmom Oct 2013 #67

Then they could solve this very easily by identifying the biological parents jeff47 Oct 2013 #261

I'm looking at the obvious difference in hair color. It seems, especially in her braids, that okaawhatever Oct 2013 #17

It might just be dirty. She doesn't look very clean (clothes, hands, etc). LisaL Oct 2013 #33

Good point. You can really see it in this one, too... Turborama Oct 2013 #35

Ooh, yep. It also looks reddish brown in this pic. I wonder if that's due to the color fading nt okaawhatever Oct 2013 #43

She looks a bit like Maddy McCann wickerwoman Oct 2013 #296

I too focused on exactly that Samantha Oct 2013 #55

I'm wondering if they can estimate when the hair was dyed based on growth rate. They okaawhatever Oct 2013 #64

I think that would be definitely possible Samantha Oct 2013 #84

That's what I thought, too. Her hair was dyed. nt pnwmom Oct 2013 #68

The parents say they found the baby in a blanket. Or that strangers pnwmom Oct 2013 #52

theres a cultural difference thats important in this and its that they wont tell the authorities loli phabay Oct 2013 #60

That's their problem. Their culture demands that they lie, pnwmom Oct 2013 #63

So, they think they are above the law? If they have nothing to hide then they have no reason to lie. Turborama Oct 2013 #71

not above but outside, there are other laws they are beholden to loli phabay Oct 2013 #72

So it's a sort of voluntary dictatorship of the big men. pnwmom Oct 2013 #75

Sounds just like Warren Jeffs and the FDLS. nt. delta17 Oct 2013 #282

As Gloria Steinem said, pnwmom Oct 2013 #283

Above/outside means the same thing when it comes to the law. Especially when it comes to children Turborama Oct 2013 #76

its complex but i will give it a go loli phabay Oct 2013 #81

This isn't about begging in general. This particular girl was begging pnwmom Oct 2013 #89

Thanks for explaining. Unfortunately, children being trafficked and forced to beg is a reality Turborama Oct 2013 #93

not disagreeing with you, but pointing out that we dont know in this case loli phabay Oct 2013 #98

No one here accused all Rom of kidnapping. Just the purported "parents" pnwmom Oct 2013 #112

Does it really have to be a big man, or can it be an older short dude at 110 pounds? snooper2 Oct 2013 #167

lol, thanks for the laugh. its just a term for the head man and yes he can be short. lol loli phabay Oct 2013 #168

Nutcase religious sects use that very same excuse to hide child abuse. Ikonoklast Oct 2013 #119

slam it all you want, but i see calls for eradication. seems some people would be happy with loli phabay Oct 2013 #122

Bullshit. Sheldon Cooper Oct 2013 #126

erm you need to read the post that actually uses the word. loli phabay Oct 2013 #127

That sounds like a convenient way to excuse kidnapping Renew Deal Oct 2013 #285

no, its the law and experience with dealing with the authorities loli phabay Oct 2013 #288

Wow. I hope they find her parents. Poor girl. SunSeeker Oct 2013 #87

what ethnicity does she look like JI7 Oct 2013 #88

I wouldn't even guess dipsydoodle Oct 2013 #90

plus if she is from a traveler family the chances are remote that they are on the internet loli phabay Oct 2013 #101

she could be rom, slav, anglo saxon, spanish, norwegian, turk, hell any ethnicity loli phabay Oct 2013 #100

Why were they dying her hair then? pnwmom Oct 2013 #114

because blondes are still rare so she would stand out, and it's been confirmed she is not their JI7 Oct 2013 #138

I agree with you they were trying to hide her pnwmom Oct 2013 #139

where exactly are blondes rare, genuine question loli phabay Oct 2013 #150

among Roma and some other groups JI7 Oct 2013 #154

blonde as well as red hair is fairley common amongst the rom, lots of northern travelers loli phabay Oct 2013 #157

this was in greece and the family she was did not look like her JI7 Oct 2013 #159

i got that, but amongst the families you will find rom from all parts loli phabay Oct 2013 #160

She has a Polish or Ukrainian face <nt> bigworld Oct 2013 #117

she does look as if she is from that region, could also be russian tsigan loli phabay Oct 2013 #125

if she is Russian Tsigan than I am a Ferengi. idwiyo Oct 2013 #256

how so, plenty of blonde blue eyed russians out there loli phabay Oct 2013 #257

Sure, there are. Sorry, am off to study rules of acquisition. idwiyo Oct 2013 #258

really, you have never seen a blonde blue eyed russian before loli phabay Oct 2013 #259

Russians and Tsigans are not the same people. Shouldn't you know such basic fact? idwiyo Oct 2013 #263

you know that tsigan are made from the peoples of the area they live in loli phabay Oct 2013 #265

But of course. Sorry, Rules of Acquisition call, too busy to waste my time on nonsense. idwiyo Oct 2013 #266

flippancy must be a ferengi currency loli phabay Oct 2013 #267

that's what she looked like to me also JI7 Oct 2013 #137

She looks Russian to me cpwm17 Oct 2013 #145

Ukrainian? Polish? HooptieWagon Oct 2013 #202

Gogol Bordello forum mimi85 Oct 2013 #91

After reading the thread, giving it a K&R in hopes that exposure Crunchy Frog Oct 2013 #97

This message was self-deleted by its author dipsydoodle Oct 2013 #105

continuing the libel that the rom kidnap children, it may in some cases but this feeds the loli phabay Oct 2013 #108

It wasn't my intention to draw an analogy. dipsydoodle Oct 2013 #111

yeah i know you were not, its not your style. i did not mean to imply you where loli phabay Oct 2013 #113

Yes, it may happen in some cases -- and this is one of them. pnwmom Oct 2013 #115

Wonder if they need a warrant for the DNA test treestar Oct 2013 #123

probuably would have enough to get one, the levels of probable cause are less in greece loli phabay Oct 2013 #124

I'd want to make sure the whole thing isn't some sort of set-up. Ken Burch Oct 2013 #128

either way, its time to break camp and head north. regardless of the outcome loli phabay Oct 2013 #129

It's not easy for them to just to 'break camp' and split Turborama Oct 2013 #133

its easier than you may believe, other members of their nation would take them in and help loli phabay Oct 2013 #135

The terminology you've been using is as if they are living a romantic lifestyle on the road... Turborama Oct 2013 #172

no a lot of rom have settled, but its ingrained that the long road is always there loli phabay Oct 2013 #173

They aren't fleeing anywhere--they are in jail now. MADem Oct 2013 #272

As can be seen in the photo, it is obvious why the police thought she looked out of place... Turborama Oct 2013 #273

Everyone criticizing people for getting annoyed at seeing children endangered should watch that MADem Oct 2013 #274

Sorry, I posted the other one as an update, but you are right. Turborama Oct 2013 #276

It's starting to look like they "bought" that child...at least that is what the neighbors say... MADem Oct 2013 #299

Their lawyer has said they took her in from a foreign stranger when she was a baby... Turborama Oct 2013 #130

could be, its not outside of the law to take a child in circumstances like that loli phabay Oct 2013 #132

I really don't think this is child trafficking. moriah Oct 2013 #164

No--as I said elsewhere, they could be farmers, raising livestock for eventual trafficking. MADem Oct 2013 #184

Post removed Post removed Oct 2013 #252

wow, just wow. loli phabay Oct 2013 #255

With the reputation of child traffickers? get the red out Oct 2013 #262

yet you hate a whole people because you believe they all do it loli phabay Oct 2013 #264

They are also victims of child trafficking. MADem Oct 2013 #271

Message auto-removed Name removed Oct 2013 #190

Wow, from what I read about the Romani culture, it's pretty complex graywarrior Oct 2013 #270

yeah i am pretty much done with this thread, its not worth the aggro loli phabay Oct 2013 #275

There's a couple of documnetaries in this thread that give a good insight into their culture Turborama Oct 2013 #278

you realise the culture is so much more than what these shows show loli phabay Oct 2013 #279

Have you watched them? Turborama Oct 2013 #280

i disagree that it is the whole story of the rom, same as if i watched a story about loli phabay Oct 2013 #281

So, you haven't watched them yet, then Turborama Oct 2013 #290

until then what, or do you really believe the millions of rom are all trafficking theirnown kids loli phabay Oct 2013 #291

We can't discuss what's in them until then n/t Turborama Oct 2013 #292

but we can discuss the myths that some people believe and the bigotry out there loli phabay Oct 2013 #293

You're uninformed about what these "shows show" until you watch them. When/if you do, we can discuss Turborama Oct 2013 #298

no, you think this is the first time that anyone has ever discussed not just those shows loli phabay Oct 2013 #300

You jumped on me when I recommended watching something & are acting like you know what's in them Turborama Oct 2013 #303

well i apoligise if that is how it seemed, i never meant to challenge the veracity of loli phabay Oct 2013 #304

Actually, the one that I think you'd find most informative is the "This World" one Turborama Oct 2013 #306

A second case from Dublin intaglio Oct 2013 #305

Bumping for closure. AtheistCrusader Oct 2013 #307