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Kelvin Mace

(17,469 posts)

25. Spying on a country you are at war with

Thu Jan 23, 2014, 05:19 PM

Jan 2014

or that is overtly hostile to you, is cool.

Spying on your allies? Uncool.

It is as simple as that.

If Australia wishes to spy on Indonesia, then Australia can declare Indonesia "hostile" to Australian interest, and then "spy away"!

If I call you my friend in public, but hire a PI to tail your, read your mail and record your phone calls, you are NOT my friend, and I am NOT yours, regardless of what I say.

Why are ethical issues so easily dismissed with a hand wave and an offering at the altar of "pragmatism"? The excuse "Well everyone else does it!" has been ethically discredited by kindergarten teachers everywhere for about a century now.

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Highlight:

Julie Bishop lashes Snowden on US visit [View all] struggle4progress Jan 2014 OP

Snowden will be looking over his shoulder for life, he has managed to piss off Thinkingabout Jan 2014 #1

She's funny, accusing Snowden of "treachery".... Comrade Grumpy Jan 2014 #2

Perfect! DJ13 Jan 2014 #4

What is wrong with you people? Demenace Jan 2014 #15

Exactly. +100 nt okaawhatever Jan 2014 #38

You're new here. DisgustipatedinCA Jan 2014 #65

I didn't notice rude. I noticed right. Heaven forfend the sanctimonious be contradicted. aquart Jan 2014 #76

Being rude here time after time will probably get your opinion deleted warrant46 Jan 2014 #70

I think Bishop protests too much. fasttense Jan 2014 #3

Since when does Snowden owe any loyalty to Australia? He witnessed treachery and 1monster Jan 2014 #5

It is called "projection" Kelvin Mace Jan 2014 #6

lol ctsnowman Jan 2014 #7

Perhaps you admire the famous philosophy of Henry Stimson, that struggle4progress Jan 2014 #10

The NSA apologists on DU repeat over and over that "they all do it" meaning the surveillance. JDPriestly Jan 2014 #14

"The NSA is in my opinion violating .. our guaranteed rights," you say, in a thread struggle4progress Jan 2014 #16

This is now what has been labeled as intelligent opinion around here... Demenace Jan 2014 #19

Do you think that the Indonesian government did not already know that it was under surveillance? JDPriestly Jan 2014 #28

For your education, it is called ways and methods.... Demenace Jan 2014 #31

What has your rights in America, got to do with what Australia is doing with another country? Demenace Jan 2014 #17

In my view, some of the surveillance is illegal. The Fourth Amendment and several other amendments JDPriestly Jan 2014 #26

Dude, this story is about Australia which is not America... Demenace Jan 2014 #33

So. Snowden owed no duty to protect the secrets of Australia. Why the fuss? JDPriestly Jan 2014 #34

Again, you miss the point of the Australian reaction... Demenace Jan 2014 #40

May I respond? JDPriestly Jan 2014 #54

Outstanding post. Octafish Jan 2014 #24

It is this self affirming attitude among Republicans that has bought them the label... Demenace Jan 2014 #27

You have to ask? Octafish Jan 2014 #55

I agree but its a waste of time to debate with the self annointed warrant46 Jan 2014 #71

The word is 'inured'. Sincerely, some dumbass progressive. DisgustipatedinCA Jan 2014 #63

Spying on a country you are at war with Kelvin Mace Jan 2014 #25

So Israel spying on America is not in the national interest of the Israelis? Demenace Jan 2014 #29

Can you try and be a little less Kelvin Mace Jan 2014 #36

Telling you, you know nothing of what you speak about is not snarky... Demenace Jan 2014 #42

Really? Kelvin Mace Jan 2014 #50

You aren't actually reading the history carefully IMO: continued cracking of Japanese naval codes struggle4progress Jan 2014 #37

Again, Kelvin Mace Jan 2014 #45

Dude, whose book of morality are you asking us to live up to? Demenace Jan 2014 #48

Not interested in engaging your rude discourse Kelvin Mace Jan 2014 #52

Bishop is an idiot.... blackspade Jan 2014 #8

I thought his entire motive was to expose US spying on Americans??? Guess he lied!! George II Jan 2014 #9

Does any of those like you who hates Snowdon ever stop LiberalLovinLug Jan 2014 #12

Maybe if he came out ONCE and said EVERYTHING that he thinks, and tell us EVERYTHING... George II Jan 2014 #18

Hard to argue with confusion LiberalLovinLug Jan 2014 #56

Reread what I said, I said that he WON'T tell us everything he knows all at once because... George II Jan 2014 #59

aaaaaaaaaand cue the syntax error police LiberalLovinLug Jan 2014 #73

It's not a syntax issue, it's the fact that you totally turned what I said around. George II Jan 2014 #74

You tell me what gives Snowden the right endanger a foreign nation... Demenace Jan 2014 #20

Because we live in a global villiage - everything is connected LiberalLovinLug Jan 2014 #57

Snowden obtained his documents prior to June 2013, but the Australian federal elections struggle4progress Jan 2014 #23

What difference does that make? LiberalLovinLug Jan 2014 #58

It appears Snowden has pronounced himself King of the World! Whisp Jan 2014 #53

So the Australian government says human freedom needs protecting from the Indonesian president? muriel_volestrangler Jan 2014 #11

You must be naive to think governments should trust one another... Demenace Jan 2014 #21

She didn't say "we all do it", or "we don't trust one another"; she said: muriel_volestrangler Jan 2014 #22

And in your simple nature, you believe the Australian government will personally fax you a reason.. Demenace Jan 2014 #30

No, it's the fault of their idiotic foreign minister, who doesn't understand what treachery is muriel_volestrangler Jan 2014 #43

Post removed Post removed Jan 2014 #46

I can't see how that particular approach gets you very far: Indonesia is, to my view, struggle4progress Jan 2014 #32

These fake intellectuals would want you to think otherwise... Demenace Jan 2014 #35

You say that Snowden is entitled to advocate against it muriel_volestrangler Jan 2014 #39

Dude, this information is not his to reveal... Demenace Jan 2014 #44

Dear god, you sound eager for someone to assassinate Snowden muriel_volestrangler Jan 2014 #47

I guess, I just woke you up to the league your buddy is playing in.. Demenace Jan 2014 #49

The conversation might be more interesting and more productive, were you able to refrain struggle4progress Jan 2014 #51

Agreed. And Snowden took 1.7 million documents. How many of those had to do with okaawhatever Jan 2014 #62

Australia one of the WASPY "Five Eyes" /nt Ash_F Jan 2014 #13

First the Israelis, now Julie Bishop's under attack over faked passport scandal muriel_volestrangler Jan 2014 #41

I missed the part where she next, in a fit of pique, collected a million or so documents struggle4progress Jan 2014 #64

If only she had, she'd not be a ridiculous Orwellian hypocrite now, would she? muriel_volestrangler Jan 2014 #66

Or maybe, like many politicians, she's often just something of a blowhard and a hack, and struggle4progress Jan 2014 #67

Unfortunately, she may have a point, it seems. AverageJoe90 Jan 2014 #60

Snowden seems to think only certain countries like China, Russia should be able to spy JI7 Jan 2014 #61

Lashings and Julie Bishop go together...... Theyletmeeatcake2 Jan 2014 #68

Well, it looks like Snowdens revelation about Australias snooping has gotten some results. lumpy Jan 2014 #72

What does that mean? Theyletmeeatcake2 Jan 2014 #75

This message was self-deleted by its author Theyletmeeatcake2 Jan 2014 #69