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hedgehog

(36,286 posts)

54. We are at cross purposes here -

Tue May 20, 2014, 04:11 PM

May 2014

1. The Harvard Report concluded that the use of nicotine pesticides is a significant factor in CCD.

2. The articles you linked to attacked the study as poorly constructed and therefore yielding invalid results.

3. While it is possible to claim that the study does not prove that the nicotine pesticides are the sole factor involved, neither does this single study exonerate them.

4. Other studies suggest that it is only in the presence of nicotine pesticides that endemic parasites, fungus and infections become fatal to entire colonies, therefore these pesticides should not be used in the presence of bees.

As an aside; a quick review of the Seralinis controversy suggests that the waters are well and truly muddied there; apparently critics claimed he did not prove that GMO foods cause cancer; apparently he claims the experiment was designed to detect liver and kidney toxicity and happened to suggest a need for further study of a possible connection to cancer. Mentioning the Seralinis dispute is an excellent way to distract from the subject at hand; the cause of CCD.

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Highlight:

U.S. Beekeepers Lost 23% of Colonies Last Winter; Scientists Recommend Treating Bees for Varroa Mite [View all] HuckleB May 2014 OP

Europe blames nicotinic pesticides. nt Bernardo de La Paz May 2014 #1

Europe is a mighty big place, with many entities that disagree with one another. HuckleB May 2014 #2

They should take away the bees' cellphones, too. Orrex May 2014 #3

Well, they should at least get all the wifi out of the bee schools! HuckleB May 2014 #4

Finally a voice of reason! Orrex May 2014 #5

I do my best! HuckleB May 2014 #6

Thanks for links. I read first one, quite informative. nt Bernardo de La Paz May 2014 #7

+1 to that...thanks Supersedeas May 2014 #33

The simple fact is that CCD didn't appear until the neoniconoides Damansarajaya May 2014 #9

We get it. You have a preconceived notion. HuckleB May 2014 #12

Whoa. The preconception is all yours. Damansarajaya May 2014 #13

Actually, your posts make it clear that you're the one with the preconceptions, HuckleB May 2014 #14

I didn't pretend anything. Damansarajaya May 2014 #15

Thanks for the confession. HuckleB May 2014 #16

For acting like Mr. Logic, you should really review Damansarajaya May 2014 #18

Pretending that's all I've got, when you've offered nothing but denialism is just silliness. HuckleB May 2014 #21

HuckleB is often quite right ... Trajan May 2014 #27

Well, his high opinion of his reasoning powers Damansarajaya May 2014 #31

I have a high opinion of the evidence base. HuckleB May 2014 #34

I do too. There's a lot of good evidence that GMO Damansarajaya May 2014 #60

and often not quite right ... Kat 333 May 2014 #32

Prove it. HuckleB May 2014 #35

I don't know from the harvard study Erich Bloodaxe BSN May 2014 #26

They may be part of the problem. HuckleB May 2014 #30

Two of those links critique the same poorly designed study while the third hedgehog May 2014 #39

Can you prove that it's a poorly designed study? HuckleB May 2014 #41

And bee mites are treated by smoking the hive with insecticide. Damansarajaya May 2014 #8

Maybe you should read the full article before responding. HuckleB May 2014 #11

I don't think it's "smoking" per se, but rather chemical strips left in the hives hatrack May 2014 #56

Honey is an antibiotic for bees but antibiotics are losing effectiveness. Kablooie May 2014 #10

This is incidental info, but urban colonies seem to do better then commercial hives. denbot May 2014 #17

+1 nt Damansarajaya May 2014 #20

On the other hand . . . Damansarajaya May 2014 #19

Politics, not science. HuckleB May 2014 #22

Do you work in PR for Monsanto or something? Damansarajaya May 2014 #24

No, it doesn't. HuckleB May 2014 #28

Many studies have come out on the danger of pesticides on Bees lovuian May 2014 #23

Right, apparently those are just "political," Damansarajaya May 2014 #25

Yes. Unfortunately, not the best studies in the world. HuckleB May 2014 #29

Don�t overlook other causes in investigating bee deaths HuckleB May 2014 #36

Colony Collapse Disorder: More Dead Bees, More Sloppy Science HuckleB May 2014 #37

Again, the links in post 36 and 37 reference and critique the same poorly done study linked to hedgehog May 2014 #40

It's a well done study. HuckleB May 2014 #42

Did you even read the article at your link? The article is devoted to hedgehog May 2014 #45

Yes, that's the point. HuckleB May 2014 #47

If as reported, many or all European counties have banned the use of hedgehog May 2014 #38

The "bans" are quite convoluted. HuckleB May 2014 #43

I think you are ignoring the possibility that this is a two part problem - hedgehog May 2014 #44

If you had looked at my other posts, you would know that I do not see it that way. HuckleB May 2014 #46

Here is another study linking the use of the nicotine pesticides hedgehog May 2014 #48

Again, you seem to be convinced of the cause. HuckleB May 2014 #49

When the big picture points to combinations of nicotine pesticides and just about any other single hedgehog May 2014 #51

It doesn't necessarily point to that. HuckleB May 2014 #53

If anyone is interested - here is a link to the Harvard Study itself: hedgehog May 2014 #50

Again, you seem to just like saying "it's invalid." HuckleB May 2014 #52

We are at cross purposes here - hedgehog May 2014 #54

Thank you for responding calmly & clearly to him. Nihil May 2014 #55

thank you! hedgehog May 2014 #57

What other studies? HuckleB May 2014 #59

Farmers/growers can control pesticide/herbicide use Marthe48 May 2014 #58