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happyslug

(14,779 posts)
102. Isreal has to be careful, like Hitler was prior to 1941.
Thu Jul 24, 2014, 10:43 AM
Jul 2014

Prior to the Invasion of Russia in June 1941, the Nazis killing of Jews were minimal. The actual Nazi Plan was to make life so miserable for the Jews, they would leave. In fact the Nazis were the #1 smugglers of Jews into what is now Israel prior to 1941. In May 1941, as Hitler was building up forces to Invade Russia, Yugoslavia had a coup, while Italy's Invasion of Greece was turning into an Italian debacle (As was the Italian Invasion of Egypt from Libya). The United Kingdom also took over Iraq in the Spring of 1941.

What all those war moves meant, was the last two method of smuggling Jews to Palestine were cut off. Germany could not send them through Russia, after Hitler attacked Russia in June 1941. Spain was an option after the fall of France in June 1940 (Through that also cut off the Dutch Ports, for Hitler used the Netherlands as part of the invasion of France, Netherlands being Neutral till Attacked in May 1940). Please note the Soviet Union route was a minor route for European Jews to escape the Nazis. Franco did not want the Jews, for the best place he could ship them was to the USA, which was rejecting them. Thus the main smuggling route was Germany to Yugoslavia (Pro Jew but Neutral till May 1941), then to Greece, or Bulgaria (A German Ally during WWII) and Turkey (Neutral, but pro-German). From Greece to Turkey the Jews would be put on boats and shipped to Palestine.

The German Invasion of Yugoslavia and then Greece, permitted the British to attack any ship in the Aegean Sea, which fell under Greek Rule (It appears that in at least the 1939-1941 period, most Smuggling of Jews were done by the Greeks, but paid for by the Germans). Turkey, fearing a joint British-Soviet attack, as happened to Iran in the Summer of 1941, as Britain and the then Neutral US wanted to secure a supply line to the Soviet Union, decided to appease the British by cutting off what little Jewish smuggling they had been doing.

Once the ways to smuggle Jews out of Europe disappeared, AND the rest of the world was at war with Germany, then and only then did the Nazis went into whole scale murder. First the SS teams sent into Russia to murder any Jews and Communist party members they found, then the death camps after December 1941.

I bring up the pre- holocaust Jews being kicked out of Europe, to show what Israel is doing to the Palestinians today. Since 1947 and the establishment of the Jewish State, the Israeli position has been the Palestinians (Both Christian and Moslem) should be resettled among the other "Arabs" of the Middle East, just like the Nazis said the Jews should go back to Palestine in pre-1941 days. Israel has REFUSED to accept the fact that one's tribe in more important to most Arabs then being an Arab, and thus moving someone from another tribe into your tribal area is unacceptable to them. It would be like moving poor inner city African Americans into an upper middle Class suburb, the howls would be loud and clear, even while admitting the African Americans have to live some place.

Israel has NEVER been in the position of the Nazi were in from 1941 to 1945, i.e. the whole world in active war with Israel, for the US has been pro-Israel since 1947. Thus Israel has always been in a position more like the Nazis pre-1941 then post 1941. Do to this support from the US, it has been the policy of Israel to "Encourage" movement of undesirables to places outside of Israel. Thus Israel policy is similar to the Nazis pre 1941 policy as to the Jews, to encourage such those undesirables to leave and everything, inducing an occasional murder, will be used to "encourage" such movement.

This policy has been effective. The West Bank, occupied since 1967, was, in many ways, more Christian then Moslem in 1967. The Christians controlled most commerce and tended to be what we would call the Upper Middle Class of the West Bank. Towns of importance, including Bethlehem, were majority Christian cities. The policies adopted by Israel to the people of the West Bank, were similar to the policies the Nazis adopted to the Jews in Europe pre 1941, separation and massive discrimination but minimal use of force. If people objected, force would be used, but if no one objected, people would be left alone EXCEPT for the massive discrimination against them. To avoid adverse reporting overt discrimination was avoided but even then non-Jews were forbidden in certain parts of the West Bank, and land was taken from land owners to build the various Jewish settlements (Israel had a policy that all land not being used belonged to Israel, and then ruled that land wanted by Jewish Settlements were not being used, even if they were.

Another policy was to favor Jewish Shops over non-Jewish shops. This not only included buying form those shops, but even selling supplies to those shops. Jewish merchants could get goods at a discount, but non jewish shops could not. These policies tended to hurt the upper middle class more then the poor. Given the Upper Middle Class tended to be Christian and had some money, they were the ones who moved, mostly to the US. Thus the US has a sizable Palestinian population, but it tends to be Christian not Moslem. On the other hand, the poor of the West Bank tended to be Moslem, and thus Cities like Bethlehem, went from being overwhelmingly Christian, as they have been since the time of the Roman Empire, to being majority Moslem Today. The poor, rely more on relatives and their network of friends to survive then did the Upper Middle Class (who also rely on Friends and Relatives, but as a whole can also rely on Money) and thus tend to stay with such network of friends and relatives. Thus since 1967 the people of the West Bank have been pushed further and further against the proverbial wall and with most of the old Upper Middle Class moved to America it is a bomb ready to go off. In many ways Israel would like such a blow up, for it would provide them with the cover story to kill the people of the West Bank is their continue to refuse to leave.

Gaza has always been poorer then the West Bank, it did not have the tourist traps of where Jesus was born and taught (and where Mohammad ascended into Heaven). On the other hand The Gaza Strip is a Fertile coastal plain that actually extends into most of present day Israel. Thus it was the easiest place for most Palestinians escaped to in 1947. Thus a rich plain, with a lot of poor farmers, (The old Joke Land Rich, Cash Poor) having to take in a massive number of refugees and keep them for over 60 years, is enough to bankrupt the whole economy. Worse Gaza has no real natural port, thus must import (and export) goods from Israel or Egypt. Gaza is easier to cut off then the West Bank, to its south is desert, thus the only way in or out is along the coastal Highway (Small Boats can take off from the Beeches of the Gaza Stripe, but so can Camels into the desert to the south. Both are easy to spot for they is no "Cover" to hide under, thus not a reasonable alternative to the Coastal Highway.

For those reasons Gaza had always been more radical then the West Bank. Gaza also tends to be more united then the West Bank, for the same reasons. Ancient Israel always had a problem with Gaza (Where the Ancient Philistines lived) for the same reasons present day Israel is having problems. Gaza is united behind its leaders and want to attack its enemies, which right now is Israel. On the other hand Israel wants Gaza gone, and doing what it can to get the people of Gaza to move elsewhere. Israel has been less successful in Gaza for the simple reason Gaza is more united, thus Israel tends to "drop" the hammer in Gaza much more then the Richer West Bank (Which still has some money, from tourism and trade via Jordan, which Israel has not totally cut off, for it can not for the Jordon River is NOT a real barrier to even truck transportation and being hillier and Greener the Gaza, the West Bank alternative routes have something we call "Cover" to hide under (i.e. Trees and other large natural objects).

Just why Israel policy if killing an Occasional Palestinian is similar to the Nazi's Policy as to the Jews in the 1930s.

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0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

Terrorists fire rockets from Gaza hospital [View all] question everything Jul 2014 OP
The people of Gaza need to remove the Hamas terrorists from power seveneyes Jul 2014 #1
You are so wrong. JDPriestly Jul 2014 #59
NY TIMES: Israel bombs building where it urged Palestinians to take shelter RobertEarl Jul 2014 #70
"Israel is fighting for its survival". LOL Sam1 Jul 2014 #103
The Israelis found Israeli military uniforms in a Palestinian tunnel, but the Palestinians JDPriestly Jul 2014 #112
As far as I can tell, Gaza is just a big concentration camp. candelista Jul 2014 #135
Question: "The Israelis found Israeli military uniforms in a Palestinian tunnel, Sam1 Jul 2014 #140
I read in the New York Times (sorry I read the hard copy) JDPriestly Jul 2014 #144
A country with nuclear weapons is not "fighting for its survival" alarimer Jul 2014 #147
Note to Hamas -- YOU'RE NOT HELPING! perdita9 Jul 2014 #2
Sicking but not surprising. iandhr Jul 2014 #3
Wow, only 6 minutes after you predicted it! Its getting sad here on DU. 7962 Jul 2014 #44
Link please. Kingofalldems Jul 2014 #64
Sure. Heres one lamenting the low Israeli death toll 7962 Jul 2014 #77
How wrong can you be? RobertEarl Jul 2014 #78
Then the world should be pressuring the palestinians to dump Hamas as their leaders. 7962 Jul 2014 #87
Wrong again RobertEarl Jul 2014 #98
So the world SHOULDNT tell the Palestinians to rid themselves of a terrorist organization?? 7962 Jul 2014 #108
That post most certainly does not say Kingofalldems Jul 2014 #88
It boggles the mind Puzzledtraveller Jul 2014 #120
Any excuse to further destroy the Palestinians' infrastructure blackspade Jul 2014 #4
And we have a winner... iandhr Jul 2014 #7
Hamas fan club.... blackspade Jul 2014 #20
You obviously dont know what "terror" is, do you? 7962 Jul 2014 #45
I have picked a 'team?' blackspade Jul 2014 #63
Why did you put quotes round the word civilian? Violet_Crumble Jul 2014 #79
Because Hamas has decreed that ALL casualties are to be called civilian. 7962 Jul 2014 #86
Ah, so Hamas made you do it? I could swear I've heard that somewhere before... Violet_Crumble Jul 2014 #89
I specifically said children WERE civilians. Their parents are to blame for not moving. 7962 Jul 2014 #90
Leave? And where do the civilians go? blackspade Jul 2014 #92
There is a lot of Gaza not under assault. 7962 Jul 2014 #106
Gaza is 139 sq mi. blackspade Jul 2014 #109
If they took to the streets denouncing Hamas, they'd have immediate support of Egypt, Jordan, etc 7962 Jul 2014 #129
You have a complete lack of understanding of both blackspade Jul 2014 #130
If you think Israel would stop an anti-Hamas protest, you're delusional. 7962 Jul 2014 #132
You live in a county of over 417 Square Miles happyslug Jul 2014 #133
So, according to you Hamas has allowed you to say only children are civilians... Violet_Crumble Jul 2014 #122
Hamas is the Palestinian people pretzel4gore Jul 2014 #28
7 minutes....is that a record? George II Jul 2014 #34
Speaking of infrasturcture.. question everything Jul 2014 #8
You mean build stuff to protect your own people from harm... iandhr Jul 2014 #11
YEah, after all, what do they have to show for the billions in aid they've been given? 7962 Jul 2014 #46
We are Israeli reservists. We refuse to serve. RobertEarl Jul 2014 #71
Every civilized service has dissenters. We had them here in the US. 7962 Jul 2014 #72
From your journal RobertEarl Jul 2014 #73
What point are you trying to make? 7962 Jul 2014 #74
Really? You don't get the dichotomy of your opinions? RobertEarl Jul 2014 #75
What a novel idea. 840high Jul 2014 #56
And who says they aren't? blackspade Jul 2014 #22
Are you even watching the news? question everything Jul 2014 #54
There are most certainly shelters, but they will eventually be compromised and bombed. blackspade Jul 2014 #66
I have seen ZERO evidence leftynyc Jul 2014 #84
I don't believe that I mentioned Hamas building shelters for civilians. blackspade Jul 2014 #91
So three posts up where you said this: leftynyc Jul 2014 #94
I'm aware of what I said. And? blackspade Jul 2014 #95
Oh - it's not me with the bloodlust leftynyc Jul 2014 #96
I'm not 'pretending' that I was saying that civilians were building their own shelters.... blackspade Jul 2014 #97
Really? Where are all these posts you speak of? Violet_Crumble Jul 2014 #125
Spare me leftynyc Jul 2014 #126
No. You called another DUer a liar in this thread for not providing links... Violet_Crumble Jul 2014 #127
But you have plenty of sympathy for a right wing child murderer DisgustipatedinCA Jul 2014 #146
And in this case the excuse would be justified. Israel has every right to take out totodeinhere Jul 2014 #14
Nope, not justified. blackspade Jul 2014 #23
So what's the alternative? christx30 Jul 2014 #134
The alternative is to not bomb hospitals and 'safe' areas. blackspade Jul 2014 #136
So the rockets continue to fire christx30 Jul 2014 #138
So what is your solution? blackspade Jul 2014 #139
My solution is for christx30 Jul 2014 #142
That is not a viable solution though. blackspade Jul 2014 #143
disgusting but hardly surprising coming from Hamas rollin74 Jul 2014 #5
Hospitals in Gaza have so much extra room... HooptieWagon Jul 2014 #6
what is the difference between the terms patriot and terrorist dembotoz Jul 2014 #9
Simple I am a patriot they are terrorist. Sam1 Jul 2014 #99
ain't dat da truth dembotoz Jul 2014 #131
Using Hospitals and children as human sheilds is beneath contempt. Rhinodawg Jul 2014 #10
Says the guy cheering on the Israeli murder of more than a hundred children. Comrade Grumpy Jul 2014 #15
Could you link me to the cheering part leftynyc Jul 2014 #38
I haven't... Rhinodawg Jul 2014 #47
I know you haven't leftynyc Jul 2014 #82
No apology forthcoming. Rhinodawg Jul 2014 #113
Post counts have nothing to do with it leftynyc Jul 2014 #114
Using the death of three teenagers as an excuse to kill hundreds, wound thousands, and destroy Sam1 Jul 2014 #100
Of course both sides are pulling shite... it's war JCMach1 Jul 2014 #12
This sums it up, I'm afraid. LeftishBrit Jul 2014 #116
IDF shelled the hospital LAST WEEK while the patients were still in the hospital azurnoir Jul 2014 #13
Thank you. Comrade Grumpy Jul 2014 #16
Good point, azurnoir. broiles Jul 2014 #19
Wow, that really provides some perspective. Thank you. nt stillwaiting Jul 2014 #24
You post that like it's news leftynyc Jul 2014 #26
The Israelis told everyone to get out over a week ago. Just like they've been doing from the start. 7962 Jul 2014 #48
Is YNet News considered a reliable news source? It's headlines suggest it's not. Comrade Grumpy Jul 2014 #17
as reliable as any these days given that azurnoir Jul 2014 #42
Don't worry. Some moderators here would lock this in a heartbit question everything Jul 2014 #55
DU doesn't have moderators. And you shouldn't speak on behalf of LBN hosts... Violet_Crumble Jul 2014 #123
It was mentioned a couple days ago the main general hospital also has a complex under it. Sunlei Jul 2014 #18
+ 1000 Rhinodawg Jul 2014 #25
Thanks for pointing that out; I thought I was the only one who noticed. 7962 Jul 2014 #49
Letter from Gaza by a Norwegian doctor, "this,THIS cannot continue." RobertEarl Jul 2014 #69
Has DU become hasbera central? broiles Jul 2014 #21
You mean because there are those leftynyc Jul 2014 #27
?? do you mean "Hasbara"? or what do you mean anyway? Sunlei Jul 2014 #30
Great video OF ARTILLERY STRIKES, where is the video of Missile and rocket launching??? happyslug Jul 2014 #29
I watched the video and I did not see any rockets launched from the building either Bjorn Against Jul 2014 #53
And some defend these people. NaturalHigh Jul 2014 #31
That's not really an excuse to bomb the hospital. The Stranger Jul 2014 #32
I agree. Netanyahu is a terrorist, just like cheney.nt bravenak Jul 2014 #33
If your neighbor is christx30 Jul 2014 #37
No big loss? Marrah_G Jul 2014 #101
If your neighbor was christx30 Jul 2014 #104
I think your views are inhumane and lack any compassion Marrah_G Jul 2014 #105
I have compassion. christx30 Jul 2014 #107
The Israeli government is not an animal Marrah_G Jul 2014 #111
What do you think the Israelies should do? christx30 Jul 2014 #118
Are you for real? leftynyc Jul 2014 #39
Believe it. It is not justifiable to blow up a hostpital just because there are rockets in it. The Stranger Jul 2014 #41
Then you agree that the Israel invasion christx30 Jul 2014 #51
So it's perfectly okay leftynyc Jul 2014 #83
Amazing how bad its gotten here, isnt it? 7962 Jul 2014 #50
Beyond comprehension... PCIntern Jul 2014 #121
they were warned by IDF over a week ago SnakeEyes Jul 2014 #80
terrorist fire rockets from hospital RedstDem Jul 2014 #35
Hamas is a bunch of scumbag war criminals, but we knew that.nt geek tragedy Jul 2014 #36
The pro war people must be happy dead_head Jul 2014 #40
They were rocket-propelled bandaids tabasco Jul 2014 #43
The Gaza death toll has now reached 700. According to the UN... countryjake Jul 2014 #52
All they have to do is stop with the rockets and with tunnels question everything Jul 2014 #57
It's not difficult to understand at all... countryjake Jul 2014 #61
If israel's goal is to kill arabs SnakeEyes Jul 2014 #81
Isreal has to be careful, like Hitler was prior to 1941. happyslug Jul 2014 #102
You just equated Jews jerkstore90210 Jul 2014 #115
I made an effort to use Israel for the present Government, and Jews for that nationaity happyslug Jul 2014 #117
I don't think Hamas cares. 840high Jul 2014 #58
I'd guess that they care as much as any people being trompled by a Goliath... countryjake Jul 2014 #62
Are there any palestinians who are AGAINST hamas ? Rhinodawg Jul 2014 #60
I watched a man being interviewed - 840high Jul 2014 #67
55% voted against them in the last election. LeftishBrit Jul 2014 #85
Of course there are. But why are you expecting them to speak up on behalf of Israelis right now? Violet_Crumble Jul 2014 #124
This is the saddest thread ever on DU RobertEarl Jul 2014 #65
One can guarantee with no chance of being wrong cpwm17 Jul 2014 #76
No chance of being wrong? candelista Jul 2014 #137
You seem to have been awfully one sided in this larger debate Nevernose Jul 2014 #141
BS RobertEarl Jul 2014 #145
Trolls rustydad Jul 2014 #68
Propaganda harun Jul 2014 #93
RT is a forbidden, state-sponsored source! JackRiddler Jul 2014 #110
Cognitive dissonance on display. Puzzledtraveller Jul 2014 #119
The footage shows no rockets being fired Scootaloo Jul 2014 #128
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