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dflprincess

(29,182 posts)

44. That's pretty much what the article in the Minneapolis Star Tribune said today

Sat Sep 6, 2014, 09:59 PM

Sep 2014

The Strib's website won't pull up the article but the print edition said: (www.startribune.com)

[div class = "excerpt"]
Proponents of separation say it's a more modern tale. Scotland is a country booming with oil reserves, ready to conduct its own affairs. There's growing frustration among many in the left-of-center country who say the U.K.'s government began moving to the right with the election of Margaret Thatcher and hasn't looked back.

"It's not about teary-eyed Scots yearning for ancient soil, it's about hoping to live in a civilized, caring society and we've given up all hope we can do that with Westminster," said Keith Atichison a retired civil servant. "Our two nations have moved apart."

I feel the Scot's pain. If only there was a way we could escape Reaganism.

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Shock new poll says Scots set to vote yes to independence [View all] muriel_volestrangler Sep 2014 OP

These geniuses we'll learn fast enough what it means to be "independent" Helen Borg Sep 2014 #1

Hmmmmmmmm Dyedinthewoolliberal Sep 2014 #4

well look a t tax revenue from Scotland compared to expenditure in it. whatthehey Sep 2014 #129

why? most countries are independent and the scots are wealthy La Lioness Priyanka Sep 2014 #5

If they vote yes, they'll need every pound of it. DFW Sep 2014 #8

My highland relatives would be ecstatic at this. They were victims of the clearances roguevalley Sep 2014 #11

Clearences? Helen Borg Sep 2014 #29

highland clearances were when the rich asses threw everyone into the snow to take there farms for roguevalley Sep 2014 #30

The clearances were centuries ago, and North Sea oil revenues are forecast to decline 38% by 2017 Spider Jerusalem Sep 2014 #31

perhaps but the past is prologue. human desire to be free is universal. roguevalley Sep 2014 #50

Free from what?? Helen Borg Sep 2014 #57

Free from. sendero Sep 2014 #79

If they have Starbucks and shopping malls... Helen Borg Sep 2014 #81

Good Morning, little miss sunshine! txwhitedove Sep 2014 #91

Which the Scots can't fight against if they stay in the UK. n/t. Ken Burch Sep 2014 #119

Perhaps... However, my bet is... Helen Borg Sep 2014 #121

Probably, in some cases. Ken Burch Sep 2014 #123

Oh, you mean the makers not the takers, Miss Romney? BillZBubb Sep 2014 #151

Please define Dyedinthewoolliberal Sep 2014 #131

really? we wanted free from england with less historica impetus. does that apply to us too? roguevalley Sep 2014 #96

That was a long distance relationship. It was bound to end. Helen Borg Sep 2014 #97

British brutality towards the Irish hasn't faded from our memory riderinthestorm Sep 2014 #112

The Clearances were in the 1880's...130 years is not "centuries ago". Ken Burch Sep 2014 #62

1880s was very much the tail-end of the Clearances - mainly early 19th century muriel_volestrangler Sep 2014 #66

OK-but "centuries ago" implies it was during the Wars of the Roses(or the reign of "Longshanks"). Ken Burch Sep 2014 #68

No, "centuries ago" implies "more than one" (and I meant "late 1700's-early 1800's). Spider Jerusalem Sep 2014 #73

LOL tabasco Sep 2014 #108

Someone can't math, apparently Spider Jerusalem Sep 2014 #110

Near enough to be in living historical memory. Ken Burch Sep 2014 #118

'Living'? No-one has a living memory from the 19th century now muriel_volestrangler Sep 2014 #120

living in the sense of being fresh in the consciousness. Ken Burch Sep 2014 #122

1900 was the last year of the 19th century, not the first year of the 20th century CBGLuthier Sep 2014 #126

A 'basic fact' that has long been disputed muriel_volestrangler Sep 2014 #127

ObviousLy... For matters of this importance... Helen Borg Sep 2014 #23

All sides there agreed that 50% +1 vote would be enough. Ken Burch Sep 2014 #69

We split off from the UK with less than 50% support. former9thward Sep 2014 #35

18th century rural America a month's boat ride from England was slightly different. DFW Sep 2014 #67

Well said... Helen Borg Sep 2014 #95

That would be a great subject to poll on DFW Sep 2014 #106

where did you get that data from? happyslug Sep 2014 #115

Those things are never obvious. former9thward Sep 2014 #116

I think they'll do just fine NV Whino Sep 2014 #9

They deserve to be independent from England. They will have problems but nothing ballyhoo Sep 2014 #27

England will save a lot of money too... Helen Borg Sep 2014 #58

Then whats the problem? jamzrockz Sep 2014 #83

England is not the problem... Helen Borg Sep 2014 #84

England IS the problem, first and foremost! IrishAyes Sep 2014 #105

Southeast English Thatcherism is the precise problem. Ken Burch Sep 2014 #124

Sometimes the pot that simmers longest boils over suddenly. IrishAyes Sep 2014 #136

True. Ken Burch Sep 2014 #140

That's definitely where Harry picked up the term, as I believe he was involved with them earlier. IrishAyes Sep 2014 #144

It will mean finally having the chance to be free of Thatcherism. Ken Burch Sep 2014 #36

That's pretty much what the article in the Minneapolis Star Tribune said today dflprincess Sep 2014 #44

Dunno, Scotland does not seem better Helen Borg Sep 2014 #59

Scotland hasn't had the chance to BE better yet, being essentially powerless. Ken Burch Sep 2014 #61

This is where I disagree with you... Helen Borg Sep 2014 #111

That's just simply not true. The Scandinavian countries for example aren't neoliberal riderinthestorm Sep 2014 #114

Yup, this isn't really about burning historical grudges FarrenH Sep 2014 #74

What is your interest in this? Ken Burch Sep 2014 #63

I bet more than one plantation owner said that in 1865. n/t jtuck004 Sep 2014 #64

Rich will get richer and poor will get poorer. Just like in the U.S. nt valerief Sep 2014 #94

This message was self-deleted by its author Kablooie Sep 2014 #102

Rumblings started when revenue from the North Sea oilfields Warpy Sep 2014 #109

The folks in Eire, The Free Republic of Ireland can tell them all about how truly awesome it is. Zorra Sep 2014 #113

I really don't see a problem here. Keefer Sep 2014 #2

The question most up in the air is the currency they'd use, and who'd control it muriel_volestrangler Sep 2014 #14

They'd be off the EU, I'm afraid. Helen Borg Sep 2014 #24

An independent Scotland wouldn't be able to join the EU for at least five years Spider Jerusalem Sep 2014 #32

It's also possible that the EU could declare that the admission as part of the UK Ken Burch Sep 2014 #45

New country, back to the queue, I'm afraid Helen Borg Sep 2014 #56

No, it's not possible. Spider Jerusalem Sep 2014 #76

Just disappointed JK Rowling PatrynXX Sep 2014 #3

i am more shocked by how polite this whole thing has been. at its worst, it was still better than La Lioness Priyanka Sep 2014 #6

The Kochs don't live in Scotland n/t DFW Sep 2014 #10

Amen! dawn frenzy adams Sep 2014 #17

We're just lucky Donald Trump hasn't used his part-Scottish ancestry Ken Burch Sep 2014 #46

Uh, not so much.. whathehell Sep 2014 #82

FREE SCOTLAND Kalidurga Sep 2014 #7

Go, Scotland. But the states? Scotland didn't choose to be part of the UK and this roguevalley Sep 2014 #12

I have no doubt it would be a big mess if individual states decided to leave the union. Kalidurga Sep 2014 #13

They did choose to be part of the UK, in theory at least muriel_volestrangler Sep 2014 #16

Why? Because it was in the interest of the Scots upper classes to do so. Ken Burch Sep 2014 #47

Made in Scotland: Album celebrates nation's music ahead of independence referendum bananas Sep 2014 #48

the Scots will quickly find that most of Salmond's arguments were hollow, if "yes" wins Spider Jerusalem Sep 2014 #15

They may well keep the pound FarrenH Sep 2014 #75

It's not something they can do if they want to join the EU. Spider Jerusalem Sep 2014 #77

Interesting FarrenH Sep 2014 #87

Except... Spider Jerusalem Sep 2014 #89

Well, yes FarrenH Sep 2014 #92

County to Send Anti-Federal Message by Horseback! elleng Sep 2014 #18

Wrong thread? muriel_volestrangler Sep 2014 #19

No, not wrong thread. elleng Sep 2014 #20

Wouldn't this mean permanent Torry rule in the UK? iandhr Sep 2014 #21

It would certainly increase the chances of Tory governments muriel_volestrangler Sep 2014 #22

The answer would be for Labour to finally do the sane thing and support proportional representation. Ken Burch Sep 2014 #37

First past the post benefits Labour more at the moment muriel_volestrangler Sep 2014 #70

If the English want Tory rule... sendero Sep 2014 #80

We don't want to suffer the consequences Prophet 451 Sep 2014 #86

So a whole country .. sendero Sep 2014 #88

At the moment, a party to the right of the Tories - UKIP - is getting very popular muriel_volestrangler Sep 2014 #90

It will never happen cosmicone Sep 2014 #25

Only if you define 'immigrant' as 'not born in Scotland' muriel_volestrangler Sep 2014 #71

Thanks for the statistics cosmicone Sep 2014 #93

I haven't been following it as closely as I should. mac56 Sep 2014 #26

Problem is, any concessions Westminster could offer would mean diluting Thatcherism. Ken Burch Sep 2014 #38

I hope they stay but best wishes to them. hrmjustin Sep 2014 #28

It's a good thing Scotland is crappy tank country . . . another_liberal Sep 2014 #33

I'm just shocked you haven't accused the Yes movement Blue_Tires Sep 2014 #142

Really? another_liberal Sep 2014 #143

queen enid602 Sep 2014 #34

As someone once put it, "Her Majesty's a pretty nice girl, but she doesn't have a lot to say." n/t. Ken Burch Sep 2014 #39

Would the blue be removed from the Union Jack if this goes through? (nt) Nye Bevan Sep 2014 #40

Yes shaayecanaan Sep 2014 #43

That's the St George's cross plus the Saint Patrick's Saltire. Turborama Sep 2014 #52

Yes, as I just pointed out in my post shaayecanaan Sep 2014 #55

It's shite being Scottish! Adenoid_Hynkel Sep 2014 #41

Still very unlikely it will go through... shaayecanaan Sep 2014 #42

Yes Scotland Scottish weather forecaster loses it live on air Turborama Sep 2014 #49

That is very good. Tthank you.n/t jtuck004 Sep 2014 #65

Excluding the "don't knows?" I wonder how many of those there are? MADem Sep 2014 #51

YouGov was 47% Yes, 45% No, 8% Don't Know muriel_volestrangler Sep 2014 #72

And isn't their polling internet based? MADem Sep 2014 #98

Panelbase is internet-based too (nt) muriel_volestrangler Sep 2014 #99

It is hard to know how solid any of this reporting is. MADem Sep 2014 #100

Well, the 60+ age group responded at above-avarage levels in the YouGov survey muriel_volestrangler Sep 2014 #101

We'll know soon enough--I'm very interested to hear the outcome. nt MADem Sep 2014 #104

Isn't the Bush family involved with the Bank of Scotland? grasswire Sep 2014 #53

If It's Not Scottish, It's Crap!!! U4ikLefty Sep 2014 #54

YouGov is a joke pollster. They've been horrible in every American election BluegrassDem Sep 2014 #60

A subsequent poll (Panelbase) suggests a narrow majority for No LeftishBrit Sep 2014 #78

I think it would be a mistake Prophet 451 Sep 2014 #85

I'll bet Sean Connery is excited. Kablooie Sep 2014 #103

He cares so much about Scotland that he lives in the Bahamas. Spider Jerusalem Sep 2014 #117

Cornwall is feeling its oats as well flamingdem Sep 2014 #107

UK Tory government blinks: New powers for Scotland if voters say No to independence. pampango Sep 2014 #125

Maybe it's time we give Red States the option to vote on their independence 3rdwaydem Sep 2014 #128

In this case it's more like the blue states La Lioness Priyanka Sep 2014 #130

In any event, we should wash our hands of them 3rdwaydem Sep 2014 #132

Dave's pretty upset Bosonic Sep 2014 #133

The only people who would benefit from the split are those who are already wealthy. Nihil Sep 2014 #134

See Krugman's take. geek tragedy Sep 2014 #135

I know he's right!How can Scotland do this without a currency controlled by your government? CTyankee Sep 2014 #139

New poll: another statistical tie muriel_volestrangler Sep 2014 #137

The TNS poll has a huge undecided percentage DavidDvorkin Sep 2014 #138

Latest (phone) poll from ICM: Yes 49%, No 51% muriel_volestrangler Sep 2014 #141

Go Scotland! I blow my nose on you English pig dogs! Baclava Sep 2014 #145

Well, that's a pleasant way to introduce yourself muriel_volestrangler Sep 2014 #146

...another of the Queen's lackeys? - "Scotland forever!" Baclava Sep 2014 #147

Mel Gibson? muriel_volestrangler Sep 2014 #148

William Wallace Baclava Sep 2014 #149

William Wallace eh? Most people really know nothing about him. Adrahil Sep 2014 #150

The betting odds strongly indicate the "NO" side will prevail. BillZBubb Sep 2014 #152