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freshwest

(53,661 posts)
47. I've thought about this myself more than once, Starry. It's maddening.
Wed Oct 1, 2014, 10:07 PM
Oct 2014

I'm wondering if the federal agency that takes up the slack when a company goes bankrupt will do this for CALPERS?

The Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation (PBGC) is an independent agency of the United States government that was created by the Employee Retirement Income Security Act of 1974 (ERISA)
to encourage the continuation and maintenance of voluntary private defined benefit pension plans, provide timely and uninterrupted payment of pension benefits, and keep pension insurance premiums at the lowest level necessary to carry out its operations. Subject to other statutory limitations, the PBGC insurance program pays pension benefits up to the maximum guaranteed benefit set by law to participants who retire at age 65 ($54,000 a year as of 2011).[2] The benefits payable to insured retirees who start their benefits at ages other than 65, or who elect survivor coverage, are adjusted to be equivalent in value.

During fiscal year 2010, the PBGC paid $5.6 billion in benefits to participants of failed pension plans. That year, 147 pension plans failed, and the PBGC's deficit increased 4.5 percent to $23 billion. The PBGC has a total of $102.5 billion in obligations and $79.5 billion in assets...

One reason Congress enacted ERISA was "to prevent the 'great personal tragedy' suffered by employees whose vested benefits are not paid when pension plans are terminated."[19] When a defined benefit plan is properly funded by its sponsor, its assets should be approximately equal to its liability, and any shortfall (including benefit improvements) should be amortized in a relatively short period of time. Before ERISA, employers and willing unions could agree to increase benefits with little thought to how to pay for them. A classic case of the unfortunate consequences of an underfunded pension plan is the 1963 shutdown of Studebaker automobile operations in South Bend, Indiana, in which 4,500 workers lost 85% of their vested benefits.[19] One of ERISA's stated intentions was to minimize underfunding in defined benefit plans.

Defined contribution plans — by contrast and by definition — are always "fully funded." Thus Congress saw no need to provide insurance protection for participants in defined contribution plans. The Enron scandal in 2001 demonstrated one potential problem with defined contribution plans: the company had strongly encouraged its workers to invest their 401(k) plans in their employer itself, violating primary investment guidelines about diversification. When Enron went bankrupt, many workers lost not just their jobs but also most of the value of their retirement savings. Congress inserted trust law fiduciary liability upon employers who did not prudently diversify plan assets to avoid the chance of large losses inside Section 404 of ERISA, but it is unclear whether such fiduciary liability applies to trustees of plans in which participants direct the investment of their own accounts.[3]


More details here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Pension_Benefit_Guaranty_Corporation&printable=yes

The corporation I worked for began to send notices about the PBGC every few quarters a few years ago. After a few hair-rending notices that made me despair of getting a pension, the corporation set up a plan fund the pensions better despite being less profitable than in the past and less revenue to pay future retirees.

They made an offer to invest about $10 billion dollars to make it solvent again, pending approval by the US Department of Labor, as the pensions had been negotiated by union contracts over the years. I will receive my defined benefit plan with regular social security.

I paid in over a thousand a month IRS, FICA, etc, in my peak years, so I consider myself very fortunate for a long time to have that job. The Labor Department then reviewed and accepted the plan and we didn't have to hear about the PBGC again. I hope some provision of ERISA and the PBGC will be able to give those who counted on a CALPERS pension sufficient funds to live on, but suspect if the amount is less than they expected, they may be eligible for California's exchange for healthcare. I haven't read the full page on the PBGC, but there may be a solution there.

An well-known investment firm on Wall St. (boo hiss, huh) handled our pension money but they were careful with it. The company that I worked for was tight as hell in labor negotiations but still did the right thing by those who got disabled or are retired when they took control back from other firms managing the benefit plans. They had contracted them out for a while and they sucked.

I never wanted a government job, they are not as easy as some would make them out to be and really want the folks on CALPERS to get pensions.

Recommendations

0 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

People who have paid in should receive benefits.... pipoman Oct 2014 #1
The investors paid in too. nt Dreamer Tatum Oct 2014 #2
They did, but . . . StatGirl Oct 2014 #6
It's called the law, not a Democratic principle. Dreamer Tatum Oct 2014 #10
Are these the same "investors" that got bailed-out in 2008? KansDem Oct 2014 #12
Obviously not. nt Dreamer Tatum Oct 2014 #13
So no one connected with Wall Street had investments in CALPers? KansDem Oct 2014 #19
investors take a risk CreekDog Oct 2014 #35
except those funds are invested. nt Dreamer Tatum Oct 2014 #41
Hell, let's keep the race to bottom in full throttle! NutmegYankee Oct 2014 #3
You said it, my friend. senseandsensibility Oct 2014 #4
Benefit plans exist to add benefits to working pipoman Oct 2014 #54
Because defined pensions are good for workers, 401Ks good for the thieves that rob workers. n/t jtuck004 Oct 2014 #8
Absolutely! Veilex Oct 2014 #15
If a defined benefit pension obligation can be massively decreased in BK court (like this rulling) kelly1mm Oct 2014 #36
Defined benefits don't prevent stupid business decisions, or indebting your city for more than jtuck004 Oct 2014 #56
My longest stint at any one company (actually the .gov) was 7 years. My pension kelly1mm Oct 2014 #57
But lawyers who wanted to stick their hands in their money wrote in the advantagous terms you jtuck004 Oct 2014 #58
I certainly agree with your last sentence. We truely do live in interesting times! nt kelly1mm Oct 2014 #60
Yeah, no.... pipoman Oct 2014 #53
But I have to live in this reality, where we don't have "...401k, properly managed...". jtuck004 Oct 2014 #55
AT&T still have pensions for their managers and tech's. My husband is under (I think) 5 different Hestia Oct 2014 #66
Had enough yet?! Earth_First Oct 2014 #5
You have no idea what will happen if this ballyhoo Oct 2014 #7
It will stand, and you will see more across the country over the next few years. jtuck004 Oct 2014 #9
This is why the government has wanted to take away ballyhoo Oct 2014 #14
where has the gov't stated... dhill926 Oct 2014 #16
I'll let google handle your question. Pack some ballyhoo Oct 2014 #17
Crackers, Cheez Wiz and a 6 pack of Old Milwaukee ok? dhill926 Oct 2014 #22
You'll need to wear a special hat. enki23 Oct 2014 #46
Yep. WTF? CTyankee Oct 2014 #20
Lets say you are right. Hoppy Oct 2014 #24
I'm a teamster on a withdrawal ballyhoo Oct 2014 #26
I agree there is and will be anger. But there is no place to focus that anger. Hoppy Oct 2014 #29
That's because the 1% work hard to keep the anger focused at the wrong people. NutmegYankee Oct 2014 #31
There are plenty of places for the aggrieved to ballyhoo Oct 2014 #32
"It's a big club, and you ain't in it." RufusTFirefly Oct 2014 #33
Another Detroit to be fleeced and sold to the lowest bidder. blkmusclmachine Oct 2014 #27
Just like they took down other jurisdictions when the same thing happened? Hoppy Oct 2014 #28
Any place else but where it is happening, maybe. The City of Stockton could probably ballyhoo Oct 2014 #34
"...the way a bankrupt retail chain can exit a bad lease at a shopping center. " KansDem Oct 2014 #11
I feel like we're living in 1930's Germany some days. blkmusclmachine Oct 2014 #18
Wow. Ruby the Liberal Oct 2014 #21
That is correct NV Whino Oct 2014 #25
California Public Employes don't pay into social security. They pay into CALPERS, which ballyhoo Oct 2014 #30
You are wrong Fiendish Thingy Oct 2014 #39
You are right. I couldn't find the CALPERS site I ballyhoo Oct 2014 #42
Not true tularetom Oct 2014 #51
Yes. I know. See post 42. ballyhoo Oct 2014 #52
Depends Fiendish Thingy Oct 2014 #38
You are right. I explained in prior post to you. ballyhoo Oct 2014 #43
With Citizens United, a mayor can accept a million dollar campaign contribution in exchange McCamy Taylor Oct 2014 #23
But if the investment company is on the ball Crash2Parties Oct 2014 #62
Cities have been underfunding pensions for years Travis_0004 Oct 2014 #37
Fund the Pensions and Use a Reasonable Rate of Return on Investments branford Oct 2014 #50
It's wage theft. Starry Messenger Oct 2014 #40
Exactly. But that may not work right now-- ballyhoo Oct 2014 #44
I know, we need to light a fire under some asses for this round. Starry Messenger Oct 2014 #45
I've thought about this myself more than once, Starry. It's maddening. freshwest Oct 2014 #47
The answer is no. former9thward Oct 2014 #61
This makes me sick A Little Weird Oct 2014 #48
We are retired on calpers marlakay Oct 2014 #49
I have been paying into Pers for onecaliberal Oct 2014 #59
Why is there a bankruptcy? seabeckind Oct 2014 #63
This must be for future retirees Fiendish Thingy Oct 2014 #64
The "people" get the shaft again. nt ladjf Oct 2014 #65
We have to start calling pensions "deferred compensation" yurbud Oct 2014 #67
Latest Discussions»Latest Breaking News»CalPERS gets dreaded deci...»Reply #47